ndac upgrade

Harry posted:

The best source you can get on the front of your system is never overkill. Down chain components can't process and portray details that the source has failed to pick up and pass to them.

Agree to a point, but I would say that NDS/555 as the best source, connected to a lets say SN2, costing five times less than the source, I would have a huge problem justifying that. In fact, I sold my NDS/555/SN2 for that reason. If I had a plan to upgrade, then it would be another story in my opinion. If the quote above was fully true, it would make streamers (NDX) and preamps/ amps up the hierarchy redundant?

I also wonder why a second hand 555PS is compared to a new XPSDR. It should be apples against apples, both new or both s/h?

I`m about to order an XPSDR to my 272 (where the 555DR would cost me UKP 1600,- more) and wonder, why should I need the 555? Yes, it is better, but at the 272 level, do I need it to enjoy musical replay? It would be source first of course, but so would XPS be and with a greater balance also IMO.  Again, there`s a reason why the box hierarchy is there. 

S

Second-hand 555PS is not being compared to an XPSDR. I used it as a mere price reference. 

In a context of a N272 or NDX I believe that an XPSDR is actually a good upgrade. 555PS maginfies some of the less pleasant NDX traits too much and thus unbalances it somehow.

However with an nDAC I found a clear and audible overall improvement when XPS was substituted with a 555PS. 

It wasn't until I took the demo 555PS off the DAC after a week of home auditioning that I realised just how good it was and how quickly my ears had taken it for granted. I hesitate to call DAC/555PS a 500 level DAC because NDS/555PS is better to my ears. But that's getting on for the kind of performance you can confidently expect.

Back when I couldn't afford anything, people were running fully loaded LP12s into modest amplification and speakers. It wasn't unusual to put 75% of the budget into the front end. Digital and streaming hasn't changed this. Adding a better component anywhere in the chain will usually give benefits but at no point will a source be too good for a decent HiFi system. Even a paradoxically expensive one.

Agree with the Ndac thing, but still not understand how one can justify source first to the extreme. To make balance within the budget is a far better way to go imo and so the LP12 history becomes a "dogma" to me  That said, each to his/ her own.

To the OP, this may have been a side step, sorry!

S

 

Stover posted:

Agree with the Ndac thing, but still not understand how one can justify source first to the extreme. To make balance within the budget is a far better way to go imo and so the LP12 history becomes a "dogma" to me  That said, each to his/ her own.

To the OP, this may have been a side step, sorry!

S

 

I share your opinion. I also think it is easier to loose money in the source component area than e.g. the power-amp area. I'm strongly hesitating to invest too much money in a streaming source since I feel progress if going much faster in that area than the other components.

Therefore I'm looking for a versatile solution and the nDac - or another dac - is the closest I can get to a good streaming solution. However the streaming component itselve is not likely to be a Naim component at my place given all the connection problems which are also reported on this forum.

Buying a secondhand nDac + powersupply sounds like a proper investment to me. Add a streamer one you are done. Even on NDS level according to some people on this forum.

It's very system dependant how the PSU upgrade works in the end. I recently tested XP5XS and one aftermarket PSU with my nDAC and didn't like either of them. But I have this special situation that I use rather big speakers (ATC SCM40v2) in my rather small (20m2) room and even though the bass stays in great control as is, with PSU upgrade things got worse. In my setup, the bass became overpowering and lost some control with XP5XS. I haven't tried XPS2/DR or 555PS/DR though but XP5XS wasn't for me. My system seems to be in good balance with a bare nDAC. The recent firmware upgrade on the other hand, free and a huge improvement in SQ. 

If I'd still use smaller speakers like my previous PMC 20.23, I think I'd gain much more with the PSU upgrade. 

If you hear it you will be able to justify it. Just because a system is balanced money wise does not mean it will provide the best sound.

If you hear it and don't like it then fair enough. But don't let prejudice get in the way of experience.

Not everyone agrees with the source-first dogma: yes, you can only get out what you put in, but also, regardless of what you put in, you can only get out what each subsequent component lets through. Speakers in fact are the component that most affect the character of the sound you hear, and unless you like the sound they can produce all else is a waste. Less of a problem with those content with, fir example, a curtailed frequency response, but if you are one of those to whom the bottom couple of octaves are important and you want to hear them uncurtailed, then it is likely to require a significant expense on speakers, which may limit the funds available for the source: but you would get the sound character you like, and any future upgrade of source or amp will shine through.

