A short story which is also a quasi goodbye post

I have always experienced that I can enjoy music in multiple type of setups. From cheap and easy to the most expensive setup. I would argue that I am listening to a lot of music I wouldn’t listen to when I wouldn’t have my Naim setup. So my system has opened up my horizon. And yes sometimes it gives a good feel to have the right level of noise, reflections etc of a mediocre setup....as opposed to my more controlled Naim sound

Max your post get's us right into the heart of this hobby and it's real purpose which of course is to take us to that very personal and individual place that music can take us.  Depending on the circumstances and the emotions and even the day a mobile phone with a half decent set of in ear headphones can take us to that place as well or sometimes even better than a £10,000 Hifi system.  

IMO there are two things at work here first and very importantly you expect nothing of a mobile phone and headphones and so when it takes you to that place so unexpectantly it is a beautiful thing but then when you are standing in front of those very expensive black boxes you are expecting something very special to come from those great big speakers and when it does not for whatever reason it can be horrible and frustrating and spoil the very thing it is supposed to be enhancing.

Secondly it is all about mood, music should be an emotional experience and the mood we are in can effect that emotional response that is why mood altering substances can and do enhance music so depending on the mood we are in the way in which we replay music can be of little consequence listen to music on an expensive Hifi in the wrong mood and it won't be good but listen to it in the right mood and the level of system sometimes doesn't matter.

Let us be very honest with ourselves for most of us owning Naim Audio equipment is as much about pride of ownership as it is about SQ.

Bob the Builder posted:

Let us be very honest with ourselves for most of us owning Naim Audio equipment is as much about pride of ownership as it is about SQ.

That is a very interesting suggestion/belief. I wonder how much truth others will see in it in relation to themselves...

Maybe that's the reason I'm not a Naim owner.     (Pride of ownership is not something in which I generally indulge, in anything.)

Max_B posted:

Corry: Thanks, I think I understand the 'Nait or 552' perfectly well having owned a Nait many years ago and being occasionally exposed to a 552 at a friend's. I'll never reach 552 level because: 1) it would mean equal ancillaries, 2) I believe that the problem is inherent in audio between six walls, c) the idea of Digital Room Treatment is more accessible perhaps. But it's a little like I wrote a long rant saying that I had found a €3 wine much better than a €40 one, and you suggest me trying a €1500 bottle... Or simply imply its benefits. I know the 552, but I don't include it in the category of preamplifiers but rather among that of controlled substances.

Max,

The “€3 wine vs €40 wine” is something I can relate to, in that there’s a certain amount of expectation and stress present with the more expensive wine that just isn’t there with the cheaper one. More and more with things like wine, I find myself looking for the sweet spot – something that’s just good enough to be enjoyable, rather than the absolute best I can afford. I’m not sure how far that analogy applies with hi-fi (for me), as I seem to be on a quest for the most transcendent listening experience available, within my (partially) self-imposed restrictions.

I realise that I may be romanticising the 552, but there’s only one way for me to put that to rest. And (of course) another option that may emerge after I take that step might be something like “Wow, this sounds great … but I bet it’ll be just amazing when I upgrade <power amp, speakers, cables>, etc.” But I know that there are limits to my hi-fi aspirations – e.g. I have no interest in enormous full-range speakers, nor do I aspire to an active system – so I remain hopeful that a satisfactory end point is within reach. And there would be an incidental bonus: If I exchange my 282 for a 552, I get rid of the NAPSC: in NaimWorld, it’s not often that you can make a major upgrade while reducing your box count.

Best,

C

nigelb posted:

Max, I have enjoyed reading your posts over the years and I must say, as a non-native English speaker (I assume), your grasp of our complex language is admirable. I am so glad to read you intend to continue to contribute to this fine forum and thoughtful, well written posts from contributors such as yourself makes this place a valuable and rewarding corner of my world.

It is also refreshing to read controversial and provocative points of view such as yours. I admire those who just say it as it is for them no matter how 'at odds' it appears from the mainstream view. To make all of us stop and just think about what it is we want from music in the home and how capable our systems really are in delivering what it is we really seek is a valuable wake up call that all of us (well I) need from time to time

Good luck and I sincerely hope you overcome your health issues. Keep posting, please.

