linear ps for switch and routers

Mr Underhill posted:

Hi Keler,

On CA there are a couple of interesting threads on AC mains isolation. There John Swenson recommends a Topaz Isolation Transformer and putting all your equipment on a simple strip. He maintains this addresses issues with Leakage loops, something which his LPS1 effectively blocks. Worth reading and considering. Not done this myself.

M

thanks, i will take a look.  On audiostream you have an article on paul pang switch and other devices to clean ethernet, and on recent Ear audio you have jason kennedy article on mcru linear ps and cad audio ground control.

Keler Pierre posted:

your set up seems very good. But it is different from me: my nas( unitserve) is fed by tp ps. Yours go the the UPS.  Your router and switch go to the Ups, and for me i use an optical bridge between switch and nds( with hdplex ps on the last switch). 

So, what is working for you does't work necessarily for me. I don't know if adding this Ups on my system will not be too much.  But it is interesting to conversate about all this. It seems not so easy.   Mcru site recommends me PS power plant... 

The most common UPS for the forum members is APC,  PS Power is a ridiculous price,  I guess one is intended for the IT market, the other for audio madness.    There is no reason why your TP-PS cannot be powered by UPS & the same for your wireless hub,  keeping wireless alive during power failures is useful for saving & safely shutting down PC/Mac any work in progress.   There is no point in having UPS power for the optical bridge as a power failure means the NDS & amps are powerless  

Keler Pierre posted:
sbilotta posted:

I put an ifi on a Paul Pang switch and there was a clear (even if not dramatic) improvement.

Should be getting an LPS-1 soon and will swap it out and let you know the outcome.

i can't find the sites to find the prices or buy paul pang switch and ifi . can you give me the names of the sites? thanks

I bought the switch on the JCAT european site and the ifi on the notorious auction site

Mike-B posted:
Keler Pierre posted:

your set up seems very good. But it is different from me: my nas( unitserve) is fed by tp ps. Yours go the the UPS.  Your router and switch go to the Ups, and for me i use an optical bridge between switch and nds( with hdplex ps on the last switch). 

So, what is working for you does't work necessarily for me. I don't know if adding this Ups on my system will not be too much.  But it is interesting to conversate about all this. It seems not so easy.   Mcru site recommends me PS power plant... 

The most common UPS for the forum members is APC,  PS Power is a ridiculous price,  I guess one is intended for the IT market, the other for audio madness.    There is no reason why your TP-PS cannot be powered by UPS & the same for your wireless hub,  keeping wireless alive during power failures is useful for saving & safely shutting down PC/Mac any work in progress.   There is no point in having UPS power for the optical bridge as a power failure means the NDS & amps are powerless  

the ps audio dectet power center exactly, the cost is near the aps if i remember well. Maybe Aps will be good for me, i don't know.  But the safety, security for power failures is not what i search first. My goal is to clean ethernet and have better sound quality with my nds/555dr/unitserve tps set up. But perhaps your Apc does that?

greekspec2 posted:

I got a spare PowerLine I was thinking of using on my modem with a C7-C14 IEC adapter since my modem has a built in PS...not sure if any gains over the AQ 1.5 NRG I have on it now

Wow, I think that would be some serious overkill. Sell the PL and either buy better LPSU elsewhere in the system, optical bridges if you don't have yet or EMO isolation filter, or better yet more music. I wouldn't try and overthink this too much. 

KELER: Have you tried a better made dc cable between the US and tp-lps? Beyond going with different brand of server altogether, you may be at the limits of what you can do upstream and APC or PS strip may make very little difference depending on your mains set up, iso if you have an optical bridge. What about the ethernet cable into the NDS? You may be chasing a ghost that doesn't actually exist. 

Keler Pierre posted:

My goal is to clean ethernet and have better sound quality with my nds/555dr/unitserve tps set up. But perhaps your Apc does that?

 The way I have the various SMPS's powered from the APC is not a total solution,  but it does play a part.  The APC provides an isolated & suppressed power supply to the SMPS's associated with my LAN & helps quieten noise in that area.

charlesphoto posted:

Mike:  Mind me asking which APC model you have? 

Hi Charles,   APC BackUp CS350.      I have the NAS run a soft close down after 10 seconds power failure,  not much point in streaming to a powered off NDX.   The 350VA battery capacity gives more than enough power to enable saving & closing any PC/laptop work thats in progress & to politely finish up any phone calls,  I've not tried pushing the limits to APC low battery shutdown but its at least 40 minutes.    Its reassuring to get an e-mail for any abnormal power events that I may not even know about & its easy to run a function test every 6 months or so.  

I use an APC UPS because I was fed up of loosing data and disks when we used to get frequent power cuts. UK Power Networks upgraded our village overhead wiring, and the power cut situation improved significantly, but still kept my UPS. I power a switch of it as I have multiple NASs and use the UPS status and signalling between them via the Ethernet.. this of course allows the NASs to power down in a controlled way when the UPS starts to become exhausted... I did have a power cut once whilst I was doing an automatic weekly backup, it could have ended in tears but all was nicely handled.

