New Carlton Thread

Mt venerable 1984 Carlton now has an older and slightly smaller Carlton stablemate from ten years [or so] before!

A five speed cycle with 27 inch [rather than the slight smaller 700c] wheels on a medium sized frame.

Original running gear ... newer wheels.

Will make a wonderful make-weight to my first Carlton.

ATB from George

What is the running gear? Looks interesting. It is couple of years older than my 1976 Wilier Triestina.

Dear Winki,

I don't know the details of the running gear yet. I shall pick up the bike on Saturday, but I agree that the running gear is interesting. The front chain wheel is particularly striking with its three spoke single wheel design, which nowadays looks definitely old fashioned compared to modern two or three cog arrangements with five spokes. It has archaic cotter-pin cranks as well, so a real old-timer.

ATB from George

With a bit of luck you'll have Stronglight, Simplex, Huret or some other interesting brand now pretty much forgotten (although Stronglight is still going). Vintage Campy is always nice, of course,  but we can both tell it isn't that.

Dear Winki,

I shall collect the cycle on early Saturday morning. Much more exciting than getting a car!

ATB from George

Hi 

brings back memories of an early '70s Coventry Eagle I had at the time.....fitted with Simplex, then after a theft  of the rear derailleur (only), Huret Svelto......and those damn cotter pins...what a pain to get out.....

Enjoy George

It is worth knocking the cotter pins out perhaps once a year, so as to prevent them settling in permanently!

I have seen a cycle repair man at work on them, and he said that he would not have hit them as hard as he did, if the cycle had been nice, rather than a gas-pipe piece of scrap!

A bit of Three In One the day before is good!

If the derailleur is properly original, then I do have another period one that I might swap over just to preserve the original from more use. The spare I have is an almost unused MEADA INDUSTRIES [JAPAN] one that shifts very nicely, and has the very first appearance of a non right-angle pantograph. The advantage would be to preserve the original piece.

I am really pleased to find this nice little Carlton!

ATB from George

Dear Joff,

I have my train ticket bought for my trip to Derbyshire! Saturday morning - first train - aaaagh!

Back by lunch though!

Strange as it may seem this far more exciting than getting a Nissan Micra last year, and selling the car again in May was not a disappointment. But this is something else. For me to get this excited over a car it would have to be an MG Midget or Frog Eyed Healey Sprite!

If it has Simplex derailleurs and brakes this is good. They work rather well, among the period contemporary types! And replacements can still be found also, which is good. On my big Carlton there was next to no chance of replacing the original Shimano Golden Arrow parts, and they really were not that clever in  the first place. Slipping friction levers, was mine and others experience for a start, but the Simplex levers and derailleurs really did work. 

It might prove to become my favourite of the two,

But I have so much work invested in my green Carlton that she has become too much a part of the family ever to leave!

I hope that you will see the new [ancient] machine before too long!!!!

ATB from George

Dear Joff,

I think you have stumbled on the very frame model that my new baby is!

And it looks very much like the same running gear set.

I suspect that mine, though repainted, has never acquired that much corrosion!

I am terribly excited by this!

Thanks for the link!

ATB from George

I think you will like it too when you see it!

Six minutes past six, Saturday morning,  at Shrub Hill for the Derby train! I just want the next two days to evaporate as fast as possible!

ATB from George

Joff's find on the net, and mine next to each other!

Points of similarity are numerous, such as the way the rear brake cable is run on the cross-bar, but Joff's find is a taller cycle-frame than my one. Look at the steering tube length ...

ATB from George

Back after an interesting train journey to Derbyshire ...

The new Carlton is delightful. Not pristine as a cycle of 45 plus years old, but definitely a good runner!

Though it is a smaller frame than my green Carlton from 1984, it is two inches longer in axle length:

The back axles were lined up.

And an idea of the more relaxed seat tube and steering tube geometers  may be seen here.

The bike is lower, longer, and 1.9 kg heavier, mostly due [I imagine] to the running gear being mostly steel rather than aluminium, but it is nippy and will make a lovely counterpart to my more recent green Carlton! It needs stripping and rebuilding with new grease in all the bearings except the hubs ...

Very pleased!

ATB from George

Dear Winki,

The gear derailleur and lever are Falcon. English ...

The wheels are Mavic on Weinmann hubs, and the brakes are Weinmann.

The front chain wheel, BB, and cranks are Raleigh.

Quite a simple set, but unfussy though the brakes really need tightening up to come close to the Campag Gran sport callipers [with Shimano Tiagra levers] on my green Carlton. 

But the running gear is original or at least period.

It is a charming little cycle. It steers into bends rather less than the more abrupt and more recent bike. But it is nippy and smooth. The two aspects don't often go together. The lowest gear is higher and the top lower than my green cycle. But not so much to be a handicap in general I would think. Hills would be more of a challenge going towards Hereford!

ATB from George

Fascinating old cycle that actually works much better than it looks!

I stripped the headset bearings this afternoon, and cleaned all the stiff old grease out of the channels. Re-assembled with oil only so far, but they are beautiful now. Also atacked the brakes and got most of a satisfactory performance out of those archaic centre pull things. Not a patch on the Gran Sport callipers on Cycle No One, but none too shabby. Perhaps some modern brake blocks might bring things up to a reasonably safe standard of efficiency!

Anyway the ride out was lovely. The cycle certainly handles, and also goes up hills nicely. No shudder over bumps, and keeps the line. In other words a typical Carlton. Unfussy and gives confidence in its stability.

Top cog is usable, and indeed a limiting factor in flat out speed, but who does that for long?

ATB from George 

As with Naim so with Carlton. though things certainly evolved between the late sixties and the early seventies for Carlton, the results show a striking resemblance!

The old one is slightly more forgiving - less bright in Naim terms - but secure in the rough, and strikingly responsive to the task in hand with ultra crisp handling. Smooth and yet very direct ...

No doubt that I can get the brakes better on the old Carlton - the red one.

ATB from George

It looks a better size for you, George.

Dear Winki,

It is certainly a correct fit! I learned to use over-sized bikes over a very long time! This is the first bike that is the right size that I actually like!

ATB from George

 This a seriously nice looking piece of gear (2015 Super Record rear derailleur). A touch hard to keep clean, though.

Plan:

I have a quite comprehensive selection of spares including a choice of two rear derailleurs, and two spare crank-sets.

I'll get the frame restored at Argos Racing Cycles, Strip to the metal, check and if necessary remake any lug joints, and re-enamel, and I'll rebuild. It is forty five plus year old ...

I have thought that dark red metallic with the Carlton magnolia on the steering tube would be nice against aluminium mudguards and black tyres and a dark tan B 17 saddle!

Gearing would probably be 46 [front chainwheel] over 13 to 28 [five speed] on the freewheel, which would be as low as my green Carlton, but significantly shorter on top cog ...

ATB from George