What can I say? Thanks, indeed. I am happy to contribute to discussion and controversial topics have been the love of my life – audio and women being the two major available. Listen, I am being serious. Who knows me a little personally or on these 'pages' knows that I will never leave Naim or the forum; I am a sort of specular HH – I rarely have ready, informed and reliable answers; I am specialized in doubts and de-constructing questions. But here I am, with a mild shock induced by an unlikely comparison. I'll sort it without disappearing, or making my system disappear.

Best

M.

Corry posted:
Max_B posted:

Corry: Thanks, I think I understand the 'Nait or 552' perfectly well having owned a Nait many years ago and being occasionally exposed to a 552 at a friend's. I'll never reach 552 level because: 1) it would mean equal ancillaries, 2) I believe that the problem is inherent in audio between six walls, c) the idea of Digital Room Treatment is more accessible perhaps. But it's a little like I wrote a long rant saying that I had found a €3 wine much better than a €40 one, and you suggest me trying a €1500 bottle... Or simply imply its benefits. I know the 552, but I don't include it in the category of preamplifiers but rather among that of controlled substances.

Max,

The “€3 wine vs €40 wine” is something I can relate to, in that there’s a certain amount of expectation and stress present with the more expensive wine that just isn’t there with the cheaper one. More and more with things like wine, I find myself looking for the sweet spot – something that’s just good enough to be enjoyable, rather than the absolute best I can afford. I’m not sure how far that analogy applies with hi-fi (for me), as I seem to be on a quest for the most transcendent listening experience available, within my (partially) self-imposed restrictions.

I realise that I may be romanticising the 552, but there’s only one way for me to put that to rest. And (of course) another option that may emerge after I take that step might be something like “Wow, this sounds great … but I bet it’ll be just amazing when I upgrade <power amp, speakers, cables>, etc.” But I know that there are limits to my hi-fi aspirations – e.g. I have no interest in enormous full-range speakers, nor do I aspire to an active system – so I remain hopeful that a satisfactory end point is within reach. And there would be an incidental bonus: If I exchange my 282 for a 552, I get rid of the NAPSC: in NaimWorld, it’s not often that you can make a major upgrade while reducing your box count.

Best,

C

Corry,

a member here, Roberto, [this is not a secret, is it R...?] has a full 500 system: CDP555, 2 x 555PS, 552, Nap500, S-600 and – so far – a SuperLumina IC from CDP to the controlled substance. I've listened to his system a number of times, discovering interesting things, one of which is that certain types of music or songs reveal their reason of being and emotional power at very high volumes.

The 552 is no doubt a sensational product, it takes Naim to have the nerve to build a preamplifier that instead of doing what 98% of top-end preamps do – marrying detail with smoothness, something that doesn't exist in real music, if you expose yourself to it closely – just gives you everything that is mechanically possible to extract from the CD in an awful way (meaning good) as far as dynamics, force, coherence, grip to life and energy are involved. I admire it enormously, even though I only hear it at Roberto's, whose musical taste is not always very close to mine, and who seems to have the ears of an elephant because he digests and controls sound pressure levels probably able to kill bacteria. I doubt I'll ever have one; but even if I had one, the problem would remain that I am now sure – the simple phone/earplugs test has proved it to me – that the greatest electronics in the world will always need the greatest speaker placement in the world and professional room acoustics to obtain what can be obtained, in terms of completeness of information and immersion in the experience, from a good MP3 on a good phone and good plugs in the ears. Even on a crowded train.

My very best

max

Monkadill posted:
Max_B posted:

Sorry, wind up has too many meanings and I couldn't translate what you mean for sure. Would you mind being more explicit?

Thanks

Max

Wind up = a joke

Ok, thanks. I though it was something like it but I feared it had a negative connotation.

M

Innocent Bystander posted:
Bob the Builder posted:

Let us be very honest with ourselves for most of us owning Naim Audio equipment is as much about pride of ownership as it is about SQ.

That is a very interesting suggestion/belief. I wonder how much truth others will see in it in relation to themselves...

Maybe that's the reason I'm not a Naim owner.     (Pride of ownership is not something in which I generally indulge, in anything.)

If there's any truth in Bob's assertion I'm guessing it probably applies just as much to owners of niche/expensive items, be they cars, cameras, works of art, bottles of expensive wine......the list is endless.

Just a thought - does or can pride of ownership exist if you're truly alone, or does it rely upon others knowing of your ownership? I ask simply because none of my friends are interested in 'hifi', have never heard of Naim and are horrified by the prospect of anyone owning a system worth more than the average family car. I enjoy most of the products I own (I'd have to be pretty stupid to buy anything that didn't bring me pleasure), am grateful for having the means to indulge in my hobbies, but 'pride'? I don't think so.