Simon

sbilotta posted:
Keler Pierre posted:
sbilotta posted:

I put an ifi on a Paul Pang switch and there was a clear (even if not dramatic) improvement.

Should be getting an LPS-1 soon and will swap it out and let you know the outcome.

i can't find the sites to find the prices or buy paul pang switch and ifi . can you give me the names of the sites? thanks

I bought the switch on the JCAT european site and the ifi on the notorious auction site

thanks

charlesphoto posted:

KELER: Have you tried a better made dc cable between the US and tp-lps? Beyond going with different brand of server altogether, you may be at the limits of what you can do upstream and APC or PS strip may make very little difference depending on your mains set up, iso if you have an optical bridge. What about the ethernet cable into the NDS? You may be chasing a ghost that doesn't actually exist. 

i can't change the cable of the tp ps, it is special, i have already tried but it doesn't work. For my nds ethernet cable, i use audioquest diamond, so it is among the best. But the router is a poor plastic box, with switch mode ps. This router can't be charged i think, because it is the box of the ethernet /phone/tv for which i pay an abonnement.  Perhaps just a little main conditionner as isotek sirius to purify this router from which ethernet starts...

Mike-B posted:
Keler Pierre posted:

My goal is to clean ethernet and have better sound quality with my nds/555dr/unitserve tps set up. But perhaps your Apc does that?

 The way I have the various SMPS's powered from the APC is not a total solution,  but it does play a part.  The APC provides an isolated & suppressed power supply to the SMPS's associated with my LAN & helps quieten noise in that area.

perhaps it is a solution. What do you think of isotek sirius, i can have one for half the price ?

sbilotta posted:
Keler Pierre posted:
sbilotta posted:

I put an ifi on a Paul Pang switch and there was a clear (even if not dramatic) improvement.

Should be getting an LPS-1 soon and will swap it out and let you know the outcome.

i can't find the sites to find the prices or buy paul pang switch and ifi . can you give me the names of the sites? thanks

I bought the switch on the JCAT european site and the ifi on the notorious auction site

on jcat site, i found tcxo audiophile grade switch, but no paul pang....

Keler Pierre posted:
sbilotta posted:
Keler Pierre posted:
sbilotta posted:

I put an ifi on a Paul Pang switch and there was a clear (even if not dramatic) improvement.

Should be getting an LPS-1 soon and will swap it out and let you know the outcome.

i can't find the sites to find the prices or buy paul pang switch and ifi . can you give me the names of the sites? thanks

I bought the switch on the JCAT european site and the ifi on the notorious auction site

on jcat site, i found tcxo audiophile grade switch, but no paul pang....

yes, they've changed it.

The Italian partner site has it; you can find it and other worldwide partners on Paul Pang's blog (or Shopping Area as he calls it).

engjoo posted:
ChrisSU posted:
engjoo posted:

HH, which cisco swicth did you get yourself ? 

The one with a SMPS in it, I think.

Yes I would think so too given the size.. :-)

It's the 2960 8 port, as mentioned by Simon above. I bought it on the basis of his recommendation. I started a thread about it a few months back. 

Keler Pierre posted:

perhaps it is a solution. What do you think of isotek sirius, i can have one for half the price ?

Not at all,  its nothing like the same.   in my post I clearly say my system powered by UPS isolates the SMPS circuit from the other parts of the power supply.     Also most such power strips as Isotec have C&D mode chokes which by default have LN&E shunt connected capacitors & many similar designs are reported by users to have a negative impact of SQ.

Hungryhalibut posted:
engjoo posted:
ChrisSU posted:
engjoo posted:

HH, which cisco swicth did you get yourself ? 

The one with a SMPS in it, I think.

Yes I would think so too given the size.. :-)

It's the 2960 8 port, as mentioned by Simon above. I bought it on the basis of his recommendation. I started a thread about it a few months back. 

i need only 3 ports, because the other ports for tv ....( not music) are on the router / 6 ports.

I put a neatgear 4 ports gs105 where there is only unitserve , and from this switch i put an optical bridge. At the end of this bridge there is a tplink. the nds go inside. hd plex ps with this tplink.

Mike-B posted:
Keler Pierre posted:

perhaps it is a solution. What do you think of isotek sirius, i can have one for half the price ?

Not at all,  its nothing like the same.   in my post I clearly say my system powered by UPS isolates the SMPS circuit from the other parts of the power supply.     Also most such power strips as Isotec have C&D mode chokes which by default have LN&E shunt connected capacitors & many similar designs are reported by users to have a negative impact of SQ.

and ps audio detekt power centre?  what do you think of that?   i must add that the sirius isotek i was thinking is not for hifi components, just for router , switch and smps like hdplex...