Patu posted:

It's very system dependant how the PSU upgrade works in the end. I recently tested XP5XS and one aftermarket PSU with my nDAC and didn't like either of them. But I have this special situation that I use rather big speakers (ATC SCM40v2) in my rather small (20m2) room and even though the bass stays in great control as is, with PSU upgrade things got worse. In my setup, the bass became overpowering and lost some control with XP5XS. I haven't tried XPS2/DR or 555PS/DR though but XP5XS wasn't for me. My system seems to be in good balance with a bare nDAC. The recent firmware upgrade on the other hand, free and a huge improvement in SQ. 

If I'd still use smaller speakers like my previous PMC 20.23, I think I'd gain much more with the PSU upgrade. 

My listening room is also 20m2 and I use Focal Electra 1028be's, which are fairly large. Over the years I've regularly needed my dealer to adjust the positioning of my speakers when some improvement has been made to the system because of the extra bass detail that has then reached the speakers.  That was especially the case when improving the PSU on my nDAC.  So I wouldn't judge the XP5 negatively on the basis of you experiencing more bass. A XPS2 and 555PS on your nDAC would very likely give you even more bass. If your ATCs can't be adjusted your probably better living with he 'bare' nDAC, which is still very good. 

MDS posted:
Patu posted:

It's very system dependant how the PSU upgrade works in the end. I recently tested XP5XS and one aftermarket PSU with my nDAC and didn't like either of them. But I have this special situation that I use rather big speakers (ATC SCM40v2) in my rather small (20m2) room and even though the bass stays in great control as is, with PSU upgrade things got worse. In my setup, the bass became overpowering and lost some control with XP5XS. I haven't tried XPS2/DR or 555PS/DR though but XP5XS wasn't for me. My system seems to be in good balance with a bare nDAC. The recent firmware upgrade on the other hand, free and a huge improvement in SQ. 

If I'd still use smaller speakers like my previous PMC 20.23, I think I'd gain much more with the PSU upgrade. 

My listening room is also 20m2 and I use Focal Electra 1028be's, which are fairly large. Over the years I've regularly needed my dealer to adjust the positioning of my speakers when some improvement has been made to the system because of the extra bass detail that has then reached the speakers.  That was especially the case when improving the PSU on my nDAC.  So I wouldn't judge the XP5 negatively on the basis of you experiencing more bass. A XPS2 and 555PS on your nDAC would very likely give you even more bass. If your ATCs can't be adjusted your probably better living with he 'bare' nDAC, which is still very good. 

I have also quite limited space to move my speakers. They're very close to the back wall, only around 20-30 centimeters away, measured from the back end of the speaker. But they're also a closed design so this helps with the positioning. Bass control is excellent and bass is very strong and fast. There's nothing wrong with a strong bass, how would I ever have fallen in love with Naim if I wouldn't like bass. Everyone knows about the Naim midbass bump. 

But with the PSU, it was too much. With smaller speakers.. maybe. With more powerful amp.. maybe. But as is, the bare nDAC is golden. My system is built around nDAC, which is currently my oldest component in the setup. 

All my comments are purely IMO of course. I'm not questioning anyone here and do believe that most of the times the PSU upgrade gives excellent results. 

Yes, Patu. Again, I am similarly constrained.  The positioning adjustments to my Focal Electras have been partly toe-in but mainly moving further out from the rear wall and are now about 45cm out. Further back on some material the bass was too much, but then the Electras have a rear port.   

Patu,

"...Everyone knows about the Naim midbass bump."  

I guess I am not everybody.  What frequency is "midbass?" And which Naim products have a "bump" (presumably boost in frequency response) at that frequency?

Charlie

PS: a forum search on "midbass bump" leads me back to this thread.

Patu posted:

It's very system dependant how the PSU upgrade works in the end. I recently tested XP5XS and one aftermarket PSU with my nDAC and didn't like either of them. But I have this special situation that I use rather big speakers (ATC SCM40v2) in my rather small (20m2) room and even though the bass stays in great control as is, with PSU upgrade things got worse. In my setup, the bass became overpowering and lost some control with XP5XS. I haven't tried XPS2/DR or 555PS/DR though but XP5XS wasn't for me. My system seems to be in good balance with a bare nDAC. The recent firmware upgrade on the other hand, free and a huge improvement in SQ. 

If I'd still use smaller speakers like my previous PMC 20.23, I think I'd gain much more with the PSU upgrade. 

Patu - what you seem to be describing is room acoustics at its worse - booming and bloated bass frequencies at certain frequencies. 

