Cables, cables and cables...

Marcus 

if you visit Leicester then you could always spend the weekend in Birmingham - not as exciting for your partner as London but plenty of interest to see with good shops, restaurants and museums. Plenty of good live music at the splendid Symphony Hall if you choose your visit date to coincide with whichever music you both like

Bob

The Strat (Fender) posted:

Marcus - you have an awesome system. I'd enjoy the music.  As I see it your only real improvement is 552/500 - start saving

You are probably right! I will start saving for a NAC552 right away. A NAP500 is definitely out of the scope for me but I think the NAP300 is a very good poweramp so no worries... 

All logic is telling me that a preamp upgrade should do a lot more for the system performance compared to “some fancy cables” but after hearing how much better the Chord Music was compared to SL I have started to wonder.

It would be nice to make the demo NAC552 + my current cables vs NAC252 + full loom Sarum T, just to be sure…

/Marcus

Shropshire Hills posted:

Marcus 

if you visit Leicester then you could always spend the weekend in Birmingham - not as exciting for your partner as London but plenty of interest to see with good shops, restaurants and museums. Plenty of good live music at the splendid Symphony Hall if you choose your visit date to coincide with whichever music you both like

Bob

Thank you, Bob! Very good suggestion! Much appritiated!

I will start to convince my wife that our next weekend away from the kids should go to Birmingham 

/Marcus

Joppe posted:

Marcus, yes auditioning 500 series amps (and source when it was availble) is almost impossible here.  Not that I have asked my dealer if he could arange a 552 demo. But juding from the difficulty of arranging a din-xlr demo for my 300 (of any cable) I assume it would not be very easy to arrange.

I see you have SL full loom, were you able too find a demo din-xlr cable, or did you make your purchase based on faith (and din  experience)?

It looks like I at least will be able to audition din-din versions of SL against Chord Signature TA, Sarum T and Music in the upcoming weeks. Not a bad start...

Hi Joppe!

Have you been able to audition any cables yet? It would be interesting to hear your impressions of the different cables and how they performed in your system!

/Marcus

Actually I got to audition din-din versions of chord Signature TA, Sarum T and Music against Super Lumina in my system before Christmas. To me SL came out on top in my system, I got a stronger sense of presence and drive (I believe what some refer to as “leading edge”) compared to the chord cables. In this sense I believe that my hiline was the closest, a Naim carachter? SL as well as the more expensive Chord cables offer superior resolution and insight compared to my hiline. Possibly the chords offer a bit more natural and richer tonality than SL? But for me it is hard to ignore the presence and drive of the Super Lumina.

Now my quandary is, would my conclusion be the same with rca-din from my LP12/Urika? Anyone who’s  prefered different cables for digital and Urika?

Joppe posted:

Actually I got to audition din-din versions of chord Signature TA, Sarum T and Music against Super Lumina in my system before Christmas. To me SL came out on top in my system, I got a stronger sense of presence and drive (I believe what some refer to as “leading edge”) compared to the chord cables. In this sense I believe that my hiline was the closest, a Naim carachter? SL as well as the more expensive Chord cables offer superior resolution and insight compared to my hiline. Possibly the chords offer a bit more natural and richer tonality than SL? But for me it is hard to ignore the presence and drive of the Super Lumina.

Now my quandary is, would my conclusion be the same with rca-din from my LP12/Urika? Anyone who’s  prefered different cables for digital and Urika?

That is what I found too, the Chord's just don't have that leading edge ability of a Naim cable.

But it's a big market, and I guess different cables for different taste.

I used to have Chord SignatureTuned Aray RCA - DIN and DIN - XLR and did the remove them and see if you miss them test and I didn't miss them.

I agree 100% spend the money on your pre amp or your source first but if you must I would go phono stage - Nac first and then speaker cable.

Joppe posted:

Hi all,

I have followed cable threads conserning Super Lumina (SL) and Chords offers Signature TA (Signature, STA), Sarum T (and the older SA and TA) and Music with interest over the last year or so. I have Linn/LP12/urika with naim standard rca-din (lavender) and cds3/555dr with hiline (or std naim) into 252/300dr (std. cables) and Magico S1 speakers through Chord epic ref (or naca5). 

I have heard chord STA and SL interconnects in my system before service/dr and with previous dynaudio speakers. I also heard Music an Sarum SA in dealer demos, but not Sarum T. 

