192/24 and Mains over Ethernet

YES using D-Link  but with Linn, not with Naim

This is interesting. I don't think the difference between Naim and Linn gear is likely to be relevant here since I'm pretty sure the problem is about networking, not hifi gear. But the fact that at least two of you are doing this successfully means I need to look at the gear. As I said in the OP, I'm theoretically using Solwise's fastest kit - and it still doesn't work, yet they have a pretty good reputation.

Would be interested to know if there are any more successes?

One further question - any idea what network speed should be necessary to carry 192/24?

Yes you need about 10Mbps to stream 192/24. Ethernet over mains is inherently unreliable and is prone to interference and TCP restarts when some one operates an appliance. ITs also a single collision domain, which means its one way, so in fact the throughput is halted when something else wants to use the network over the Ethernet over mains link.

This is how the early LANs worked of yester year and really can only reliably work with up to 60% loading.

If you can get it to work, try not to let anything else use your network at the same time or best make sure the washing machine or vacuum cleaner etc. is not operating.

If you can get a duplex connection for your LAN (i.e. wired or fibred) and then these sort of idiosyncrasies are banished to the past.

Simon

I think I should have banned Simon, whose antipathy to Internet over mains is well known here, from commenting! Fact is, Simon, that lots of people are using it satisfactorily. My dealer, well known in Naim circles, feels that there's no audible difference, and they've installed loads of Internet over mains (though not mine).

One fly in the ointment I have heard of is the configuration of your house wiring. If you are trying to send across multiple ring mains you may have a problem since the 'path' is not direct.

I must admit I live alone and use it for my bedroom system so mainly late at night.

My Router is a D-Link quad band wireless-n with gigabit wired ports. One goes to the power line one goes to a gigabit switch & another goes to my NAS.

regards

Geoff

Agreed - I use Ethernet over mains no problems as do lots of other people I know. I stream HD movies from my NAS no problem. The connection from my NDX and HDX to the NAS and Broadband ADSl router is via Ethernet and again no problems.

My NDX has just been upgraded to 192/24 but I don't yet have any  192/24 recordings - I will get some and try out but as I said above I can stream HD movies which requires more bandwith than 192/24 with no problems. Peak rate I have measured for HD movies was 63mb/s on the movies I have.This was double hop too as I was using a PS3 which was being served by PS3 Media server on my quad core laptop (trancoding) when the actual MKV file was on the NAS. All connections are via Ethernet over mains.

My retailer fitted the 192 board to my NDX only last week. The UPnP feed from my computer downstairs does choke a little on 192 material: typically buffer trouble every 65 seconds, causing a drop-out of under 2 seconds.. I am currently using Solwise V 200 plugs.

 I was wondering to try upgrading to the Solwise 500 version, but may for now just put my downloaded 192 files on to a spare portable hard disk, which works fine on the NDX USB port, and is no trouble to carry between rooms

David.

We'll based on my experience with the Solwise 1000 version, there certainly isn't much mileage in upgrading from 200 to 500.

Ive been experimenting further since my OP. Some tracks, particularly Take Five, I can get to play without interruption, and the buffer doesn't drop below 50%. Most tracks, though, quickly drop to 50 then 30 then blip. This is repeatable, and mysterious. Take Five is a shortish track, but surely the thing doesn't try and buffer the whole track, so its length shouldn't be relevant.

I don't know if anyone from Naim is reading this, and might comment?

Goon, please if you ask for advice please be courteous and accept it, I found your remark somewhat rude and disrespectful. You had asked why LAN over Ethernet was not working for you and I was trying to explain its shortcomings. Its your choice but please dont come on this forum asking why things are not working for you if you are not wanting to listen to the answers.

The reason I am so anti LAN over Ethernet becasue the company I currently work for has had many issues with consumer installments (tens of thousands of them)  using these devices.

I am also aware of issues/concerns  over the last 12 months between Ofcom, CAA and some of the more recent Gigabit ethernet PLA devices, which has resulted in quite extensive notching which has reduced throughput even more.

Simon

Simon

My comment was meant in jest - I have been most grateful for your help recently and have duly noted that fact on these forums. Absolutely no offence meant!

But picking up your final point. Does this mean it's possible I'm getting a lower rate from my gigabit device than I would from say a 500Mb?

Paul

Paul - ok old chap - probably clompletely over reacted - i'll go in dog house now.

I can't see why your 500MB should be lower perfromance than the Gigabit, unless it uses a different chipset.

The notching was due to the fact that the higher speed devices have to use radio spectrum that belongs to the CAA, FM broadcast radio, DAB, taxis and various commercial interests. To be compliant key frequency ranges have had to be notched. Notching effectively reduces the bandwidth available to modulate and so the data throughput reduces. If you have an old device it could be pre notched, but then you could be inviting complciations if your house is sufficiently radiating.

I have until very recently used a Devolo pair of devices.

I have managed to get my full 50mbps internet connection across it.

If you stay on the same ring main - then it worked fine - however, running it between two ring mains met with unreliable results. 

Goon525, it may be worth checking with the manufacturers website to see if there is a firmware update available. I have a pair of Belkin Gigabit ones that were initially on the slow side but speeded up no end after a firmware upgrade. They connect from an upstairs ring to a downstairs ring going across the consumer unit.

Thanks. Good suggestion which I'm investigating. In the meantime I've copied my 192 files to a memory stick which is playing perfectly (and sounds great) through the SU. This is fine whilst I only have a couple of 192 albums, but not a long term solution.

I'm with Geoff P on this. Some wiring arrangements can cause buffering problems . Experiment for best solution.

I have excellent playback of 192 stuff using Devolo 500's, D-Link and KDS.

Regards

sensitive buggers some of you lot

wise words

+1

rr

''Mains over Ethernet:''

Can you email me a couple of KWH...

Maybe your network is not fast enougth to send 230v.

This is Ethernet over Mains