Stress

No employment is worth that kind of crap.

You work to live not the other way round.

I was a teacher for a year - I held down my 12 month contract at the end of which I was ready to reapply for other posts. This was a very stressful job as most teachers will confirm!

Then my gaffer of the taxi firm I had worked for to pay my way through teacher training offered me the possibility of self employment with guaranteed work through what is the busiest firm in my home town.

I snapped his hand off (almost)and I've not looked back since.

I never have to set an alarm clock as I work the evening shift and the money is as good as I make it.

I am my own boss and feel part of a family.

Ok I could do the same job as an illiterate dunce but nobody can take my degree and teacher status away from me.

I'm happy and fairly stress-free - and that is what life is really all about.

If a boss makes you feel physically sick, tell him to shove his job where the sun don't shine.

Life's too short!



Regards,

Steve.

I've been in the same exact boat. My advice:

- Exercise regularly: It will put you in a better state of mind, you'll sleep better, and you'll be more able to concentrate at work.

- Check your diet to make sure it hasn't slipped into crapdom.

- Present a thorough case to management as to the current resource problem, and an alternative plan. Sometimes they have no clue how their random due dates stress entire organizations.

- Take a careful look at your personal finances, and find out how long the average person is out of work in your area. Plan for that, and more.

- See a career counselor if there's uncertainty regarding what you want to do next. Family and friends are good for this too.

- This sounds silly, but make a list of all the things currently causing you stress, then check off those you can't control. Keep it with you to remind yourself.

- Most important IMO- communicate openly with the people closest to you. You'll need a support system if you do resign.

If you do resign, reconsider your priorities. That's all of Dr. Ludwig's corny advice for now. Good luck.

hi Spock,
Regarding Work Related Stress
e-mail me at arthur.bird@tesco.net
oldie.

Spock,

If you are experiencing physical symptoms due to the pressure then it would be worth going to a doctor and seek there advice, hopefully they will give you some symphathy, they might recommend that you take time off work, then your employer will take note, however, your employer will not look favourably on you if you starting taking what would appear to be sickie's. If you get a letter or similiar from your doctor saying that you are suffering from stress and need to take time off then you should go and discuss that with your employer, if they listen and are happy to discuss (realising they have pushed you too far) then excellent, if they don't start looking for alternative work whilst your current employer is hopefully paying you to recover. If you are in software there should be a far few options withing commuting distance of Swindon.

And definitely start getting exercise, suggest you try and get out of the office every lunch time and run or something similar, the exercise will help dissipate some of the adrenalin that can build up when under stress and if you get used to it the endorphins will give you something of a buzz every lunch time.

Last straw, get in touch with Mick and pursued him to let you come taste all his whiskey....

Matthew

To echo what has been said before, no job is worth making yourself ill for.

A few years ago I was working on a project that was seriously under resourced and had ridiculous timescales. I was technical team leader and I had said at the start that the timescales (imposed by the need to win the contract) were impossible. I ended up working long hours and week-ends for a couple of months and never saw daylight at all (it was winter). The latest I was at my desk was 8:00 and that was on a Sunday. At the end of the project, during the acceptance tests, they went well and the pressure was off and so was I. I had to have a week off sick through exhaustion.

Remember, most deadlines are artificial (only a small number aren't e.g. 01/01/2000 00:00) and if they are missed does it really matter, other than financially. Whenever I make estimates for work I find that they are hacked to bits by the management to something unrealistic. It's not my estimate then so why get stressed if it is not completed 'on time'. Why make yourself ill so someone else can profit?

You say that you have emailled your directors, have you missed out any layers of management? This sort of thing is often best discussed with your direct line manager and they get a bit upset if you go above their heads, or maybe they are powerles to act.

You don't say whether it is a large or small software house you work for. I've done both, the benefit of a large one is that sometimes you get breathing space between projects which allow you to relax a little and refresh your skills. Small ones don;t tend to have the sort of slack to allow for that.

I have also worked for an end user organisation and have vowed never to do that again! It does suit some people, but I like a change every now and again, also the career options for senior technical staff are severely limited.