CharlieP posted:

Patu,

"...Everyone knows about the Naim midbass bump."  

I guess I am not everybody.  What frequency is "midbass?" And which Naim products have a "bump" (presumably boost in frequency response) at that frequency?

Charlie

PS: a forum search on "midbass bump" leads me back to this thread.

I'm sorry, I thought it's a well known phenomenon? You can try naim midbaas hump or boost in google, some conversation there and it's been discussed in our local forums a lot.

I think there's no real boost there but that's how some people experience Naim's excellent bass performance. 

Adam Zielinski posted:
Patu posted:

It's very system dependant how the PSU upgrade works in the end. I recently tested XP5XS and one aftermarket PSU with my nDAC and didn't like either of them. But I have this special situation that I use rather big speakers (ATC SCM40v2) in my rather small (20m2) room and even though the bass stays in great control as is, with PSU upgrade things got worse. In my setup, the bass became overpowering and lost some control with XP5XS. I haven't tried XPS2/DR or 555PS/DR though but XP5XS wasn't for me. My system seems to be in good balance with a bare nDAC. The recent firmware upgrade on the other hand, free and a huge improvement in SQ. 

If I'd still use smaller speakers like my previous PMC 20.23, I think I'd gain much more with the PSU upgrade. 

Patu - what you seem to be describing is room acoustics at its worse - booming and bloated bass frequencies at certain frequencies. 

"At its worse" is way over exaggeraring things. We're talking about regular room acoustics here. I think only few of us are lucky to have dedicated listening rooms where you can goo all in with acoustic treatment. 

Also the bass never gets boomy nor bloated. 

Just out of curiosity - what is 'mid-bass' frequency? 

As an example I set my bass guitars in a following way:
* Bass - neutral, no boost
* Parametric mid: slight boost of around +1.5 dB around 150 Hz
* Trebble - slight cut of approximately +2 dB, to cut the upper harmonics

This is my basic tone, which is further enhanced by a combination of my amp and speakers.
Of course its a feature of my bass guitars, how they've been constructed and the amp I use.
So I guess this could be characterised as a mid-bass boost.

Is that what you had in mind?

Adam

Patu posted:
Adam Zielinski posted:
Patu posted:

It's very system dependant how the PSU upgrade works in the end. I recently tested XP5XS and one aftermarket PSU with my nDAC and didn't like either of them. But I have this special situation that I use rather big speakers (ATC SCM40v2) in my rather small (20m2) room and even though the bass stays in great control as is, with PSU upgrade things got worse. In my setup, the bass became overpowering and lost some control with XP5XS. I haven't tried XPS2/DR or 555PS/DR though but XP5XS wasn't for me. My system seems to be in good balance with a bare nDAC. The recent firmware upgrade on the other hand, free and a huge improvement in SQ. 

If I'd still use smaller speakers like my previous PMC 20.23, I think I'd gain much more with the PSU upgrade. 

Patu - what you seem to be describing is room acoustics at its worse - booming and bloated bass frequencies at certain frequencies. 

"At its worse" is way over exaggeraring things. We're talking about regular room acoustics here. I think only few of us are lucky to have dedicated listening rooms where you can goo all in with acoustic treatment. 

Also the bass never gets boomy nor bloated. 

Well... from your description of 'bass becase overpowering and lost some control' I perhaps misunderstood something or read more than you've actually meant.
But regardless - it's slightly worrying what you describe. With a well setup system and normal room acoustics you shouldn't have those effects.

Adam Zielinski posted:
Patu posted:
Adam Zielinski posted:
Patu posted:

It's very system dependant how the PSU upgrade works in the end. I recently tested XP5XS and one aftermarket PSU with my nDAC and didn't like either of them. But I have this special situation that I use rather big speakers (ATC SCM40v2) in my rather small (20m2) room and even though the bass stays in great control as is, with PSU upgrade things got worse. In my setup, the bass became overpowering and lost some control with XP5XS. I haven't tried XPS2/DR or 555PS/DR though but XP5XS wasn't for me. My system seems to be in good balance with a bare nDAC. The recent firmware upgrade on the other hand, free and a huge improvement in SQ. 

If I'd still use smaller speakers like my previous PMC 20.23, I think I'd gain much more with the PSU upgrade. 

Patu - what you seem to be describing is room acoustics at its worse - booming and bloated bass frequencies at certain frequencies. 

"At its worse" is way over exaggeraring things. We're talking about regular room acoustics here. I think only few of us are lucky to have dedicated listening rooms where you can goo all in with acoustic treatment. 