Well I'm an honest type and I for one will hold my hands up and say I do have 'pride' in ownership of my Naim system and it is a pride I feel all to myself.  I do not know what else you would call it really I have worked very hard to achieve what I have and that includes my possessions and I feel proud of what I have achieved.  Why would I only feel grateful I would probably feel grateful if the things I have achieved were solely down to luck but they are not they are the fruits of very hard work not luck.

Do I feel bad that not everyone who works as hard as me can afford a Naim stereo?  Yes I do it is wrong but that does not mean it is wrong to feel proud.  Maybe I am wrong I know I cannot speak for others and maybe it is only myself who feels proud terrible, shallow person that I am.

Pride does sound rather negative, and of course it’s one of the seven deadly sins. I do like having nice things, like a good hand built sofa, or a Miele fridge freezer. They are good solid things that are well made and built to last. Naim is not well known and hardly anyone who visits us knows what it is and therefore they don’t pass comment, other than to say ‘this sounds nice’ if they get to listen to music. I bought a decent watch last year and was saying to the woman in the shop that I didn’t want anything ostentatious. She told me that there was no need to worry as nobody ever notices them, and having worn it every day for nearly a year nobody has ever made a comment. I bought it because it’s really nice. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

Pride does sound rather negative, and of course it’s one of the seven deadly sins. I do like having nice things, like a good hand built sofa, or a Miele fridge freezer. They are good solid things that are well made and built to last. Naim is not well known and hardly anyone who visits us knows what it is and therefore they don’t pass comment, other than to say ‘this sounds nice’ if they get to listen to music. I bought a decent watch last year and was saying to the woman in the shop that I didn’t want anything ostentatious. She told me that there was no need to worry as nobody ever notices them, and having worn it every day for nearly a year nobody has ever made a comment. I bought it because it’s really nice. 

Yes but do you feel proud to own such nice things? Pride born of hard graft and sacrifice is totally different to say pride born from things that were given or were inherited. If I worked very hard from humble beginngs and felt pride at the house I lived in because of my hard work that is fine IMO. If I inherited a lot of money or won the lottery or some other good fortune and were prideful about the watch I wore or the stereo I owned because of that good fortune then that just makes me a Tory! 

Bob the Builder posted:
Hungryhalibut posted:

Pride does sound rather negative, and of course it’s one of the seven deadly sins. I do like having nice things, like a good hand built sofa, or a Miele fridge freezer. They are good solid things that are well made and built to last. Naim is not well known and hardly anyone who visits us knows what it is and therefore they don’t pass comment, other than to say ‘this sounds nice’ if they get to listen to music. I bought a decent watch last year and was saying to the woman in the shop that I didn’t want anything ostentatious. She told me that there was no need to worry as nobody ever notices them, and having worn it every day for nearly a year nobody has ever made a comment. I bought it because it’s really nice. 

Yes but do you feel proud to own such nice things? Pride born of hard graft and sacrifice is totally different to say pride born from things that were given or were inherited. If I worked very hard from humble beginngs and felt pride at the house I lived in because of my hard work that is fine IMO. If I inherited a lot of money or won the lottery or some other good fortune and were prideful about the watch I wore or the stereo I owned because of that good fortune then that just makes me a Tory! 

"makes me a Tory!" and there is the agenda..

 

Hungryhalibut posted:

Pride does sound rather negative, and of course it’s one of the seven deadly sins. I do like having nice things, like a good hand built sofa, or a Miele fridge freezer. They are good solid things that are well made and built to last. Naim is not well known and hardly anyone who visits us knows what it is and therefore they don’t pass comment, other than to say ‘this sounds nice’ if they get to listen to music. I bought a decent watch last year and was saying to the woman in the shop that I didn’t want anything ostentatious. She told me that there was no need to worry as nobody ever notices them, and having worn it every day for nearly a year nobody has ever made a comment. I bought it because it’s really nice. 

Therein lies the difference. My brother-in-law, who could be the person upon whom Harry Enfield based his Tory Boy, was bought a Rolex by his wife last year. We met them for lunch soon after, not knowing of his acquisition. After much ostentatious cuff shuffling and checking the time (which just made me think he'd forgotten to set up to record something at home!), he was eventually forced to ask us what we thought of his watch! The poor bugger was bursting with 'pride', which I found rather sad. 