I am now contracting. I walk away at the end of the day and forget about work. (Yes I am at work now but the database is down so I can't do anything anyway, but I'm not going to get stressed about it.) If you have marketable skills then it is an option, the market does seem to be picking up.

hope it goes well...

Try asking yourself how badly the world needs another piece of software. (serious)

Brian OReilly

Agree with all the suggestions - but get your situation documented by your doctor (not the company doctor) so that you can produce an audit trail if your employer is tempted to turn nasty.

If they are reasonable they will get very concerned and want to help.

Derek

<< >>

A few thoughts.

Stress is inevitable, indeed it may be necessary to an extent. When it starts to make you ill then you need the insight to realise this, however I'd suggest for many people a stress-free life may be less interesting or challenging. Many people actively seek stressful jobs (although they may not admit it).

Work the problem. Get professional help, and personal help. Lots of resources for stress management techniques-your employer might even fund them rather than lose their investment in you. Also get personal help from people who know you, understand you.

Deal with the causes but do not bash your head against a locked door. By this I mean, it is no use ranting at your work environment or personalities at work if they are simply not going to change. Others have emphasised this too. Use your energies to work on the possible.

Look within. Have you felt like this before? Is it a pattern in other jobs? Honestly appraise how you are managing the problem, and wether you can do it better. Consider if the problems are partly because of the way you work, the way you interact with colleagues, the mechanisms you have to deal with stress. Plan your spare time and relaxation as much as you do your work diary. Don't just blame everybody else for causing you stress-it will be a shared responsibility!

Do not make big decisions whilst you are feeling ill. Feeling pressured can (and probably does) make you less rational/logical. It also makes you work less efficiently. Make small steps to feeling better but take big decisions coolly and carefully. The situation at work may be poor but it may look worse than it actually is because you are ill. If you have to take time off to take a calmer view then do so-aided by your (stressed) GP.

Prioritise at work, and at home. Big jobs need breaking into small bits, do the achievable first. Place your physical and mental health high up the list, ensure not all your energy is used up at work.

Chew over that lot!

Bruce

I've been there, too and the advice above is all pretty good. A couple more tips are to cut out caffeine completely - this made a huge difference for me, switch to herbal tea, you might take a while to get used to the taste, but it is worth the effort. Also, stop drinking alcohol, I have found that while it relieves the symptoms in the short term, it just makes things worse later on.

quote:

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Originally posted by BLT:
Also, stop drinking alcohol, I have found that while it relieves the symptoms in the short term, it just makes things worse later on.

---

Could be very important advice, alcohol consumption can get out of hand very quickly and very insidiously.

There are only three ways to reduce your stress response level:

• Remove the stressor.
  
• Change your response, through self-talk, exercise, etc.
  
• Get more emotional support from friends, family, church, etc.
  

As to dealing with unreasonable demands in the workplace, I took a great course once that taught a fantastic method for dealing with these demands. When someone asks you take on a task, respond something like this:

quote:

---

I would be happy to do it for you. Now which other thing do you want me to drop, so that I can do this instead. It's completly up to you, and I'll do whatever task you choose.

---

If it's two managers fighting for your resourses, let them fight amongst themselves, until they resolve who's going to get your services first.

-=> Mike Hanson <=-

See a doctor and if necessary talk to a professional about your stress, there may be a more serious problem underlying the work issues. I wouldn't recommend a breakdown...

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tom Alves:
Your employer has a duty of care and is legally liable if you have a breakdown caused through work.

---

Tom! Welcome back. I can feel the stress level of the forum going down already.

Regards,
Davie

Following on from Mike Hanson's comment - when I was being asked to do an unreasonable amount in the time given I would ask them how long it would take 9 women to produce a baby - a month or 9 months - this often removed the blind demands

Derek

<< >>

Spock,

Lots of sound advice here. Are you also experiencing dietary problems? For example I eat junk when stressed especially cakes! The sleep paterns vary wildly. Alcohol will definitley make this much worse in the long term.

Exercise works very well, however, you do not have to become an Olympic athlete. I have found things like fell walking work well or even cycling, preferably off road.

Find someone you trust and whose opinion you value, talk. If this fails see your doctor. Remember if you have career aspirations being a stress victim on record will hinder that. Your health is far more important though.