Also the bass never gets boomy nor bloated. 

Well... from your description of 'bass becase overpowering and lost some control' I perhaps misunderstood something or read more than you've actually meant.
But regardless - it's slightly worrying what you describe. With a well setup system and normal room acoustics you shouldn't have those effects.

Yes, as I told earlier, with the PSU upgrade, my system went out of balance. You can see my whole setup in my profile. In its current state, it's very well balanced and I have no problem with the bass whatsoever. Didn't I just write that with smaller speakers or maybe more powerful amplification, things could be different.

Balanced system is always a sum of its parts and in my case, maybe my system and room can't handle the extra low end information available with the psu upgrade. It's quite logical, don't you think? 

I use NBLs in a similar sized room, maybe a little smaller, no bass problems since they've been in place though it took a few week to settle on the final positions after the initial dealer setup. NBLs are designed to go close to the wall behind them and mine are 5.5cm from wood to wall, neither 5cm  nor 6cm sound as good. My previuos ported speakers needed a bit of bass boost to fill out the sound and ended up 43.5 cm to the wall from an initial 65 cm. ln both cases half cm precision counts when setting them up. If you're struggling a bit do a search for "sumiko masterset" and give that a try, though I disagree about the need for the amount toe in they recommend. Your infinite baffle ATC may find a node that fits the room better yet.

yeti42 posted:

I use NBLs in a similar sized room, maybe a little smaller, no bass problems since they've been in place though it took a few week to settle on the final positions after the initial dealer setup. NBLs are designed to go close to the wall behind them and mine are 5.5cm from wood to wall, neither 5cm  nor 6cm sound as good. My previuos ported speakers needed a bit of bass boost to fill out the sound and ended up 43.5 cm to the wall from an initial 65 cm. ln both cases half cm precision counts when setting them up. If you're struggling a bit do a search for "sumiko masterset" and give that a try, though I disagree about the need for the amount toe in they recommend. Your infinite baffle ATC may find a node that fits the room better yet.

I don't really have problems with mine either. Problems appeared when I plugged in the PSU upgrade. In my setup also, if I move the speakers too far from the back wall, I lose focus in the low end.  I might gain some depth in the soundstage but I lose in the PRaT department (which is what Naim is all about). I just did little bit of experimenting again and moved the speakers way out of the back wall. I just didn't like it this way. My speakers are acutally 5cm from the back wall acoustic panel and 11-12cm from the actual back wall. I rememberd it wrong earlier. My initial setup is ideal for the sumiko master set, I have my speakers middle of the long wall and listening spot is about one metre out of the back wall. I might give it a try some day but it would be ideal to do with two people.

Sorry if I took the thread little offtopic. My original point was only to say that you always need to do your own audition. PSU upgrade might not be the key to happiness. All my comments are purely my own opinions and experience of course. 

Adam Zielinski posted:

Well... from your description of 'bass becase overpowering and lost some control' I perhaps misunderstood something or read more than you've actually meant.
But regardless - it's slightly worrying what you describe. With a well setup system and normal room acoustics you shouldn't have those effects.

Not sure what constitutes 'normal' for room acoustics, given the wide ranges of rooms people use?

Significant peaks and troughs in bass at particular frequencies of 20dB or more aren't uncommon, and speaker and listening positions are generally a compromise with practicality, so without room treatment it is rather unlikely that the majority of people will have a level room response, rather more likely there will be peaks and troughs with some quite possible more than 10dB. One approach to minimising the effect is simply to curtail speaker output below, say, 60-80Hz or even higher (as is not uncommon with smaller speakers) instead relying on harmonics in the upper bass to hopefully convey the impression of bass. 

If an improvement in bass depth from source or amplification components does allow more bass to the speaker, the fact that resonant frequencies might be excessive doesn't necessarily mean the equipment is wrong, but simply that resonances may need taming by room treatment, with narrow band absorbers capable of reducing the resonances but not the spectrum between, bringing better accuracy and allowing the wanted low frequencies through. Of course, even without the equipment upgrade that has allowed more bass through, the room effect must have been distorting the frequency range heard, with resonant frequencies perhaps the right level but other bass significantly less.

Ardbeg10y posted:

Would an nDac + PS (to decide which one) on a Supernait 1 be overkill?

I added a new XPS DR to my nDAC about three months ago.  As I also added a new 250 DR to my SN1 at the same time I can't say for certain which black box has had the greater effect ... and it has taken time.  Whilst the odd piece of music sounded clearer, more open, more involving from the word go ... a great deal of other music did not.  Hence I seriously questioned whether I had spent wisely ... perhaps reaching the limit of my existing set-up.