Auditions of din-din versions I hope are possible but most likely not rca-din or din-xlr. 

In my setup I believe the epic ref speaker cable offer more detail and presence to instruments compared to Naca5, which have a a nicer tonal balance with a richer tone to eg male voices. Comparing hiline to std Naim ic on cds3 also show a similar effect (hiline more detailed but overall slightly brighter). 

So, my question(s)? Could I have the best of both worlds without breaking the bank? Do I need to consider full loom, or is just ICs enough in this pussel? Would even starting with the din-xlr make sense (it will for sure benefit both sources)? All experiences and advice are appreciated!

Given the nature of the question, I suppose the mention of specific brands is allowed. So my answer(s) is (are): Vertere, yes, perhaps better, I have no idea.

Best

M. 

Can I very politely ask Richard firstly why a particular cable manufacturer does not wish their products discussed on this forum and secondly why the administrators have agreed to this rather North Koreaesque request.

if this was a football forum and the CEO of Arsenal demanded that the club was not discussed we would all laugh at him.

For the record I have absolutely no idea which manufacturer has asked this although I obviously know a few who have not.  And no offence to Arsenal!

It is a reasonable right of everyone to not have their name mentioned on a public forum, particularly if members have previously levelled possibly unfair criticism against them.


I can't tell you who the manufacturers are (that would be against forum rules), but by reverse engineering the effects, I may be able to tell you who they aren't...

One does not make TP-Link network products; the other does not make Continuous Wave radio transmission gear (and that's sailing as close to the edge of the world as I'm prepared to go - I can distantly hear the rimfalls!)

 

I seem to have fallen behind on the product history of Chord IC’s. I’d appreciate it if someone more knowledgeable than I am could bring me up to date with Chord Sarum lineup 

As I can recall this the Sarum line started as:

Solstice initially, but quickly changed to Sarum. 

Sarum eventually became Super Sarum, the first upgrade 

Super Sarum then was upgraded to Sarum (TA) for Time Aligned. A significant upgrade 

Sarum TA is now Sarum T (for Teflon), but remains with a the Time Alignment feature. This is the current offering and is the penultimate Sarum IC  

Chord Music, new IC, came out a year or so ago and is now their premier offering  

Chord also offers TA upgrading to their Indigo lineup

Chord came out with a new Signature line, as a more modest priced cable that still offered Time Alignment.

if I am missing anything here, I would appreciate it if someone would chime in;  i’m Just trying to stay current with product line  

  

 

 

 

Arthur Bye posted:

I seem to have fallen behind on the product history of Chord IC’s. I’d appreciate it if someone more knowledgeable than I am could bring me up to date with Chord Sarum lineup 

As I can recall this the Sarum line started as:

Solstice initially, but quickly changed to Sarum. 

Sarum eventually became Super Sarum, the first upgrade 

Super Sarum then was upgraded to Sarum (TA) for Time Aligned. A significant upgrade 

Sarum TA is now Sarum T (for Teflon), but remains with a the Time Alignment feature. This is the current offering and is the penultimate Sarum IC  

Chord Music, new IC, came out a year or so ago and is now their premier offering  

Chord also offers TA upgrading to their Indigo lineup

Chord came out with a new Signature line, as a more modest priced cable that still offered Time Alignment.

if I am missing anything here, I would appreciate it if someone would chime in;  i’m Just trying to stay current with product line  

  

 

 

 

Hi Arthur, I think you're pretty much up to speed. the only things to note are that TA is Tuned Aray,  the T in Sarum stands for Taylon and, I believe, Indigo is no longer in the line up.  As well as creating a super-expensive premier Music range, they brought in Clearway at a rather more affordable level (sub £100-ish) but it does benefit from Aray tech.

Arthur Bye posted:

I seem to have fallen behind on the product history of Chord IC’s. I’d appreciate it if someone more knowledgeable than I am could bring me up to date with Chord Sarum lineup 

As I can recall this the Sarum line started as:

Solstice initially, but quickly changed to Sarum. 

