Any known Naim app issues? (Mu-So & Star)

Huge posted:

Since you know enough about the app and networking to pontificate about what the app should be able to do, perhaps you could make some constructive suggestions to Naim to help them improve the app?

Surely what it should be able to do is work consistently on a piece of kit you’ve spent a few grand on 

Huge - I genuinely have no idea what you are trying to achieve here - candidly, it is not my problem to spend excessive time as a user telling a vendor how to fix their issues.

When a company sells a product with clear advertised features - it need to do what it says, that's with any product. Then we have premium products with a high price tag - because they sound good, feature rich, lastest technology - but they need to work properly.

If your car broke down every other day, or didn't start three times a week, or the Infotainment failed on a regular basis, would you 'suggest' to them how to fix it?

I've had enough now - so either be constructive or leave it here.

Lord_HIllier posted:

Huge - I genuinely have no idea what you are trying to achieve here - candidly, it is not my problem to spend excessive time as a user telling a vendor how to fix their issues.

When a company sells a product with clear advertised features - it need to do what it says, that's with any product. Then we have premium products with a high price tag - because they sound good, feature rich, lastest technology - but they need to work properly.

If your car broke down every other day, or didn't start three times a week, or the Infotainment failed on a regular basis, would you 'suggest' to them how to fix it?

I've had enough now - so either be constructive or leave it here.

On the other hand if you fit incorrectly sized tyres to your high performance sports car and crash it on a wet roundabout while following a Ford Fiesta that made it round OK, is that the fault of the manufacturer of the car, or the local authority, or the people who laid the road surface; according to your analogy it possibly couldn't be your fault!

Huge posted:
Lord_HIllier posted:

Huge - I genuinely have no idea what you are trying to achieve here - candidly, it is not my problem to spend excessive time as a user telling a vendor how to fix their issues.

When a company sells a product with clear advertised features - it need to do what it says, that's with any product. Then we have premium products with a high price tag - because they sound good, feature rich, lastest technology - but they need to work properly.

If your car broke down every other day, or didn't start three times a week, or the Infotainment failed on a regular basis, would you 'suggest' to them how to fix it?

I've had enough now - so either be constructive or leave it here.

On the other hand if you fit incorrectly sized tyres to your high performance sports car and crash it on a wet roundabout while following a Ford Fiesta that made it round OK, is that the fault of the manufacturer of the car, or the local authority, or the people who laid the road surface; according to your analogy it possibly couldn't be your fault!

Have you had too much to drink already?

Mercky posted:
Huge posted:

Since you know enough about the app and networking to pontificate about what the app should be able to do, perhaps you could make some constructive suggestions to Naim to help them improve the app?

Surely what it should be able to do is work consistently on a piece of kit you’ve spent a few grand on 

And that Mercky is EXACTLY the point mate, thank you for understanding my point!

Lord_HIllier posted:
Huge posted:
Lord_HIllier posted:

Huge - I genuinely have no idea what you are trying to achieve here - candidly, it is not my problem to spend excessive time as a user telling a vendor how to fix their issues.

When a company sells a product with clear advertised features - it need to do what it says, that's with any product. Then we have premium products with a high price tag - because they sound good, feature rich, lastest technology - but they need to work properly.

If your car broke down every other day, or didn't start three times a week, or the Infotainment failed on a regular basis, would you 'suggest' to them how to fix it?

I've had enough now - so either be constructive or leave it here.

On the other hand if you fit incorrectly sized tyres to your high performance sports car and crash it on a wet roundabout while following a Ford Fiesta that made it round OK, is that the fault of the manufacturer of the car, or the local authority, or the people who laid the road surface; according to your analogy it possibly couldn't be your fault!

Have you had too much to drink already?

No, have you?

Mercky posted:
Huge posted:

Since you know enough about the app and networking to pontificate about what the app should be able to do, perhaps you could make some constructive suggestions to Naim to help them improve the app?

Surely what it should be able to do is work consistently on a piece of kit you’ve spent a few grand on 

Precisely.

Lord_HIllier posted:
Mercky posted:
Huge posted:

Since you know enough about the app and networking to pontificate about what the app should be able to do, perhaps you could make some constructive suggestions to Naim to help them improve the app?

Surely what it should be able to do is work consistently on a piece of kit you’ve spent a few grand on 

And that Mercky is EXACTLY the point mate, thank you for understanding my point!