But these last few weeks has seen (= I've heard) more and greater/better performance from a wider range of my music.

The existing set-up was only meant to be temporary and I fully intend to move the XPS DR over to the (bare) NDX but as I'm enjoying the overall better sound every day now I'm giving myself excuses not to disturb the set-up ... not until I think I'm fully used to it.

QNAP (NAS) ~ NetGear switch ~ NDX (all Ethernet) ~ nDAC / XPS DR ~ SN1 / HC1 (non-DR) ~ NAP 250 DR ~ NACA5 ~ ProAc Tri-Tower

Of course, if the living room is the limiting factor ... I've had it! 

Mitch

Innocent Bystander posted:
Adam Zielinski posted:

Well... from your description of 'bass becase overpowering and lost some control' I perhaps misunderstood something or read more than you've actually meant.
But regardless - it's slightly worrying what you describe. With a well setup system and normal room acoustics you shouldn't have those effects.

Not sure what constitutes 'normal' for room acoustics, given the wide ranges of rooms people use?

Significant peaks and troughs in bass at particular frequencies of 20dB or more aren't uncommon, and speaker and listening positions are generally a compromise with practicality, so without room treatment it is rather unlikely that the majority of people will have a level room response, rather more likely there will be peaks and troughs with some quite possible more than 10dB. One approach to minimising the effect is simply to curtail speaker output below, say, 60-80Hz or even higher (as is not uncommon with smaller speakers) instead relying on harmonics in the upper bass to hopefully convey the impression of bass. 

If an improvement in bass depth from source or amplification components does allow more bass to the speaker, the fact that resonant frequencies might be excessive doesn't necessarily mean the equipment is wrong, but simply that resonances may need taming by room treatment, with narrow band absorbers capable of reducing the resonances but not the spectrum between, bringing better accuracy and allowing the wanted low frequencies through. Of course, even without the equipment upgrade that has allowed more bass through, the room effect must have been distorting the frequency range heard, with resonant frequencies perhaps the right level but other bass significantly less.

Normal in my vocabulary means neutral - reverbations are uniform, of the same lenght. Frequency resonation without siginifant peaks or throughs.

Patu posted:
CharlieP posted:

Patu,

"...Everyone knows about the Naim midbass bump."  

I guess I am not everybody.  What frequency is "midbass?" And which Naim products have a "bump" (presumably boost in frequency response) at that frequency?

Charlie

PS: a forum search on "midbass bump" leads me back to this thread.

I'm sorry, I thought it's a well known phenomenon? You can try naim midbaas hump or boost in google, some conversation there and it's been discussed in our local forums a lot.

I think there's no real boost there but that's how some people experience Naim's excellent bass performance. 

Patu,

No reason to be sorry.  I just have never heard "mid-bass hump" attributable to Naim electronics (or speakers for that matter), and I am dubious about such an assertion.   Also, I am not sure what frequency range is "mid-bass."  I personally have used the term to describe frequencies between "bass" and "midrange," so maybe 150Hz.  But this may be different than others.  There certainly are issues with room-speaker interaction which are often challenging, but I have not found these issues are unique to Naim.

It would appear that this is not too far off topic?  Though I so much appreciated the profound performance upgrade to my DAC, of XPS and then 555PSDR, that I would not be discouraged by bass readjustments.

Cheers,

Charlie

I don't  know about the UK but here in Australia the NDAC and  555PS are the same price as a Chord Dave.  My NDAC XPS2 DR with Nordost Whitelightning digital input and Valhalla everything else is all pre Dave.  I have what i have now.  Can't see me putting more into the source and demos are not available anyway. Every choice is based on a moment in time.  I'm hoping my Naim gear has good longevity. If it died tonight i probably would go a Dave and sell a Valhalla Power Chord and the remaining Naim working component to recoup a bit of cash.

that being said i have no complaints with what i have, which works very well.

I think perhaps the so called 'mid bass' boost occurred in older Naim with pre DR power supplies for the NACs, certainly some of the earlier pre DR products had a warmer more forward sound - perhaps that is what is meant by mid bass humps? Also perhaps at the time Naim was being compared to then popular Japanese hifi  which  often had a more forward treble response from memory? 

Certainly not aware of any humps now - not with Naim at least.

