Tagged With "IOS"

Topic

Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

nbpf ·
The idea of this thread is to collect some feedback on applications that can act as control point for UPnP (DLNA, OpenHome, etc.) renderers. I am particularly interested in applications which are compatible with different renderers, are well supported and documented and have been ported at least to iOS and Android.
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Re: Artwork Disappearing

Mike-B ·
I had something similar a few month ago. Problem is I'm not sure what fixed it as I re-indexed the NAS (Synology DS214) & cleared both app cache's, whatever it was its not returned.
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Re: Artwork Disappearing

NigelS ·
OK, did think about clearing cache but as issue is same on iPhone & iPad was assuming that shouldn't be the cause. What do you mean by re-indexing the NAS. How would I do that?
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Re: Artwork Disappearing

Mike-B ·
OK I agree on the cache diagnostic, but no harm to do it periodically whatever To reindex - open the Synology web page > Control Panel > Media Indexing > Re-Index button It takes a few minutes, but leave it to complete Also while you are in your Syn web page, if you are using the Synology "Media Server", check that the following is the same as .......................... Media Server > Browser Settings > Check (tick) "Display Cover Image for Audio Files" box & make sure the...
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Re: Artwork Disappearing

NigelS ·
OK, Great. Thanks. Will give this a try.
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Re: Broken tracks in Naim App playlists

Silence Kills ·
I just ripped a new CD and added it to the Minimserver folder and rescanned it. Now the playlist is broken. What is the purpose of playlists if they break every time I add new music and rescan it?
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Re: Broken tracks in Naim App playlists

Silence Kills ·
Any updates from the Naim side on this? (Last post from simoncn): http://forum.minimserver.com/s...p;pid=15911#pid15911
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Re: Broken tracks in Naim App playlists

ChrisSU ·
Do you back up your iOS device to a computer with iTunes? If so, you should be able to restore the app, with its settings and playlists, from the last iTunes backup, depending on how recent this is. Obviously it would be better if the app didn't break in the first place, but it might restore your lost playlists.
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Re: Broken tracks in Naim App playlists

Silence Kills ·
Does anyone know how to solve this problem? e.g. by using another UPnP Server? It would be nice if Naim fixes its App, if this is already fixed in Minimserver.
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

nbpf ·
Short update: Linn Kazoo does recognize the upmpdcli renderer if this is turned into an OpenHome renderer via BubbleUPnP Server.
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

Eloise ·
The Naim app only works with Naim streamers. The Linn Kazoo app needs an OpenHome compatible renderer. Try installing BubbleUPnPServer which will create a "proxy" OpenHome renderer from any UPnP server. (Though as Lunin works upmpdcli is already working as an OpenHome renderer so I'm not sure). As a PS. Are you sure you need upmpdcli now: I thought UPnP renderer capability had been integrated into mpd.
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

nbpf ·
Oh, this is a bit disappointing! Any obvious reasons why this is so? Thanks, nbpf
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

Simon-in-Suffolk ·
Trying to think of the best answer to this... The Naim app is specific to and designed to control the Naim streamers and streaming devices... I suppose if somebody made a streamer that worked like a Naim streamer the Naim app might work with that Streamer... Simon
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

nbpf ·
I do not know. If http://www.lesbonscomptes.com/pages/mpd-upnp.html is what you are referring to, than I'm not sure this is a viable approach for me. My main motivation for installing Minimserver and upmpdcli was to be able to take advantage of proper tagging of my data and of Minimserver's support for custom tags and "intelligent browsing". If I were to make MPD a client of Minimserver (in contrast to making MPD an engine of upmpdcli) I would have to rely on MPD clients for searching and...
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

nbpf ·
I very much hope that the Naim app is specific to the Naim streamers and works particularly well with them. But this does not necessarily imply that it cannot honour UPnP or other specifications. I understand that UPnP is poorly specified and I am not making any specific criticism. I'm just wondering why Linn and Lumin work (almost) perfectly and the Naim app does not even get to see the renderer, not even if one manually sets the correct IP address: not very cooperative ...
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

Eloise ·
I think the crux of it is that Linn took the UPnP spec and decided to make is better (eventually renaming it OpenHome). The big limitation to standard UPnP which Linn looked to overcome was that playback was controlled by the control point where OpenHome introduced the concept of a playlist stored on the player - this allowed multiple control points to view and edit the playlist and enabled the control point to be turned off once the playback had been started. By contrast with non-OpenHome...
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