Sarum eventually became Super Sarum, the first upgrade 

Super Sarum then was upgraded to Sarum (TA) for Time Aligned. A significant upgrade 

Sarum TA is now Sarum T (for Teflon), but remains with a the Time Alignment feature. This is the current offering and is the penultimate Sarum IC  

Chord Music, new IC, came out a year or so ago and is now their premier offering  

Chord also offers TA upgrading to their Indigo lineup

Chord came out with a new Signature line, as a more modest priced cable that still offered Time Alignment.

if I am missing anything here, I would appreciate it if someone would chime in;  i’m Just trying to stay current with product line  

  

 

 

 

Sarum Super Aray replaced Sarum Tuned Aray rather than the other way round.

Yes, thanks for sorting that part out Dave/ Bryce. I had forgotten about the Tuned Aray part of it. I thought the Sarum  "T" was for Teflon. I don't remember Taylon. What is that?

Kinda makes me wish for the days that we argued about grey burndies versus black ones. Or white naca5 over black. 

I still can't keep the two Chord companies straight either  why can't they just join up?  

Difficult to keep all this ridiculousness sorted. 

Arthur

Bryce Curdy posted:

Can I very politely ask Richard firstly why a particular cable manufacturer does not wish their products discussed on this forum and secondly why the administrators have agreed to this rather North Koreaesque request.

if this was a football forum and the CEO of Arsenal demanded that the club was not discussed we would all laugh at him.

For the record I have absolutely no idea which manufacturer has asked this although I obviously know a few who have not.  And no offence to Arsenal!

Bryce, I think that the manufacturer in question was a bit unhappy with the forum policy that mean't they were not allowed to come on the forum to discuss or promote their products.  Naim would rather not get into arguments over this kind of thing but we do stick to our guns on forum policy as it's the best way to keep the forum as clean as possible.  As such, we felt it best to comply with their wish.

Richard Dane posted:
Bryce Curdy posted:

Can I very politely ask Richard firstly why a particular cable manufacturer does not wish their products discussed on this forum and secondly why the administrators have agreed to this rather North Koreaesque request.

if this was a football forum and the CEO of Arsenal demanded that the club was not discussed we would all laugh at him.

For the record I have absolutely no idea which manufacturer has asked this although I obviously know a few who have not.  And no offence to Arsenal!

Bryce, I think that the manufacturer in question was a bit unhappy with the forum policy that mean't they were not allowed to come on the forum to discuss or promote their products.  Naim would rather not get into arguments over this kind of thing but we do stick to our guns on forum policy as it's the best way to keep the forum as clean as possible.  As such, we felt it best to comply with their wish.

Ah, thanks Richard.  That makes a bit more sense.  If they are not allowed the right of reply then best for everyone if they are not mentioned at all.

Richard, my apologies for any transgressions. I thought got there was some leeway here as long as it didn't involve M*na. I will endeavor for no further offense. Perhaps there should be a "place" that all of go for some remedial education about such things.

Going to my Safe Space now.......

Arthur

Bryce Curdy posted:
Richard Dane posted:
Bryce Curdy posted:

Can I very politely ask Richard firstly why a particular cable manufacturer does not wish their products discussed on this forum and secondly why the administrators have agreed to this rather North Koreaesque request.

if this was a football forum and the CEO of Arsenal demanded that the club was not discussed we would all laugh at him.

For the record I have absolutely no idea which manufacturer has asked this although I obviously know a few who have not.  And no offence to Arsenal!

Bryce, I think that the manufacturer in question was a bit unhappy with the forum policy that mean't they were not allowed to come on the forum to discuss or promote their products.  Naim would rather not get into arguments over this kind of thing but we do stick to our guns on forum policy as it's the best way to keep the forum as clean as possible.  As such, we felt it best to comply with their wish.

Ah, thanks Richard.  That makes a bit more sense.  If they are not allowed the right of reply then best for everyone if they are not mentioned at all.

Well, in actual fact it's not a case of no 'right of reply".  The rules are very clear - no reps.  Beyond Naim and a small amount of leeway granted to Naim dealers and distributors (strictly moderated), nobody is allowed to post about their own commercial interests on this forum. That way the forum is kept clean and won't be used as a platform for anyone to try to sell their wares to Naim forum members - and by heavens they try!!  There is always right of reply where something may not be correct - if anything is posted on here as fact and is considered by the manufacturer to be false or misleading then they have the right to contact Naim and ask for any erroneous information to be reviewed and corrected if adjudged fair and necessary - in these cases I usually post or comment on their behalf. 

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