Maybe it's semantics, but whilst I often feel happy, satisfied, pleased, excited, anticipatory etc...with 'things', I can honestly say pride doesn't enter the equation. Like, I suspect, the majority of us ,I also have worked hard for everything I own. The gratefulness I feel is for the good fortune which has put me in the position of being able to acquire a satisfying, relatively well paid job that has given me all the trappings I enjoy - parents, home, education etc. Not everyone is lucky enough to have a solid life platform upon which to build. Hence grateful.

Timmo1341 posted:
Hungryhalibut posted:

Pride does sound rather negative, and of course it’s one of the seven deadly sins. I do like having nice things, like a good hand built sofa, or a Miele fridge freezer. They are good solid things that are well made and built to last. Naim is not well known and hardly anyone who visits us knows what it is and therefore they don’t pass comment, other than to say ‘this sounds nice’ if they get to listen to music. I bought a decent watch last year and was saying to the woman in the shop that I didn’t want anything ostentatious. She told me that there was no need to worry as nobody ever notices them, and having worn it every day for nearly a year nobody has ever made a comment. I bought it because it’s really nice. 

Therein lies the difference. My brother-in-law, who could be the person upon whom Harry Enfield based his Tory Boy, was bought a Rolex by his wife last year. We met them for lunch soon after, not knowing of his acquisition. After much ostentatious cuff shuffling and checking the time (which just made me think he'd forgotten to set up to record something at home!), he was eventually forced to ask us what we thought of his watch! The poor bugger was bursting with 'pride', which I found rather sad. 

Maybe it's semantics, but whilst I often feel happy, satisfied, pleased, excited, anticipatory etc...with 'things', I can honestly say pride doesn't enter the equation. Like, I suspect, the majority of us ,I also have worked hard for everything I own. The gratefulness I feel is for the good fortune which has put me in the position of being able to acquire a satisfying, relatively well paid job that has given me all the trappings I enjoy - parents, home, education etc. Not everyone is lucky enough to have a solid life platform upon which to build. Hence grateful.

Spot on Timmo they are not all so lucky some of us were raised by violent drinkers whose idea of education was a back hander and so left school at 16 to 'work' for a living and pay their way.  This isn't the best foundation and leads to quite a few wasted years and so when you manage to finally pull yourself together to have a reasonable life you do feel a sense of pride at owning things like Naim stereo's you never believed possible but also have the self awareness to own such feelings for what they are because guilt does not come into it.

I sometimes forget when I make statements what forum I'm on.

Interesting turn here on this thread: Timmo's story is at once amusing and in a sense pathetic (not Timmo, but his B-I-L). I have engaged a bit in similar behavior (rarely) in my life, and always afterward I look back and think what a lame display of insecurity it represents. And ironically, I can be impressed by a watch, but a Rolex is never one to do it for me...I don't care about the price, I want it to look good, and of course, function well.

If there is a "pride of ownership" regarding Naim, for me it doesn't have anything to do with the cost of owning a truly fine audio system. The "pride" (which as Nigel correctly points out, carries a negative connotation) for me is in knowing I have purchased a really excellent, quality product that does really well what I want it to do. My friends do not know Naim (especially being in the USA) and I actually avoid talking about the cost in many cases, unless I am really close to the person.

Indeed, I wish it did NOT cost so dearly to have such. I am an inveterate cheapskate in many areas - when you grow up with 5 kids (including a "special needs" kid, which is probably equal to 2+ regular kids) in a limited income situation you learn such. So none of my "pride" is based on that. Agreeing again with Nigel it comes down to having nice things; albeit for me, limited to the things that are important to me. The only "nice" furniture I have is that which I inherited from my mother when she passed; the rest is just functional, and I figure if I ever marry again that will likely all get changed anyway so why spend a lot? But in audio gear, guitars, and ice hockey equipment I go for the "best"...largely because doing so means I no longer have to worry and wonder about it performing as it should.

Of course, the discussion of 'pride' in an object is down to semantics, and we may not all take it to mean exactly the same thing - and BtB's statement regarding himself suggests not pride of ownership of Naim gear per se, but seeing it as a symbol that embodies pride in having made something of his life despite a distinctly unpriviledges start - which Indeed I think is oneplace where pride is well placed (assuming that other more important things are satisfactory first)..