Interesting to see this assertion of the "mid-bass hump", something new to me, but then my Naim ownership began 4 years ago and some of the community have been with the brand for decades.  Anyway by looking at discussions on this "mid-bass hump" on external sites, would this follow along the same lines of the so-called "added bounce" which is apparently an ingredient of the Naim sound, in particular at the entry to mid range components, with the intention to draw the listener in by emphasising musicality?

In relation to the Naim DAC upgrade, perhaps you only need the latest firmware update?  For a short time I was distracted by Chord DACs but then the Naim DAC returned with a vengeance upon updating to the most recent firmware.

I was under the impression that the 'Naim Sound' was due to emohasis of certain parts of the spectrum resonsible for carrying the beat and possibly also the mid for vocal clarity. The suggested upper bass hump would fit with the former, especially with bass-light speakers that have been popular, to give an illusion of bass (e.g Kans as mentioned by James N). My impression is from a variety of things read over the years, not based on anything specific, however when this was mentioned a few months ago Richard Dane stated that he was not aware of any 'voicing', so if there is or has been some shaping it presumably hasn't been openly acknowledged by Naim, and I'm unaware of any independent test measurements showing it.

On this topic I'd like to add:

My tiny B&W CM1's do add much more mid-bass than my Supernait. When the SN gets connected to my 30yr old floorstanders, there is no mid-bass bump at all. Just a pretty linear frequency build-up.

What surprised me when I compared my Naim things (currently an AV2, Supernait 1, CD5i(talic)), is that the sound is right. My older non Naim mid-fi gear did result in a unclear bass and much more noise on the treble. And, yes, the stunning dynamics are gone.

Anytime I bring in something from Naim into a random setup of my audio gear, I notice a clear improvement. The most obvious thing is always a tight / proper bass - even regardless the poweramp is used.

I don't know what they do, but it is magic.

The AV2 as stereo dac not to be underestimated by the way!

The only time I've noticed a mid bass "hump" was when I tried a HiCap on my Supernait,  it was not so much a increase in mid bass,  more an added emphasis & is probably 50/100Hz VR colouration.   It made my already bassy floorstanders a bit OTT.   But the same HC - I borrowed it from a mate - on a Nait with Spendor LS3/5's adds an impression of more bass that is most welcome.     I eventually bought the cuddy toy PSU & that has no bass colouration,  but does add a lot to bass fundamentals.     

I remember when I was first introduced to Naim sound with the original SuperNait. I borrowed a used one and plugged it in my system which then consisted of a Bel Canto s300i integrated amplifier and Audio GD DAC. Speakers were magnificent ProAc Tablette Reference 8 Signatures. With Bel Canto driving them, the bass performance was quite light. Very fast and detailed but light. SN changed this completely. Deep and punchy bass with much better extension, but it was still fast and detailed. I was immediately hooked to the Naim sound, from the first few notes. This was around 2009-2010 and since then, I haven't looked back. 

But my point here is that there is something magical about the Naim's bass performance. Many other amplifiers don't digg as much bass out of the system as Naim does and they do it with such ease and naturalness. This is still my opinion. IMO, all this talk about Naim and PRaT is also built around the bass performance of Naim equipment. It's just freaking addicting and no other manufacturer does it quite like Naim. 

Ardbeg10y posted:

Would an nDac + PS (to decide which one) on a Supernait 1 be overkill?

I don't think so at all.

I had the pleasure of demoing the nDAC with my SuperNAIT 1. It sounded glorious. Incredibly engaging, wonderful drive and tons of fun. I wish I had the cash to buy it :/

I've never heard the NDS in my home system, but I've heard it a few times in the local dealer's setup - even with dual 555s into Statement.

I think the NDAC is more fun and the NDS more Hifi, but again - never done the A->B... just not impressed with the NDS. 

 

nathan_klassen posted:

 

I've never heard the NDS in my home system, but I've heard it a few times in the local dealer's setup - even with dual 555s into Statement.

I think the NDAC is more fun and the NDS more Hifi, but again - never done the A->B... just not impressed with the NDS. 

 

Well.... I think you should demo NDS in your system for some time. It would make your statement a bit more qualified.

nathan_klassen posted:
Ardbeg10y posted:

Would an nDac + PS (to decide which one) on a Supernait 1 be overkill?

 

I think the NDAC is more fun and the NDS more Hifi, 

 

Which only goes to show how vital it is to audition for yourself. I found the opposite. And I did the A-B.

We should each trust our ears only.

Also, there's no such thing as source overkill. How can downstream components put back what a source has failed to pick up?

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