Arguments for and against omnidirectional speakers

joe,

They can not only throw a near life-like scale of large orchestral music as well as have an abilitly to pin point and separate what's what, *if* appropriately set up in a largish room. They can propagate the music in a room. ( none of those fussy sweet spot business )

A good omni system reminded me of listening to a street musician outside. The music just flows without any boudaries.

Not so great omni set up, however, has a tendency to turn a music performance down to a wall paper effect. A room filling. yes. A huge stage. Yes.But they can lose an ability to sort out and organise and turn the music into a boring affair. Very easy for omni to lose a *focus*.

Other 'against' I can see is that some of 'em are extremely inefficient. ( MBL for example )

Speaker below are at 115dB @ stable 8 ohm load ( altho, they still need a decent power, not as bad as MBL ) and one of the better omni directional speakers I have heard.

NBS Omni speakers

One more against for some is that they need plenty of free space to sound their best unlike Naim speakers.

I vote against omni radiating speakers.
In a good two channel recording done in
a concert hall, the well placed mics have
picked up both the direct and reflected
hall sounds - I think it is the job of the
speakers to be the inverse of a microphone -
a point source with placement to minimise
room reflections and problems.
There is no doubt that omni speakers and
surround sound can both be very impressive
and pleasing, but it also does depend on your goals -
are you trying to recreate the sound of an orchestra
or musicians playing in the concert hall or their
sound as if playing in your listening room.
I also think that the smaller your listening room
is - the less one should try omni or dipole speakers.
It is less important if you have a very large room
and can place the speakers where the room boundaries
play less of a role in the sound of your system.

Bryan
The Gramophone

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a point source with placement to minimise room reflections and problems.

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The idea with a properly working and set up omnidirectional speaker is to induce many room reflections. In fact so many, and so often, and from so many different directions, that the listeners brain can't differentiate betwean them. Think of it as something like a white noise superimposed on the music.

And that is nearly impossible with a typical direct radiating loudspeaker.

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I also think that the smaller your listening room is - the less one should try omni or dipole speakers.

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Most probably true!

JohanR

Joe, I am an avid fan of Shahinian speakers. I use Shahinian Arcs. These are upward firing, with a rear ABR. They are truely excellent speakers. I have to say that I have heard some appalling multi/poly/omni directional speakers. I have also heard good and bad installations of panel, electrostatic, infinite baffle, ported, dual driver, multi-driver etc speakers.

I don't believe the Arcs reproduce the sound of a concert hall, or the sound of the musicians as though they are playing in my room. But I have yet to hear anything that does. They allow me to hear music and rhythm, to enjoy what I am listening to. I feel as though the musicians/composer are communicating with me. They work in my room and I can afford them.

So I'm for good speakers and against bad speakers!

Noel

I am for right music reproduction and against
wrong music reproduction.

O.J.(beerdrinkingandnoticingatthemomentthattherearespeakersontheendofthecablescomingoutofhisnaim )

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Originally posted by o.j.:
I am for right music reproduction and against
wrong music reproduction.

O.J.(beerdrinkingandnoticingatthemomentthattherearespeakersontheendofthecablescomingoutofhisnaim )

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So OJ, what you drinking? I'd like to try some.

Willy.

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Originally posted by Audio Visionary:
I vote against omni radiating speakers.

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Bryan,

Which omni speakers did you try?

Well, lets see: over the years quite a few different approaches to dispersion.

Castle Winchesters
Heil Kitharas
MBL big mothers
Mirage dipoles
Bose 901 and others of that ilk
Maggies, Martin Logans, Accoustats, Final

Very few were omni radiating at all frequencies
mostly one octave or two at the most, most were
dipoles of some sort or another
- some like the very fine new Neats with the top
firing tweeters and super tweeters sound quite
fantastic but are mostly front firing.
As I wrote before, in a big room you have the
chance to be more experimental with
fewer chances to really screw up.
Has anyone heard an affordable omni - say less than
2000Euro that they believe works in most rooms?

Bryan
The Gramophone

Hy there!intention of omnidirekt speakers is
to imitate omnidirekt instruments.
microphones are most not omnidirectional.(work
directional similar to our ears(also not omnidirectional.
Technical wrong idea to imitate instruments.
Right idea would be to reproduce frequencies.
conventional speakers are able to reproduce
indirect sound by phaseshifted sound given on the record.(Talking about stereo)
Imitating is n o t reproducing.
Knowing a lot of omnidirectional speakers like
Ohm,mbl,some models of triangle.And every day somebody invents new ones.
imo always a technical and acoustical waterloo.
O.J.

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Originally posted by Audio Visionary:

Has anyone heard an affordable omni - say less than
2000Euro that they believe works in most rooms?

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I'm afraid not. The most inexpensive pair I have heard thus far is Duvel Bella Luna at 7K$.

Omni speakers must be difficult to execute right as planar/electrostats or horns. But, I like the idea.

There was once a great deal more popular interest in wall reflection and omni-directionals designs than there is today. Particularly in the magazine published DIY designs. Tricolumns, Paralines etc.

One may assume that the breed died out simply because they did not supply the illusion of pin-point imagary. These earlier designs were often an attempt to spread the image to cope with mono.

A stereo wall reflector design by Stig Carlsen (OA series) and the Gradient are used in hifi show demonstrations by the designer of Gamut (née Sirius) amps. The spread of sound is remarkable and probably suits his packed demonstrations rather better than direct radiators.

Nime

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Originally posted by Fredrik Fiske:

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Originally posted by joe90:
Read a site recently saying that all musical instruments are polyradial in their sound dispersion characteristics, therefore only omnidirectional loudspeakers can possibly work.

Comments for and against???

Joe90

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Cannot possibly work! Microphone[s] do not record the intrument[s] from the the omni-perspective! But from a single point usually somewhat closer than the optimal listening postion. Therefore production or replay only possible from single point [ie. a speaker per channel] Can only lead to diffusion of the instrumental focus. Not good or possible. Bad idea. Think mono and acoustic reproduction. Poor timbre, but nothing more focussed musically.

Fredrik Fiske

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Hy Fredrik!Very well explained!Hope it helps to stop those fatamorgana hunters and to get better systems
to enjoy m u s i c .

O.J.

It's worth mentioning that Bang & Olufsen's new BeoLab 5 speakers are also a variant on the omnidirectional theme.

Though not quite my cup of tea, These speakers are impressive and represent a 'real attempt' by B & O to design audiophile speakers.

Steve Margolis
defy convention - make music

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Originally posted by 7V:
It's worth mentioning that Bang & Olufsen's new BeoLab 5 speakers are also a variant on the omnidirectional theme.

Though not quite my cup of tea, These speakers are impressive and represent a 'real attempt' by B & O to design audiophile speakers.

Steve Margolis
_defy convention - make music_

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Hy Steve!
B&o attempt is sounddesign adapted to modern living design.possible to hear the music but not possible to listen to it .Would place those
speakers in the middle of a gulf place to hear
the news every hour not depending where i am putting at the moment.( a little bit drunken but i think i ve got the point)
O.J