Blimey, the 272 is even better than I thought it was...

Hungryhalibut posted:

I’ve been playing a lot of music today, and the last album of the day is the new one from Stacey Kent. The sound I’m getting is just incredible, so much better than before. It reminds me of how it was with the big system ten years ago. It’s so wonderful to hear the SL2s in full flight; something that that the 250 just wasn’t able to do somehow. It’s just amazingly good, it’s hard to describe. 

That is great. I add my congratutions for your fantastic upgrade. From what I've read in this thread, you thoroughly deserve it. I hope you enjoy your new system for many years to come. Don't even think about a NAC 372!

I have followed this very long thread, all the way to Milan and back. I am very pleased for HH and it's interesting to hear about what he is doing and the exciting results he has achieved, but sitting listening this afternoon to my Core, 272, XPS DR and 250DR with standard interconnects and NAC-A5, I am noticing that it sounds just as good as ever and not diminished by all the thoughts of upgrading going on elsewhere.

best

David

David - very well said! I’m listening to the sublime sound generated by my 272, XPSDR, 250DR and SL2s with naca5 and I must say I have no desire to spend such sums getting the amplification to the apparent “minimum level” required to run these fabulous speakers! However, each to their own as they say and I’m glad to hear that the upgrades are working out for HH.

MangoMonkey posted:

@Hungryhalibut - speaker cables or interconnect first?

DIY interconnects! 

I currently have Mogami W2549 (wired as pseudo-balanced), these are a substantial improvement over the standard interconnects.

I'm about to try
Klotz MC5000    (wired as pseudo-balanced)
Mogami W2947    (wired as unbalanced)

Huge posted:

I'm about to try
Klotz MC5000    (wired as pseudo-balanced)
Mogami W2947    (wired as unbalanced)

Hi Huge,  you might find the Klotz a bit of a handful,  I found the W2549 (not to be confuzed with your intended W2947) only just went into the Neutrik DIN's.       The Klotz MC5000 conductor size is 0.50 mm/2 (28 x 0.15mm)     Compared to W2547 which is  0.339mm/2   (30 x 0.12mm)

Haim Ronen posted:
Hungryhalibut posted:

We were staying on Via Senato, which is the next road to Via della Spiga. We wandered down there back to the hotel one evening and the prices were astounding, like €10,000 or more for a dress, or the same for a Dolce & Gabbana bag. £110 for Diesel jeans is positively bargain basement. It certainly puts Naim equipment pricing into perspective. It’s another world. 

It seems like Einstein had come up with his General Relativity Theory solely to provide us with an excuse for our own silly spendthrifts. 

One of course could go the other way and be reminded that:

A 552 costs more than a brand new Honda Accord, a SN 2 would cover the home heating cost for six years and one Power Line would get you 8000 eggs..

yes, but you can also buy a very big champagne bottle in a night party in St Tropez for around 40k GBP( two 552 for drinking in 2/3 hours with some friends).    The other stupid world is here!    Or you can change the wheel of a bugatti shiron for the price of two 552....

Mike-B posted:
Huge posted:

I'm about to try
Klotz MC5000    (wired as pseudo-balanced)
Mogami W2947    (wired as unbalanced)

Hi Huge,  you might find the Klotz a bit of a handful,  I found the W2549 (not to be confuzed with your intended W2947) only just went into the Neutrik DIN's.       The Klotz MC5000 conductor size is 0.50 mm/2 (28 x 0.15mm)     Compared to W2547 which is  0.339mm/2   (30 x 0.12mm)

Indeed Mike, I'm aware of that.
The Klotz MC5000 is 7mm OD, too large to fit into a DIN plug and the W2947 is even worse... it's 8mm OD.  So, for both, I'm going to have to use heat shrink rather than the standard rubber strain relief.

In terms of internal wiring of the connector, I managed to solder a W2534 and a 16AWG pair into one DIN5, so I don't think either cable will give me too much of a problem here!