As for lottery wins making one a Tory, I do the lottery occasionally, because that is the only way I could ever afford some of the out-and-out extravagent things that it is nice, occasionally, to dream of before returning to one's reality... as for politics, that is not a subject I readily get into discussing in casual conversation because inevitably someone makes it get unpleasant, but I do like the epithet Edgar Broughton applies to himself: 'I lean to the left, trying to do what's right'.

Hifi heaven is two turntables.  a high quality rotary phono mixer stage. a high quality head amp and high quality phones.    Short of a mega super club sound system - will this be beaten.

And of course a fxxxton load of records and the time to run through them all.  

TOBYJUG posted:

Hifi heaven is two turntables.  a high quality rotary phono mixer stage. a high quality head amp and high quality phones.    Short of a mega super club sound system - will this be beaten.

And of course a fxxxton load of records and the time to run through them all.  

Some old beaten-up Altec A7's and BGW 750 amps could also do the trick with ''smoke on the water'' 

Life’s too short to worry about audio. Either enjoy music on the kit you have, or if you can afford it, buy the kit you want. Don’t let other people’s opinions - and in particular those expressed (mostly anonymously) here or on other forums - get you down.

Also, absense really does make the heart grow fonder. Have not been able to enjoy music for several days due a bad head cold with blocked up ears. Am just now able to hear clearly again, and can’t wait to spin some records this evening while Mrs. Hook is at a neighborhood ladies gathering. Am sure it will sound wonderful!

TOBYJUG posted:

Hifi heaven is two turntables.  a high quality rotary phono mixer stage. a high quality head amp and high quality phones.    Short of a mega super club sound system - will this be beaten.

And of course a fxxxton load of records and the time to run through them all.  

I presume you mean that club in London that uses a pair of Tannoy Westminster Royals... 

I am bemused whenever I read on here of hifi equipment being referred to as a 'hobby'. Surely, it's all about the music. The only reason we buy this stuff is to enjoy the music. The only reason we upgrade stuff is to get that bit closer to the music. If it doesn't sound more like real instruments played by real people, then we shouldn't bother. It's the music that matters, regardless of what equipment is used for replay.

I wouldn't say I have a sense of pride about my system though it pleases me and I certainly enjoy discussing the merits etc with other enthusiasts. Of course, the vast majority of 'normal' people aren't really interested in hi-fi and even those who are won't necessarily know Naim.  I must confess to being a bit sheepish if discussions with other people turn to music and I'm asked about what I use to play it. I'm very much aware that to most people having eight black boxes just to play a CD must seem ridiculous. And I certainly avoid questions about cost because the answer is even more ridiculous!  

I'm with Hook, I appreciate my system most when I've had an absence from it. When I get home, kick back and turn it on I'm often stunned by how good it sounds. I absolutely agree that what is available now for modest sums can be every bit as engaging and interesting, but I do love the impact of a loudspeaker system. Music is part physical with me, not just mental and with cans I can't share it with others.

Max, take a break from the high end, but please not from the forum. Yours is one of the most interesting voices on here. You have a unique mind and unique use of language that I admire.

Clive B posted:

I am bemused whenever I read on here of hifi equipment being referred to as a 'hobby'. Surely, it's all about the music. The only reason we buy this stuff is to enjoy the music. The only reason we upgrade stuff is to get that bit closer to the music. If it doesn't sound more like real instruments played by real people, then we shouldn't bother. It's the music that matters, regardless of what equipment is used for replay.

Clive,

You are completely wrong, otherwise all the wise guys (ryhms?) here who are so busy splitting audiophile hairs would bother to post on the Music Room to share and learn something about the music.  Max is one of the very few here who gives us from time to time a reality check.

Haim

And to add to Haim's comment, when I worked in the audio store (a Naim dealer), there were definitely those who were only hi-fi enthusiasts; I swear they never played more than a minute of a song (or so it seemed). "Listen to that cymbal there..." And undoubtedly there are more than a few on the forum that to one degree or another are in that group. It doesn't make it wrong, it is simply a different way of approaching hi-fi, although not one I really comprehend.

As someone posted here a while back the quote attributed to Alan Parsons: "Audiophiles don't use their equipment to listen to your music. Audiophiles use your music to listen to their equipment."

And to swing full oval back to Max's original post, Parsons himself feels that room interactions are more important than equipment. And as the owner of the said store where I worked told me, his general formula in audio gear was that a doubling of price gets you about a ten percent improvement, everything else being equal...just an off the cuff formula, but his point is that it is a law of diminishing returns.