My amp, preamp, nds...are separated and on an mpc melodie main block.

Keler Pierre posted:

and ps audio detekt power centre?  what do you think of that?   i must add that the sirius isotek i was thinking is not for hifi components, just for router , switch and smps like hdplex...

My amp, preamp, nds...are separated and on an mpc melodie main block.

Sorry but I am not getting into a debate about what's best power filter;  I am simply making a point that my system has its SMPS's isolated from all other audio components by the UPS internal 1/1 isolation transformer.  

Mike-B posted:
Keler Pierre posted:

and ps audio detekt power centre?  what do you think of that?   i must add that the sirius isotek i was thinking is not for hifi components, just for router , switch and smps like hdplex...

My amp, preamp, nds...are separated and on an mpc melodie main block.

Sorry but I am not getting into a debate about what's best power filter;  I am simply making a point that my system has its SMPS's isolated from all other audio components by the UPS internal 1/1 isolation transformer.  

ok i understand. But i can't know if apc is better than ps or isotek for what i need. But thanks for sharing, i will find some more informations on the apc.

Keler Pierre posted:

ok i understand. But i can't know if apc is better than ps or isotek for what i need. But thanks for sharing, i will find some more informations on the apc.

I've looked at the PS Audio Detekt technical description & specs from a mix of imprecise 'marketing' info & independant non-technical reviews,  its description 'suggests' that it has three sections that are isolated from each other & photos of the internals support the same with what looks like 1/1 isolation transformers.  It might be worth further investigation for you to isolate your SMPS units as I have.    That said the price for this device is madness for what is inside

Mike-B posted:
Keler Pierre posted:

ok i understand. But i can't know if apc is better than ps or isotek for what i need. But thanks for sharing, i will find some more informations on the apc.

I've looked at the PS Audio Detekt technical description & specs from a mix of imprecise 'marketing' info & independant non-technical reviews,  its description 'suggests' that it has three sections that are isolated from each other & photos of the internals support the same with what looks like 1/1 isolation transformers.  It might be worth further investigation for you to isolate your SMPS units as I have.    That said the price for this device is madness for what is inside

for what i read about the apc ups, i understood that it is essentially used by people who wants security for their nas. They take apc when they have no stable electricity and prevent for mains failures... I have found nothing about sound quality of ethernet streaming with this product but there is no reviews really of this product.  I will continue to investigate.    Some chinese mains conditionner like bada or xindak seem to do the same for more than half the price... but i have not enough confidence in chinese products.

I can have an isotek sirius for half the price, to clean my router, switch and smps units. The ps detekt is also on ebay, and for now it is cheap( 8 days left..).   I take my time.

Keler Pierre posted:

for what i read about the apc ups, i understood that it is essentially used by people who wants security for their nas. They take apc when they have no stable electricity and prevent for mains failures... I have found nothing about sound quality of ethernet streaming with this product but there is no reviews really of this product.

UPS is only to ensure safe NAS security & is a basic requirement for NAS security.  Its absolutely nothing to do with sound quality as such,  I simply use mine to power SMPS & therefore 'help' improve SQ.

nickpeacock posted:

Ok I managed to find the same Cisco 2960 model which Simon gave details of in a post a while back. I think it's the same one HH has. As HH said in his semi-legendary audiophilia nervosa thread, let's see...

if you want something simple and active to improve the quality of streaming, you can go to: etalon isolator or giso gs/ gb ( ethernet filters). You put just this little box between switch and streamer, and you are done. 

If you want a little more, put after this a linear ps for nas and good quality ethernet cable.

nickpeacock posted:

Ok I managed to find the same Cisco 2960 model which Simon gave details of in a post a while back. I think it's the same one HH has. As HH said in his semi-legendary audiophilia nervosa thread, let's see...

Hi Nick, unless you need  to use Power over Ethernet I would use a regular direct powersupply. One of the switches has an option for an external powersupply, and that is the version that can be PoE powered. Most have powersupply built in. Of course if you use PoE you can use a remote power injector, thereby keeping your powersupply some distance from your switch and possibly audio equipment if that is important for you. But if you do use  PoE I would regular certified Ethernet 5e or 6 cables and not, in my view, some of the more questionable boutique cables.

BTW I wouldn't bother with Ethernet 'isolators', I have looked at some of them and I have  listened, some actually seem to deteriorate the sound on the connected streamer some how, possibly because they interfere with the Ethernet balanced transmission line impedance, and more importantly for me seemed  to sometimes cause errors with the link establishment protocol. Mine are now in a storage box.... In my book unless you have some very electrically noisy cheap network equipment somewhere, filtering of common mode noise is a side show... most benefits are to be had elsewhere.. and most 'isolators' are designed for safety reasons for the medical industry to increase the 1500 Volts Galvanic isolation of standard Ethernet, by several  thousand volts.

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