I had a 272 and a 250DR and was lucky enough to find a guy who had the same but with a one year old XPS DR and he had decided that selling the XPS DR didn't make much difference to his enjoyment and gave him money to spend on their new house and new baby. Of course I thought it all sounded a bit better when I added it to my system but I often think about how much we pay for relatively minor enhancements in real world terms.

best

David

One thing that I’ve noticed this evening is that the bass is both much deeper and yet much tighter, with real power and drive. And everything is more lively and unrestrained, like the sound has somehow been released from the speakers. And yet it - as those with the XPS and 250 are so rightly saying - sounded so good before.  I wasn’t really sure how it was going to improve; I just knew from past experience that it would. While not auditioning first could be seen to be a pretty dippy thing to do, it does mean that one gets a nice surprise! What’s so good is that the improvement is way beyond my expectations - it’s like having a whole new system. Sorry, I must stop twittering on about it. 

The next small change is another shelf to go at the bottom, which will make those pesky burndies easier to deal with, which is something of a challenge with three of the blighters in a single stack setup. 

Still loving this thread.

Has the improved musical enjoyment been consistently and emphatically in one direction HH, or have there been the moments we've all had where it didn't seem quite as good as the night before?  Mood, weather, electrics, level of ear wax, placebo, alcohol, lack of alcohol, etc.  I still recall a review in a Hi-Fi magazine in which the reviewer claimed that the sun coming out from behind a cloud made a clearly detectable improvement to whatever product he was listening to.  Mood and placebo possibly, but forget the other explanations!

About to embark (tomorrow!)  on a huge series of upgrades, including 300 to 300DR, Chord cables and dedicated mains consumer unit.  I know I should probably be doing them one at a time, but I'm confident enough based on previous experiences and the comments on here, and lucky enough that I can afford them within reason.  Will post in due course.

Bryce Curdy posted:

Has the improved musical enjoyment been consistently and emphatically in one direction HH, or have there been the moments we've all had where it didn't seem quite as good as the night before?  Mood, weather, electrics, level of ear wax, placebo, alcohol, lack of alcohol, etc.  I still recall a review in a Hi-Fi magazine in which the reviewer claimed that the sun coming out from behind a cloud made a clearly detectable improvement to whatever product he was listening to.  Mood and placebo possibly, but forget the other explanations!

Ha Ha! Gets my vote for the most amusing post on this thread! Good luck with your upgrade.

Atherton posted:
Bryce Curdy posted:

Has the improved musical enjoyment been consistently and emphatically in one direction HH, or have there been the moments we've all had where it didn't seem quite as good as the night before?  Mood, weather, electrics, level of ear wax, placebo, alcohol, lack of alcohol, etc.  I still recall a review in a Hi-Fi magazine in which the reviewer claimed that the sun coming out from behind a cloud made a clearly detectable improvement to whatever product he was listening to.  Mood and placebo possibly, but forget the other explanations!

Ha Ha! Gets my vote for the most amusing post on this thread! Good luck with your upgrade.

Thank you.  For a horrible moment I thought you were amused by my upgrade plan (maybe you are) because I'm nervous as hell for the money I'm spending!

Hungryhalibut posted:

One thing that I’ve noticed this evening is that the bass is both much deeper and yet much tighter, with real power and drive. And everything is more lively and unrestrained, like the sound has somehow been released from the speakers. And yet it - as those with the XPS and 250 are so rightly saying - sounded so good before.  I wasn’t really sure how it was going to improve; I just knew from past experience that it would. While not auditioning first could be seen to be a pretty dippy thing to do, it does mean that one gets a nice surprise! What’s so good is that the improvement is way beyond my expectations - it’s like having a whole new system. Sorry, I must stop twittering on about it. 

The next small change is another shelf to go at the bottom, which will make those pesky burndies easier to deal with, which is something of a challenge with three of the blighters in a single stack setup. 