Pride and Naim...hmm, I don't think so.  To any normal gadget wielding individual born in the last 30 years, the classic Naim boxes look like garbage.  What those ugly boxes do is something rarely experienced, or appreciated, by most people.  I'm not poor enough to buy Miele products, but I know where to put my money to get the best end result pound for pound, and when it comes to music that has become Naim.  I too believe that the supplied i-phone ear-buds are pretty good as such things go, but they don't do what my Naim system does.  And not even close.

Hungryhalibut posted:

Pride does sound rather negative, and of course it’s one of the seven deadly sins. I do like having nice things, like a good hand built sofa, or a Miele fridge freezer. They are good solid things that are well made and built to last. Naim is not well known and hardly anyone who visits us knows what it is and therefore they don’t pass comment, other than to say ‘this sounds nice’ if they get to listen to music. I bought a decent watch last year and was saying to the woman in the shop that I didn’t want anything ostentatious. She told me that there was no need to worry as nobody ever notices them, and having worn it every day for nearly a year nobody has ever made a comment. I bought it because it’s really nice. 

I did notice your watch in Milano! Haven't I told you?

M

Having added the Audioquest Dragonfly Black DAC to my phone I found myself hearing things through my Bose in-ear buds that surprised and delighted me, so I can identify with much of what Max has said - and consequently I enjoy my music on the move far more than I ever did. I do find I cannot comfortably wear these for hours and of course I cannot share the listening experience with others. Having recently added the XPSDR to my 272 and 200DR I am at last hearing something where the SQ is delivering all I would like to hear and I am hearing so much more - at the end of the day it is not the logo on the front but what it delivers to the ears and how it makes you feel. The positive thing I took from your post Max was how much you are enjoying your music - and you can always go back to your box system if the muse takes you. Keep enjoying the music and life.

Peter

I remember the days of old when I first purchased my CD3/NAC 92/90.3 driving a pair of Mission 752 speakers. No matter what CD I chose to listen to at that time (regardless of production quality) it sounded absolutely spell binding, so much so, that I used to race home from work on my push bike (dripping with sweat) to get through my front door as fast as possible just to listen to some music on that system (incredible stuff). Where have them days gone man, what the hell happened? I can only assume that since the kit being built went from leaded solder to non-leaded solder, things have dramatically changed. It's still great listening to music albeit (refined) in one sense on my newer system but also bloody boring in another way compared to that old system.

It's like remembering those old train journeys where one could stick their head out of a window and really feel the speed, the wind, the roughness, the roar of those English diesel/electric engines, the creaking of those old coaches and being thrown about like on some old rattling fair ground ride, this was exciting stuff indeed!!  I get on a train today, it sends me asleep, gasping for real air, waiting for something to happen, admittedly, I still get to my destination feeling a whole lot safer and possibly quicker than before (if I wake up that is) but you get my drift. I guess things are just not the same anymore and this includes the music as well as the production quality too but on my old system this wasn't a problem, it got me hooked and here I still am but in a much more subdued state.

Max,

When you say 

.... And the problem in my ears is that it is a stereo system inside a domestic room: something that will never be able to work properly, under any circumstance. To me, this is now a given fact, a plain truth. A system, and a costly one, is HDMI: a hoax, a disappointment and a mission impossible. No responsible, no-one  guilty, nothing I didn't know before; but a simple acknowledgement that all efforts are vain, are money down the toilet: stereo systems will never sound as good as an mp3 inside a good pair of earplugs from a decently designed telephone. Speakers in a domestic environment cannot cope with the infinity of acoustical, unmanageable issues; ...

i am getting to very same conclusion and hoping to have the courage to sell everything and maybe buy a Muso that probably won't interact as much with the room (i can't listen with headphones for long time).

i get more pleasure listening to music from Laptop and my Car. The core of the music isn't lost as it is in a domestic room. i find it impossible to get decent bass from any speaker i try here; classical music (with less bass and midbass, and better recordings) is tolerable, but put a "normal" CD and it's wrong, and i have tried EVERYTHING i can remeber.

a friend tells me that the DRs solve a lot of the bass and midbass issues he believes were clearly wrong with Naim gear, but i am convinced the domestic room will always win. and already lost all my patience and energy to try one more thing. what next? super lumina cables? 552? etc etc etc

it is sad to give up, but when i ask myself (conscious and inconsciously) what to do, the answer is "get rid of everything". before my intuition would tell me "wait, the something wrong that you'll find out soon"....but i stop believing, too!

best regards

rui

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