And how many different environments are Naim supposed to be able to support simultaneously?

SimonPeterArnold posted:
Mercky posted:
Huge posted:

Since you know enough about the app and networking to pontificate about what the app should be able to do, perhaps you could make some constructive suggestions to Naim to help them improve the app?

Surely what it should be able to do is work consistently on a piece of kit you’ve spent a few grand on 

Precisely.

You both spent a few grand on an Android tablet or phone?  !! 

Lord_HIllier posted:

Good night Huge - and all the best.

Before we end this, which of the new Uniti Streamers do you have?

The thread title is about the app!

I have the app on two Android devices, one on Android 5.1, the other on on Android 6.01.

And you?


(BTW I do have issues with the app but at least I've made some constructive suggestions to help sort it out.)

Huge posted:
SimonPeterArnold posted:
Mercky posted:
Huge posted:

Since you know enough about the app and networking to pontificate about what the app should be able to do, perhaps you could make some constructive suggestions to Naim to help them improve the app?

Surely what it should be able to do is work consistently on a piece of kit you’ve spent a few grand on 

Precisely.

You both spent a few grand on an Android tablet or phone?  !! 

Good night Huge - have a great weekend.

Huge posted:
SimonPeterArnold posted:
Mercky posted:
Huge posted:

Since you know enough about the app and networking to pontificate about what the app should be able to do, perhaps you could make some constructive suggestions to Naim to help them improve the app?

Surely what it should be able to do is work consistently on a piece of kit you’ve spent a few grand on 

Precisely.

You both spent a few grand on an Android tablet or phone?  !! 

Actually no, I spent about €700 on an iPad Pro!

Adam - seriously, thank you. It's very kind. I am a systems engineer and I know networks very well, albeit more in a Data Centre environment. I'm so frustrated as I know that my network at home is way over the top and is only that way trying to get stability only on the audio side. I've gone to excessive measures without success.

All the best.

OK, which of these issues are reproducible, even if not reproducible, at least occur with significant frequency (say 5% of time)?

What other circumstances are needed to make them reproducible?

When these questions are answered, it starts to become possible for programmers to debug the code in these areas.

Without reproducibility, it's almost impossible to determine the cause of the behaviours on systems like iOS and Android which are, themselves, not fully deterministic.  Please help the coders and software testers to help you.

Lord_HIllier posted:

I'm so frustrated as I know that my network at home is way over the top and is only that way trying to get stability only on the audio side. I've gone to excessive measures without success.

There appears to be an assumption here that the Naim Apps are generally crap.  This cannot be true as many people have no (or very few) issues using the app.

I would assume that Naim have a setup at the factory which works and the app works in their testing close to perfect.  The situation is that when there are other problems the app falls over and it’s very hard to test for those situations unless the engineer is sat in your home and can explore what is on your network causing the problems.

Lord_HIllier posted:

Here's another, iRadio drops out on many stations.

Oh no it doesn't.  !!!     well at least mine doesn't,  my iRadio has had very few drop outs since I started iRadio nearly 4 years ago.  Other than iRadio & re the OP premise that the app is crap,  there are so many folks who have no problems,   I have to believe it's how or how not the problem people have their connections & networks setup.   I'm inclined to agree that Huge & Eloise post are touching on the problem.  

.....when you want to listen to uninterrupted music  and it is not happening, then you have to point to something. For a lot of us when we started using Naim gear the App is easy to point the finger at. I know I struggled for a three or four months with the TIDAL dropping out intermittenly and then working without problems for awhile. Very frustrating! During one such bout of problems Mike-B and Huge provided some sound advice and guidance and everything fell into place! The system now has a great up-time track record now with only an occasional interruption.

The solution was using the schematic that MIke-B had posted many times and having the streamer and NAS connected to a switch then to the router. At least that worked for the issue I was experiencing.

Lord_HIllier posted:

Here's another, iRadio drops out on many stations.

iRadio droput is generally caused by: radio stream breaking up due to servers overload; ISP bandwidth / overload problems; streamer loosing network connection.

None of it related to the Naim App - it’s just a controller and it is not involved in the actual music playback.

I've not pointed the finger specifically at the App or the device, why, because I don't know where the issue lies. My point is, I have spent excessive amounts of time trying to resolve the issue, to the point that the unit was exchanged 2 weeks ago - and the new one still has issues. As for iRadio, it's unusable, yet if connect any iOS device, iPP, iP8, iPX, iPod and use VOX, TuneIn, RadioPlayer, BBC Radio, Apple Music - it works properly. Finally, you cannot possibly say that my Network causes the Atom to reboot!