If you find a good cure let me know!

Milan

quote:

---

Find someone you trust and whose opinion you value, talk. If this fails see your doctor.

---

I'll assume that was an unintentional slur

Bruce

Spock,

You have my sympathy on this one. I went through a very similar situation a couple of years ago.

My employer was expecting me to do an inordinate amount of travelling on top of my normal 7.5 hours per day. I was averaging about an extra 6 hours travelling per day. This was compunded by the fact that the team I worked in was severly understaffed (I work in IT by the way). I understood that travelling around the country was part of my job, but being expected in Exeter one day and in Durham the next and to do a 7.5 hour day on site at eah was asking a bit much. Add to that, that I did not get paid for my travelling, I figure that I was getting a rough deal.

My employer then imposed targets for the technical engineers - each engineer had to do 12K worth of jobs per month, otherwise we got verbal warnings. How can an engineer be set monetary targets? Surely if the sales people haven't sold the engineers time, it can't be the engineers fault.

After approximately 18 months of this I started to suffer from the symptoms that you have described, and at one point was ready for ending it all.

I eventually took advice and went to see the doctor. He put me on a course of anti-depressants and wanted to put me on the sick. Unfortunately I didn't get paid if I was off sick so couldn't afford to take time off. When I showed the doctor the hours I had been having to work he was not happy, even if I had been paid for the hours I shouldn't have been doing them. The doctor also advised me to make a list of the issues that were bothering me at work and raise them with my bosses in a calm and rational manner.

This is where my problems really started. As soon as I mentioned that I had been to the doctors, my management dragged me into an office and hauled me over the coals, saying that I wasn't a team player and that they had had numerous complaints about me from customers (which they named). They critisised my appearence and my time-keeping (which is impeccable). All this they put in a written warning that they asked me to sign (I refused).

Out of interest, a friend I still have in the company, checked with the customers about the so-called complaints. Not one customer had made any kind of complaint whatsoever, in fact what they had to say was quite the opposite.

I then raised the issue of the number of hours I was working. After reading some literature on the internet I found that we are entitled to a minimum of 11 hours break from work (including sleep) by law. I mentioned this to my employers who said that I was being unreasonable to want 11 hours off from work per day. So basically they wanted me to work 13 hours a day for 7.5 hours pay.

In the end we had numerous meetings regarding this, but my employers just started making my life more and more difficult. Jobs further away, more long days etc...

All this cam to a head when I needed to go to London to do a job. In the past I had always caught the train, and so had all my colleagues. When I called the office to make the arrangements the FD came on and said that I had to use my car and that I had to travel from Manchester to London on the same day, do my 7.5 hours then drive back. I kicked up a fuss about this and eventually he caved and limited the amount I could spend on expenses, including hotel and train. This amount was £100. I eventually managed to find a hotel for £50 and a train for £70, slightly over. Unfortuantely for the cheaper train ticket I had to castch the train at a specific time from Manchester (17:00). When I informed my employers that I needed to finish an hour or so earlier to get the train they insisted that I took 1/2 days leave to make up for it. No mention of the extra hours I had done over the years.

It was at this point that I broke down and couldn't carry on. I found myself screaming with rage and banging my head on the car steering wheel. When I eventually calmed down I decided enough was enough. I went home and registered with an agency to find a new job. You would be surprised at the amout of stress that was relieved by just doing this one thing. Fortunately I got an interview the following week and was offered the job the following day. I am still there now. The job may not be the best in the world, but it is relatively stress free. I still get a little pressure from time to time, but that goes with working in IT.

So, my advice would be to register with some agencies, get the interviews and get the job.

Good Luck

Regards

Regards

Mark ;0)

Another one who's been there too.For me it helped a lot by talking to my wife and friends about it. It gave me different views and made me see the problem as it really was. And as BLT already pointed out don't drink too much ! It gives you relief in the short term but make things worse at the end.
Good luck.

Rob.