Simon-in-Suffolk ·
The original UPnP specification allows for the media to pushed to or pulled from the renderer... and also allows multiple control points... So nothing new in this regard fromOpenHome here......... there is so much mis information on UPnP. It is simply a set of procedures or methods and a protocol that can be used by Application software.. The core UPnP specification is very very flexible which is why profiles such as DLNA profiles and possibly OpenHome have been created that arguably limit...
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

nbpf ·
Thanks for the very interesting comments and explanations Eloise! I hadn't realized that standard UPnP does not store the playlist on the player, now it is clear why mconnect does not support gapless replay with upmpdcli whereas Linn Kinsky and Lumin do. It's a bit disappointing that the Naim app does not support the OpenHome protocol, I had fancied buying a Qb for the kitchen at a certain point ... But the Lumin app works very well with upmpdcli and fully supports Minimserver. Thanks again...
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

Eloise ·
I'm not sure I agree with this statement Simon ... surely if it was a UPnP control point it could control other UPnP renderers ... which it can't. The Naim app is the same as apps from Pioneer and Marantz in that they tell the streamer what files to get from the server. If it was a true UPnP control point it would be telling the server what files to send to the renderer.
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

Eloise ·
If you want to use an OpenHome control point with a Naim renderer, then you can setup BubbleUPnPServer which presents a OpenHome compliant proxy to the control point and serves the music to any UPnP renderer that way.
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

nbpf ·
Thanks, Eloise, I'll keep in mind this possibility! The next step for me is to finalize adding "work", "conductor" and "orchestra/ensemble" tags to the collection. At the same time I am looking for a iOS control point that does not display irrelevant information, just the 'indexTags' values I have set in Minimserver's configuration. Best, nbpf
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

nbpf ·
Quite informative wrap-up and short assessment of the advantages and disadvantages of Apple, Squeeze, MPD, UPnP/DLNA and OpenHome streaming approaches, written by the main author of upmpdcli: http://www.lesbonscomptes.com/...t-audio.html#ohmedia
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

Simon-in-Suffolk ·
Eloise, not at all, there is no requirement for a DLNA/UPnP control point to generically control DLNA/UPnP renderers, which is why there are so many profiles. Even Sonos uses UPnP to control its devices. But If you conform to a UPnP subset profile, then yes you would expect interoperability with other devices conforming to that specific profile. What you describe is just the UPnP media server push method, a true UPnP controller can equally use the renderer pull method, which is the mode that...
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

nbpf ·
Simon, does this imply that the Naim app should not be able to discover upmpdcli?
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Re: Naim app and upmpdcli (or the other way round)

Simon-in-Suffolk ·
Hi, from what I can see upmdcli is a software UPnP renderer.. now the Naim app will be looking for Naim devices in its renderer discovery routines (streamers, Muso etc) .. so almost certainly it will see the upmdcli respond to the Naim app controller discovery requests but I would expect the Naim app to disregard everything other than valid Naim devices. Simon
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Re: Broken tracks in Naim App playlists

Kurt L ·
I use Minimserver. Although, I got the same problem with other UPnP servers as well. The playlist always gets broken as from the moment I add an album and let Minimserver reindex. Storing the playlist on my NAS indeed solves solves the problem (works after reindexing), but makes the playlist creation feature in the Naim app pretty useless .... This is really pitty, as creating a playlist in the app is faster/more convenient then creating it manually and store in on my NAS. I hope this get fixed.
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

Eloise ·
I may have used the wrong (or a different term) for what BubbleUPnPServer does. I use a single Linux box (VortexBox with stuff added for my own needs) with MinimServer and BubbleUPnPServer. BubbleUPnPServer sees my two renderers (the Naim and the Marantz) and creates an OpenHome Renderer instance for each. Just ticked the relevant box and Kazoo then sees them fine. Its the renderer that needs to be recognised as OpenHome renderer rather than the server by the way. MinimServer works with...
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

nbpf ·
Thanks for the additional details Eloise! I am indeed using upmpdcli with MPD. I have also tried making upmpdcli an OpenHome renderer with BubbleUPnPServer but still Kazoo does not seem to recognize it. As you mention, there are documented issues with Kazoo and upmpdcli. But I was hoping that Kazoo would at least recognize Minimserver. It is conceivable that Kazoo first attempts at discovering a renderer and then a server and that, if the first operation fails, it never gets to discover the...
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

nbpf ·
Thanks to all posters, I very much appreciated your feedback! It looks like many of us are relying on different control point applications and there are still quite severe compatibility problems. Hopefully we will see some convergence and more interoperability and customizability in the next years. Best, nbpf
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

gert ·
Yes, I 2nd this. What BubbleUPnP does better than the naim app is also: display track times in library view display track times in playlist view do UPnP search across the whole server display more meta data if you enter a folder (at least in folder view; I did not check other lists) with the naim app and then return back to the parent folder, the folder you were in scrolls out of view approximately one page down or more. The naim app does not give you feedback of the volume level when...
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

