Welcome to Fortress Brighton
Posted by: oldie on 26 September 2004
Having just returned from a Sunday afternoon trip out of town I have had my car and passengers videoed several times each way, whilst both leaving and returning to the town,all the main roads into and out of the city have Police video van units working 24 hours a day recording all traffic passing by them.
Several roads have been closed to the general public and barricaded, the main sea front road has been restricted from in places 3 lanes each way down to 1 lane each way, with a massive steel barrier down the center. There are more police armed with machine guns[ that are not suitable or accurate enough to be used in a area crowded with people]on the roof tops and patroling the streets around the sea front area than you would expect to see in Beirut. Van loads of coppers are being driven all over the city and hundreds if not a thousand or more plods are crawling all over the place, this is not to mention the bl--dy helicopters over head and the alleged warships patroling the sea lanes just of the coast. And why do the people of Brighton have to put up with being made prisoners in there own City? so that Blair and his circus can perform their staged and totaly controlled ritual before the worlds press. So much for our democracy and rights of freedom, you can't even move around in our own town without being eyed with suspicion by several gun toting black clad moronic looking coppers.
RANT OVER
Sorry, oldie.
Several roads have been closed to the general public and barricaded, the main sea front road has been restricted from in places 3 lanes each way down to 1 lane each way, with a massive steel barrier down the center. There are more police armed with machine guns[ that are not suitable or accurate enough to be used in a area crowded with people]on the roof tops and patroling the streets around the sea front area than you would expect to see in Beirut. Van loads of coppers are being driven all over the city and hundreds if not a thousand or more plods are crawling all over the place, this is not to mention the bl--dy helicopters over head and the alleged warships patroling the sea lanes just of the coast. And why do the people of Brighton have to put up with being made prisoners in there own City? so that Blair and his circus can perform their staged and totaly controlled ritual before the worlds press. So much for our democracy and rights of freedom, you can't even move around in our own town without being eyed with suspicion by several gun toting black clad moronic looking coppers.
RANT OVER
Sorry, oldie.
quote:
Originally posted by Tom Alves:
Economics isn't my forte, mind you judging by some of the arguments here I'd say not it isn't for many of us.
The world of economics is ruled by 101 very different but correct answers.
Mike
Talking of taxation in Brighton and token lefties, and asscociating oneself with
Professional academic 'Talkers', and falling into the old trap of "I'm somehow
on par with these jonnies," something else came to mind, besides ego trips still
not paying the rent. Unlike most of you Guys & Gals, I see UK from a permanently
distant position, which is very different from someone who travels on business
within Europe/Germany, or is even based there for a few years, as you never lose
your sense of I'm going home one day, etc, where as here is genuinly my
permanent home, as a full European, London born.
I've read through all of the
taxation interpretations, and as you may or may not know keep fairly well up to
date on current affairs on the island (as it's known)and make my own informed
judgements which I even on occassion share with this cell, though very very
rarely, as mostly I find it humorous and not to be taken seriously. In 2007 the
British Post Office will very likely be taken over by Deutsche Post, and you'll
enjoy some real service as well as market forces unemployment on a big scale,
and those releaased (as with present Jaguar redundencies) will be forced to take
short-term/part-time/agency/lower paid contracts (ie, much less future
psychological & fiscal stability for the in many cases highly trained engineers,
etc, etc ,etc, which subsequently normally results in yet more family
breakdowns and social unrest for already overstretched child street wardens and
mickey mouse coppers, and untrained prison/group 4 camp staff to harass and
tease in the guise of professional duty).
The Social effect (real effect can &
will be devastating and act as a cataliser for mass departures of the land)
Mick's lot leaving first /as usual) the European's will be blamed, the Euro
debate is larfable, George Bush or John Kerry will have no time what'sover for
Britain's problems (they are hard core Look after number one merchants, and
always will be)the great sadness to my mind is that the British have been conned
into believing that they're doing the same thing, and are well off with it. It
may have escaped your notice that I too am British and have the advantage of
contact with many levels of wealth/poverty over there in contrast to those of
you who remain in certain blocks & cliques of set/defined opinion, seemingly
unable to see yer asses /arses from yer elbows ? that's not mean't insultingly
in any way, and to be honest anybody who finds it so shouldn't be on here in the
first place. 99% of you will I suspect class this a another Fritz Europhile ex
Pat rant (and you'll be very very wrong)the 1% don't need to be told anyway.
Taking a bit of the best from (and for)everybody makes Jack a happy soldier in
the real world, the trick being to maintain that real stability by changing the
playing field on occassion. John Smith's untimely death gave the young brilliant
Blair his suprise early dash to the top which he took with a vengeance, but now
it's time to change, and not blow it. If he truly does love Britain and it's
future wealthfare this point and this point only should be his priority and not
another cycle of brilliant political survival on personal grounds to go a bit
longer, at which he's so brilliant, though at what price ?
I'm using informed
imagination here, give a dog endless food, and it will scoff, puke, scoff again,
until it kills itself, this is greed² and I refer to the credit boom going
uncontrollably through the roof (Vegas Style) I refer to the general blindness
of central power being ever more powerful once again, though you think it's
being spread out, and I refer to cheating, lying, corrupt, C.S. officials who
continually get paid off at public expense top make way for the next one, I
believe highly respectable pensioners recently had to protest in the streets of
London again, where's the justice ? Free TV licence for over 75's for
fuck's sake, what an insult to the Public's intelligence, token though it is,
and Murdoch etc rolling on larfin through to the next cabinet with the Beeb
being battered and torn and forever defiled, and nobody gives a fuckin monkeys.
Have a nice day, Now you're in €urope.