I have a nDAC/XPS DR -> 282/SuperCap DR ->  300 DR with full SL loom which is now sounding even better with similar enhanced bass etc as you describe. The big change was to put extra space around the power supplies (bottom right stack 300 DR, SuperCap DR, XPS DR bottom to top) - an idea provided by Darke Bear in the Naim Torque thread. Pleased as one might be before as you say, the difference is gobsmacking to me. The power is very noticeable in piano works which have extra power with notes that ring - an altogether realistic sound now. Different drums have different sound textures. Everything I have played since the change on Wednesday has sounded so much better. Good power supplies well setup deliver results. I think that as DB says the space around the power supplies improves the timing to sharpen all the sounds.

Enjoy! 

Phil

Just to round this off..... I’ve made the final tweak today. When first installed, the two 300 burndies were resting on the floor, and the 555PS was above the 300PS. Today I added another SVT shelf, with the short 100mm columns at the bottom. Buy putting the 555PS at the bottom, all three burndies can now hang free. That, coupled with reinstalling everything more carefully, means that it’s set up as well as it can be given that it’s a single stack, which will always be to some extent suboptimal. The wires have now had five days running in and this, coupled with the better setup has moved things on enormously. 

The speakers sound much larger than before. Everything is clearer, so that you can her everything going on, yet it all hangs together beautifully. And when it’s turned up loud it seems as if there is limitless power, with no strain at all. It’s funny, the 272/XPS/250 is a brilliant system, yet the 272/555/300 is something else entirely - so much better it’s hard to put into words. So I’ll say no more, there’s painting to be done. 

As I am also considering upgrading to 555DR and 300DR, albeit with a different source and speakers, HH's recent journey has been a fascinating read. It also reassures me that I am on the right track, not withstanding the usual rigorous home demos that precede any upgrade in the NigelB household.

Thanks to Nigel for sharing.

If I might be so bold, I think they’d be a bit wasted on your speakers. As you know, I did no demonstrations at all, and just bought them. But I’ve owned both a 555 and 300 before, albeit non DR, so I know what they do. And as it happens, they have way exceeded my expectations. Setup is critical though, as I’ve been reminded today when adding the extra shelf, and the performance has taken a real step up. 

Does anyone know why the original XPS (olive) can't be used with a 272?

If XPS and XPS2 can be used as alternates on the CD players up to CDS3, and XPS2 can be used with 272, I don't understand why the olive XPS can't as well.

Yours thickly...

JWM posted:

Does anyone know why the original XPS (olive) can't be used with a 272?

If XPS and XPS2 can be used as alternates on the CD players up to CDS3, and XPS2 can be used with 272, I don't understand why the olive XPS can't as well.

Yours thickly...

Transformer size,  the olive is a lot smaller & the streamers draw more current than CDP.   

 

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Hungryhalibut posted:

If I might be so bold, I think they’d be a bit wasted on your speakers. As you know, I did no demonstrations at all, and just bought them. But I’ve owned both a 555 and 300 before, albeit non DR, so I know what they do. And as it happens, they have way exceeded my expectations. Setup is critical though, as I’ve been reminded today when adding the extra shelf, and the performance has taken a real step up. 

You are of course right about my speakers being the weak link and I indeed have these on the list, hence my recent interest in the Kudos 606s. I have always been a source first bloke though, as evidenced by my monkfish set up. I know that the NDS is capable of far more with a decent PS so will look at a 555DR first. My speakers have been revealing enough to display SQ uplifts from all my upgrades along the way to the current set up so they will probably be last as the 606 is not on the shelves yet and I tend to go for exdem where I can.

Great to hear you have such an improvement from your recent additions. 

The Strat (Fender) posted:

Nigel (B). I retire from work at Xmas we really must get you over to hear the S20s.   Sorry HH for diverting the thread. 

Lindsay, congrats on the retirement. Yes, Christmas got in the way of a visit to you last year to hear your (then) new S20s. Thanks for the invitation, the S20s are still of interest as I fear the new 606s might be out of reach, particularly as I have my eye on a 555DR too.

Apologies to the other Nigel for perpetuating this diversion.

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