nbpf ·
If I have not misunderstood Eloise's post, you could use BubbleUPnPServer to turn your Naim streamer into an OpenHome renderer. At this point you could control your Naim streamer with BubbleUPnP.
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

gert ·
This is correct. But BubbleUPnPServer still controls the playlist from outside the naim streamer. At least in former firmware versions of the uniti this could break the playing of a next track, so the streamer stopped playing or repeated the same track again. This often happend with short tracks that have a length of just some seconds. Very often it did work fine, but sometimes not. With newer firmware versions the uniti became faster and more robust. I did not try to play longer playlists...
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

nbpf ·
Thanks gert! I very much agree that introducing another server on the top of an approach already requiring three programs running on three different devices is not what one would like to do: it took me about two years (and discovering that Minimserver supports browsing classical music collections much better than MPD) to move away from a pure MPD solution with only a server and a client. I also agree that it would be good if Naim would embrace OpenHome. Ideally, one would expect Linn, Naim,...
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

nbpf ·
I have played a little bit around with BubbleUPnP in a tablet shop since I do not have an Android device at home to test the application. One very annoying thing was that I was not able to get rid of all the "Cloud", "Google Music", "Google Drive", "Dropbox" etc. icons in the "Library" menu. Am I missing something? Isn't it possible to switch off all the stuff that one does not need and get a clean UI in BubbleUPnP?
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

gert ·
I do not know if you can disable all the icons. But they only occur if choosing the local media server that is spawned by bubble upnp itself. Normally you are connecting to your NAS's server so you do not see these icons.
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

nbpf ·
Thanks James, it is probably a problem between upmpdcli and Kinsky. No matter which UPnP server I select, cover art is displayed fine everywhere except in the upper left corner. With Lumin, everything works fine. Best, nbpf
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

Dave***t ·
For playing Upnp, +1. Bubble does a number of things better than the android Naim app. Miles more stable, allows hardware button volume control, has a mini widget accessible from the top of screen drop down menu and lock screen, displays now playing artwork on the lock screen, stays connected to the renderer when the Android device goes to sleep. I believe it can also do things like link up with lyric finding software, though I haven't tried it. Overall far better than the Naim app, which...
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

Graham Russell ·
I use Kinsky, Kazoo and BubbleDS Next Gives me great control from laptop, phone and tablets
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

Eloise ·
Primarily use Naim app (on iPhone 6+ or iPad Air2) for my UnitiQute, sometimes Linn Kazoo on laptop as alternative. Lumin app or Linn Kazoo to control Marantz M-CR510 in bedroom. iPeng to control Squeezebox Receiver in the bathroom. (BubbleUPnPServer to create OpenHome proxy for when using Lumin or Kazoo).
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

Bert Schurink ·
Naim app, controlling Twonky and Asset...
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

Bananahead ·
I don't use any app for any renderer.
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

nbpf ·
Eloise, for which UPnP server do you create an OpenHome proxy via BubbleUPnPServer? I am running 2 instances of Minimserver, one on a Debian system and one on a Raspberry Pi. They both get recognized by Lumin without the need to run BubbleUPnPServer. And they both do not get recognized by Kazoo (4.8.927 for iOS) no matter whether I create an OpenHome proxy via BubbleUPnPServer or not! Best, nbpf
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

nbpf ·
Bananahead, do you run a UPnP renderer without a control point or aren't you using any renderer? Best, nbpf
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

tom539 ·
Use JRiver Media Center on Raspberry Pi with symbolic-links to the files on Synolgy NAS. JRemote on iPad to control with several custom-views for the libary. JRemote Is now also in PlayStore for Android. Verry stable and cheap. Naim-APP only for Tidal with crashes every time I use it...
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

Bananahead ·
I use the front panel of my NDX. I use the built in control - displayed on TV - for my Arcam system. However, I use MediaMonkey to build playlists so very rarely do I feel a need for a lot of button presses. If MediaMonkey wasn't so flaky as a control point then I would probably use that.
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

Simon-in-Suffolk ·
I use Naim app for main system, PlugPlayer for tablet and phone playout and the Sonos app. Media servers I use are Asset, Minimserver (running on their own micro servers -RPi) and a Sonos Connect server Simon
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Re: Which applications do you mostly use to control your UPnP renderer?

nbpf ·
A question to BubbleUPnP users: does BubbleUPnP supports displaying the liner notes of an album? This works very nicely with MPaD (an MPD client for iOS) and can be easily implemented on a laptop running mpc (another MPD client) but I am not aware of any UPnP control point for iOS supporting this quite fundamental feature. Thanks, nbpf
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