Nait5/CD5: Am I Set Up Properly?

Posted by: kj burrell on 23 April 2004

I have:
Nait 5
CD5
FC2
Dynaudio 62
Naim interconnects
Chord Rumour
On wooden IKEA shelves, books on top of Amp and FC
Room 14 x 28 - knocked through Victorian, speakers at narrow end of room
All in place, at least 4 months old, run in and so on.

Last night, for the first time in a while I had the place to myself, I pulled the speakers away from the wall, took off the grilles, turned up the volume and.. it was a right mess Frown. I was playing some loud noisy rock - Primal Scream, Nirvana, MBV, YLT; also some quieter stuff - Nick Cave, Calexico, and found that, once the volume went above half way the sound got very confused, treble was sharp and harsh, bass booming and muddy and both bass and treble leaking into the vocals which are clear and well defined at 5 o'clock, which seems to be the optimum point for clarity of sound: and at this level it sounds mighty fine.

Is it just the consequence of the amp being relatively low wattage? Am I pushing it too hard? Certainly my previous two amps - a NAD 3020i and and Arcam 8R kept more control of the music at higher volumes.

From what I've read on the forum over the past months the Nait 5 seems criticised for not being exciting enough - if this was any more "exciting" it would push me to the floor, flip me over, put on the cuffs and ... you get the idea! Is this Tom Aves idea of polite behaviour!!!

Have I got something wrong in the set-up? Should I keep the volume down? Do I need new ears?

Kevin
Posted on: 23 April 2004 by Geoff P
No answers only questions, sorry.

1) You say 5.00 on the volume control. Where is "zero" on your volume control. When I had a 112 mine started out at 9.00, but the knob is easy to remove and put back in a different orientation. 5.00 would be way "HIGH" on mine.

2) Did you move the speakers out into the room and just plonk them down in what looked like a good place or did you try moving them around. Room effects can be murder, when the room length "doubles" some frequencies you will get "boom".

Finally did the speakers sound a lot worse back in their old position? Do the Dynaduio's need wall reinforcement or are they suppode to be away from the walls?

regards
GEOFF
Posted on: 23 April 2004 by JonR
KJ,

Others will doubtless have more knowledgeable replies but I have one or two things to suggest that may or may not be of interest:-

1) I personally would not, as a rule, turn the volume on my amp much beyond the 11 o'clock point, especially on an integrated. If you're going to listen at ear-splitting volumes then consider a pre-power combo. I doubt the Nait 5 has the kind of control required to give you a coherent sound at such high volumes. I use a NAC112/NAP150 (with FC2) and even then would not consider 'half-way' volume for longer than a few minutes (maybe it's me that needs new ears.. Eek).

2) What is the efficieny of your speakers? Perhaps it is such that they are not compatible with your Nait 5, especially given your music tastes (some of which I share!), and as a result could lead to you pushing the amp too hard. This would almost certainly lead to the results you have experienced IMO.

Hope that helps.

Regards,

JonR
Posted on: 23 April 2004 by kj burrell
Geoff/Jon
thanks for the replies.
Geoff:
1)volume clarification. I was, I realised once I'd posted, being imprecise. I've set my volume control so off is at 7pm> dostorion kicks in once I've gone half way round - so really noon rather than 6 - 5 hours round, anyway!
2) The speakers are usually against the wall - 6inch clearance max. Considerations of layout in a family space dominate. The best position is 2 ft from the wall, about 8 ft apart, toed in .
Jon
From other postings the Dyns seem well reviewed with the 5 series. I think more people have used the 52s but the 62s are pretty similar.

Cheers
Kevin
Posted on: 23 April 2004 by Greg Beatty
I understand the Dyns to dip down to 2ohms or less in impedence when the bass kicks in. I may be wrong in this...but Dyns are not an easy load. That, and needing distance from walls, are why I decided against them with my Nait 5/FC2 setup.

- GregB

Insert Witty Signature Line Here
Posted on: 23 April 2004 by David Stewart
KJ,
Might also be worth trying some alternative speaker cable. I tried Rumour2 with a Nait3 into my Monitor Audios. The sound was similar to your description, in fact the Rumour really seemed to screw up the timing and produce what I can only describe as a 'smudgy' sound on some material.

The answer for me turned out to be QED Silver Anniversary. But, if I were you I'd try to borrow a set of Naim NACA5 cables from your dealer and see how you get on with them. They're generally recommended with Naim amps. If they dont float your boat, another well-tried option is DNM Reson.

Also you could do with putting the kit on a proper HiFi support system. Naim kit really doesn't like standing on IKEA shelves. For the time being you might get some improvement with some isolation feet under the electronics and errrrrrrrrr! remove the books!!

David

"Try not to get overly attached to a hypothesis just because it's yours." :Carl Sagan
Posted on: 23 April 2004 by billgpdx
quote:
Originally posted by kj burrell:
once the volume went above half way the sound got very confused, treble was sharp and harsh, bass booming and muddy and both bass and treble leaking into the vocals which are clear and well defined at 5 o'clock, which seems to be the optimum point for clarity of sound: and at this level it sounds mighty fine.

Is it just the consequence of the amp being relatively low wattage? Am I pushing it too hard? Certainly my previous two amps - a NAD 3020i and and Arcam 8R kept more control of the music at higher volumes.
Kevin


Kevin,

Were your previous two amps also driving the Dynaudios in the same room? In my case, after moving to a new house with a smaller room for the stereo, I experienced some of the same issues as you with an Arcam A85 driving a pair of Contour 1.3 mkII's. They liked to be pulled out at least 3 feet from the wall and liked 4 even better but my new room was too small to accomodate such positioning. Therefore I ended up with some of the same problems you are describing. In the past I had more room for them to breathe so to speak and things were alright.

Bill
Posted on: 23 April 2004 by Geoff P
Kevin

Since my questions others have pretty much covered most of the things to consider.

If you have to raise the volume control much more than the equivalent of a 1/3 rd of a turn to get to a reasonably loud listening level you just don't have enough power reserve for the speakers and you need to consider upping your amp power or looking at more efficient speakers.

It will all go pear shaped in the bass reagion first because that is where the most current is called for.

regards
GEOFF
Posted on: 24 April 2004 by kj burrell
Thanks folks.

I've had a worrying feeling since getting the Dynaidios thast I should have shopped around. They do sound great, give a very detailed sound, but the volume and power is missing sometimes... Trade in for Neats?

Kevin