My God this is depressing. I’ve also been there. As have many of my colleagues, all in the IT world, mainly software development or management. For me it came to a head about 8 years ago when I was an IT Manager. I was expected to acquire a completely new set of skills which were absolutely fundamental to a project I was managing at the same time. I was having to plan and make decisions about a technology I knew little about (or nothing in some cases). All of this with a budget way under what was required, and with half the number of staff I needed, none of whom had the appropriate skills. I got to the stage where I just couldn’t bear the thought of going to work the next day, and couldn’t get to sleep without an unhealthy amount of booze to distract me.

After more than a year of this I started having trouble with one of my eyes and when I went to the doctor my BP was 230/180. I was sent to the hospital where I had my eyes checked (thankfully no permanent damage has been done) and told I needed to see my GP again that day – I couldn’t wait until the following day. I was put on Beta Blockers and told to come back the following day (Friday) for a further check as I couldn’t risk having that BP over the weekend. There followed a prolonged absence from work and many GP appointments and changes of medication so that I’m now stable and relatively low risk, albeit on medication for the rest of my life. I’m quite convinced that I was within weeks or even days of a heart attack or stroke, caused largely by work related stress. I can’t blame it entirely on work as there is a family history of this sort of thing, but not generally until later in life.

Sorry to drag on, but if you’re seriously affected by your job, and especially if you have a family history of high blood pressure etc, see your doctor right away.

A few years ago whilst almost single handedly updating our procedures I worked 42 days without a day off (including weekends), with a minimum of 7 or 8 hours a day. Looking back I realise I was exhausted and sadly my answer was to indulge in more alcohol and 'jazz woodbines', sadly a year later I did enter the mental illness arena.

I'm not saying work was the only component in my decline but it certainly didn't help.

Reading the posts it seems being overworked may be fairly common, with sometimes disasterous results....

Thanks for the time out many of you have taken to write considered replies to this post. Your comments are very much appreciated.

The advice is all solid stuff and the more you hear it the more it makes sense. The good news is I have not turned to the bottle and will steer well clear, I have noticed the diet now mostly consists of pies and fast food etc, I intend to sort this pronto and also get a light exercise regime established.

Since making this post I have become aware of a colleague of mine who has also made a similar complaint which makes my own position that much stronger.

I'm sure stress can be found in a huge variety of jobs but my gut feeling is the IT industry in particular seems to make this a speciality and this is certainly reflected in some of the comments on here. Misguided Fools comments re travelling for 6 hours and then expecting a 7.5 hour day out of you is also common pratice where I work. This industry needs a complete kick up the arse or a decent high profile court case with major damages awarded before things will change for the better. For the moment however, the Salesmen will still be saying YES to everything their clients demand regardless of any ability to deliver what has been promised. You can't blame them they get sacked if they don't reach their targets. If they do reach their targets the bar is raised for the next cycle. It makes no sense.

I'm not a quiter and taking a trip to the Doc's or not is a real big decision for me, if I go I will be signed off, period. As comments on here suggest there is no way back from here. Good news is that Mrs Spock is 100% behind me in whatever I decide to do which is more than you could wish for. It does make me feel guilty about spending 7K on my system when I should have spent it on her and the kids, still can't do anything about that now so I'll just have to hang on to it!

Thanks again for the support and advice.

Spock

Good Man Spock

Anyone ever tried Buddhism and a Buddhist meditation retreat?

I don't subcribe to the full-on religion but the underlying principles and the meditation practice has realy worked for me.

Also seems to be doing the trick for others too, the classes are full of teachers and IT sales people ...

Remember, nothing realy exists, it's all a construct of mind. Control the mind and you then have the choice about being happy.

Spock,
Going to the doctor is not quitting. There's a fair possibility that hassle like this could affect your blood pressure. From what I've seen over the years HBP is another hazard of the IT business - a largely sedentary job and high levels of stress even when things are going well make an unhealthy combination.