For those that insist on blaming the network, here's the setup.

Fibre to the cab 76MB DL 20MB UL - Cisco 887 Router, Otronics Clarity Cat6a pre-terminated patches, Cisco 300 series switch, Chord C-Stream x 2, Apple AirPort Extreme bridged via 887 for 5Ghz Wifi. 

The Atom is hardwired to the 300 series the iOS devices are connected to the APE. 2 x Synology DS216j NAS boxed with WD Red 4TB's.

DHCP is used but also fixed IP address has been used, none are consistent, NAT Enabled, WMM Enabled.

The above ONLY handles the Atom and the NAS boxes. 

@Lord_HIllier If you are sure that your network is fine, and I can see that you do know about networks, then your replacement Atom is probably also faulty.

When we were beta testing the latest version of the app, there were a number of testers with Atoms and no-one reported problems like you describe with iradio. The app itself is as stable as I have ever seen and none of the customer-side beta testers or Naim have any interest in letting something go which is as flaky as you are experiencing. But I don't have an Atom myself, so I can't speak from first hand experience there.

Assuming you have exhausted the ideas that Naim Support have, you could give it back to your dealer and ask them to try it on their network. You could even control it with your phone/app. Or you could maybe find a forum member willing to try the same thing for you. For example if you live near Guildford then I would be happy for you to bring your Atom over to mine and see if it misbehaves here.

Ultimately though, the Atom should work on any reasonable network and be well controlled by the app and as your's isn't, something is wrong. I hope you get to the bottom of what that is.

best

David

David, many thanks for your reply, thank you too for completely understanding my point. I also value your offer to test at your place, I live up in the Midlands so it’s a little too far.

The unit is going to my friends tonight for him to use for a few days, he is a WAN engineer and network protocol expert, MCSE, Cisco etc Certified. It will then go to my work next week in the test lab, if that proves fruitless and issues are still there it’s going back and I’ll walk away from the Uniti solution. My other Naim kit has been fantastic over the years and this is the frustrating part.

All the best and thanks again for the balanced and non-confrontational reply.

LH.

Eloise posted:
thekent posted:

Yeah I tried several times that day. I even deleted the app a couple of times and re-added it. 
Then without any effort the rooms later came back.  Very odd. 
Seems to be playing up just now but will try again later.

Could there be something external interfering with your WiFi?

Maybe even try clearing out all spurious WiFi networks from your tablet.  Check you’ve not attached to the wrong network in error.

On my second demo of streaming about 16 months ago I followed advice to separate out dual band Wi-fi into two differently named networks. This is certainly possible with BT hubs. It then stops the constantly switching of bands in the hope that one is better than the other by things like iPads. My iPad does not work on 5GB even though it tries to connect - I manually put it back. It is also worth making sure you have a really strong Wi-fi signal (all bars) where you listen to music. I bought a 5m cat5 style ADSL cable to move the hub to the lounge and have not had issues since. I understand 15m is the limit. There is only a slight speed reduction below 24 Mb/s ( I am close to the exchange).

My third streamer demo wasn’t satisfactory so I sent the Core and UnitiServe back. My TV acts as a really good simple media player when I don’t want to use the CDX2 into nDAC.

Phil

SimonPeterArnold posted:

As far as I am concerned the app and firmware on the latest kit is shocking. I've switched inputs 3 times in 15 mins and the app and Atom have locked up again. Twice in 24hrs. This is acceptable? Don't think so. It's.not network it's just rubbish software pure and simple..

I’m starting to think the same, I’ve just had a text from my mate, he has my Atom on HIS network, he said and I quote “I’ve seen a more stable house of cards”. He got it to hang within 20 minutes. 

I have a primary suggestion for improving the app.  Since iOS 11 for the iPad and also for the iPhone X the volume bar on the UI needs a bit of tweaking as in moving upwards on the display by making the bar larger, because sliding the control too close to the bottom can bring up the dock on the iPad and far too often I end up selecting the track on the tidal playlist just above the volume bar itself.

i find it glitchy at times as many other have commented on using my Mu so’s and 272 and though I like the look of the app, the UI itself could do with a bit of polishing up and modernising somewhat.

Add Reply

×
×
×
×