Good on yer Tom, I'm very pleaased to hear that it's working out for you slowly
but surely mate. Generally some good advice given out by various factions there,
though everybody male and female is a different h-case so to speak, and must be
handled in view of their own circumstances as unfortunately some
societies/communities still do shun and regard stress related illness as a
weakness (mainly due to ignorance and stupidity) but often as not by people in
positions of power over the individuals concerned, compounding the situation
even further.
High blood pressure can be fatal if not dealt with professionally &
without delay, a physical side-effect of (Negative)stress, and the Root-Cause of
the "problem" can be, and often is psychological compounded by everyday madness
getting totally out of control, and yes I do know what I'm talking about (no
suprises there !), thank you. As afterthought No 1., if one just doesn't get on,
or see eye to eye with ones Doctor, change them asap, you know your own body and
mind better than any other individual, and therefore are ultimately resposible
for it, so avoid getting into the blame everybody else "Culture" for ones own
woes, as it takes one absolutely nowhere except futher down the pan, innit.

Fritz Von Nuffsaidiain'tnoshrinkthankgawd


Keep On Runnin: It's much much harder without a trainer/teacher/Sgt Major kickin
you up the arse, but so much more satisfying when you get into the "excercise"
rhythum, I personally run alone, others need company or music, but the end
result is similar, and food and beer (within reason-when allowed ?) taste so
much better, when ones weight is at a level acceptable to onesself, afterall
this brilliant body of ours is designed to move and be active by nature herself,
and not to be constantly sitting in on internet fori for the "sad & Lonely"
being virtually sporty, and subsequently spotty.

N.B. I've taken anti stress cum B-Blockers daily for 20 years now, and will
always have to do so to enjoy my healthy lifestyle? (which sometimes loses its
momentum). Self-dicipline is easy to say, and people talk talk a lot, walkin the
walk is another story, so it's really up to the individual, can't say more than
that really, and what little help they can get by with naturally from their
friends (if they have any left ?) Change of lifestyle, diet, etc, etc, try Gout,
now there's a laugh to cheer yers up, obvious innit Tom ! Finally ?, I roll
through my own little film childless; so on that point I'm without experience
(fortunately - meaning alongside stress & breakdown) and I'm sure it's far
worse? but as a no-no I've also found it good sense personally (rare) to avoid
too much contact with serious boozers, user & abusers cum other depressives in
their own rights, as you end up going round in a very dangerous and mind-blowing
circle, irrellevant of how tasty and perfect she/he may be, or best life-long
buddies or not !!! Bottom Line, "If yer dinnie look after No 1. first, yer
cannie conceivably look after anybody else, now can yee ? Cos nobody's
gonna do it for yer and that's a fact that can't be disputed (for once) Obvios
innit Tom !

P.P.S. I deny any refuse absolutely any responsibility for any persons acting
upon the experiences and comments I've expressed on the above post, innit. F.v.
Big Risky & Assoc's, "Imperial War Museum" S.Kesington, London. (Formally
Beldam):

"I think I experienced my first mid-life crisis when I was 11 ?"

Spock

I have sacked people who were stressed. Not nice but I was under pressure myself. Therefore I can see both sides.

You have to play your cards carefully. No one will even be interested in employing someone who quit a job because of stress. Rightly or wrongly there is a stigma attached to mental illness.

Your best bet is to get "cured" and leave your present employer on your own terms at a later date.

Your first priority is to get medical help. You need to have a clear head because if this continues, you are fighting for survival.

Let your boss know that you are under medical survielance because that will stop him acting rashly and he will have to watch his back. If he messes this up...he becomes the scapegoat. No boss want to be seen as dragging his company into a tribunal.

Make it clear that although he has contributed to your stress, you want to get over it and put it behind you but if he sinks you, he gets dragged down. The old expression of " I will meet you in hell" will scare the shit out of him. If he gets the blame for unfairly treating you, then his career is as dead as yours.

Get him on your side, if that means a bit of crawling or asslicking then do it. Invite him around for dinner or a meal out. It works.

If he thinks that he can be seen to turn a stressed out failure into a good employee, then thats a feather in his cap. Pander to his emotions. It works.

All the advice that you have received so far is good from the medical sense, but you need to look after yourself in the office. If you are doing long hours in a car, ring him up on your mobile when on the motorway asking for his valuable advice, when he gives it, as he will, let his boss know how grateful you are. It will consolidate your position and he can hardly say your useless if you act on his advice.

You just need to think and play the politic game. The world is full of idiots who survive because they play their cards well.

We both live in swindon, if you want a chat or a meet, just give me a call.

Regards

Mick