Graham George Von Thepricessroyal'sdoggyloveseatingfoxterriers
N.B. Tha majority of taxpayers pay from source via their employer and have no control over that, those self-employed are different animals, Mick me old flipper, dinnee confuse them my handsome, innit.
Professional academic 'Talkers', and falling into the old trap of "I'm somehow
on par with these jonnies," something else came to mind, besides ego trips still
not paying the rent. Unlike most of you Guys & Gals, I see UK from a permanently
distant position, which is very different from someone who travels on business
within Europe/Germany, or is even based there for a few years, as you never lose
your sense of I'm going home one day, etc, where as here is genuinly my
permanent home, as a full European, London born.
I've read through all of the
taxation interpretations, and as you may or may not know keep fairly well up to
date on current affairs on the island (as it's known)and make my own informed
judgements which I even on occassion share with this cell, though very very
rarely, as mostly I find it humorous and not to be taken seriously. In 2007 the
British Post Office will very likely be taken over by Deutsche Post, and you'll
enjoy some real service as well as market forces unemployment on a big scale,
and those releaased (as with present Jaguar redundencies) will be forced to take
short-term/part-time/agency/lower paid contracts (ie, much less future
psychological & fiscal stability for the in many cases highly trained engineers,
etc, etc ,etc, which subsequently normally results in yet more family
breakdowns and social unrest for already overstretched child street wardens and
mickey mouse coppers, and untrained prison/group 4 camp staff to harass and
tease in the guise of professional duty).
The Social effect (real effect can &
will be devastating and act as a cataliser for mass departures of the land)
Mick's lot leaving first /as usual) the European's will be blamed, the Euro
debate is larfable, George Bush or John Kerry will have no time what'sover for
Britain's problems (they are hard core Look after number one merchants, and
always will be)the great sadness to my mind is that the British have been conned
into believing that they're doing the same thing, and are well off with it. It
may have escaped your notice that I too am British and have the advantage of
contact with many levels of wealth/poverty over there in contrast to those of
you who remain in certain blocks & cliques of set/defined opinion, seemingly
unable to see yer asses /arses from yer elbows ? that's not mean't insultingly
in any way, and to be honest anybody who finds it so shouldn't be on here in the
first place. 99% of you will I suspect class this a another Fritz Europhile ex
Pat rant (and you'll be very very wrong)the 1% don't need to be told anyway.
Taking a bit of the best from (and for)everybody makes Jack a happy soldier in
the real world, the trick being to maintain that real stability by changing the
playing field on occassion. John Smith's untimely death gave the young brilliant
Blair his suprise early dash to the top which he took with a vengeance, but now
it's time to change, and not blow it. If he truly does love Britain and it's
future wealthfare this point and this point only should be his priority and not
another cycle of brilliant political survival on personal grounds to go a bit
longer, at which he's so brilliant, though at what price ?
I'm using informed
imagination here, give a dog endless food, and it will scoff, puke, scoff again,
until it kills itself, this is greed² and I refer to the credit boom going
uncontrollably through the roof (Vegas Style) I refer to the general blindness
of central power being ever more powerful once again, though you think it's
being spread out, and I refer to cheating, lying, corrupt, C.S. officials who
continually get paid off at public expense top make way for the next one, I
believe highly respectable pensioners recently had to protest in the streets of
London again, where's the justice ? Free TV licence for over 75's for
fuck's sake, what an insult to the Public's intelligence, token though it is,
and Murdoch etc rolling on larfin through to the next cabinet with the Beeb
being battered and torn and forever defiled, and nobody gives a fuckin monkeys.
Have a nice day, Now you're in €urope.
Graham George Von Thepricessroyal'sdoggyloveseatingfoxterriers
N.B. Tha majority of taxpayers pay from source via their employer and have no control over that, those self-employed are different animals, Mick me old flipper, dinnee confuse them my handsome, innit.
quote:
Originally posted by MichaelC:quote:
Originally posted by Matthew Robinson:
"It has been demonstrated in the past that a low tax environment gives rise to a greater tax yield"
It was been demonstrated that there is an optimum tax rate that maximises yield and that the previous assumption that ever higher tax rates = every higher yield is not correct. Replacing it with the notion that lower tax = higher yield is just making the same mistake the other way around.
Matthew
You are correct - my statement was a touch broad. Having said that I see at first hand the effect of taxation policies.
When tax rates are generally low all manner of people are quite content to pay taxes. When tax rates are high then some people start to resent paying their tax, some of those people will either enter into the more dubious (morally) but legal forms of tax avoidance whereas others simply suppress income for taxation purposes.
Until recently I would have said that people were generally content in paying their taxes. I now hear a marked increase in the number of people who are now complaining about the tax burden. If I am hearing this first hand then others are too and that almost certainly means that incomes will be surpressed for tax purposes. The effect of this is to reduce the amount of tax collected.
Having said that, one neat manouvre pulled off by Brown was to introduce taper relief relative to Capital Gains Tax. The taper relief effectively reduced the rate of CGT from 40% to 10% in repsect of business assets (thinking in particular relative to share sales). At a stroke Brown effectively killed off the off-shore planning industry. Although I do not know the underlying figures but the yeild from CGT in repsect of business asset sales leapt upwards. Brown clearly understood that to achieve the desired yeild he had to make people feel comfortable in paying their tax. In this instance they are.
I feel that recent budget changes are beginning to tip the balance. The headline rate of tax is now effectively 41% by virtue of the increase in NIC - something as subtle as that in conjunction with other measures is, I believe, having the wrong effect. It is a fine balance between setting rates of tax and the likely impact upon people's willingness to play ball.
I hasten to add that I will not condone any person failing to make a full & proper declaration of their income. If their has been a deliberate failure they are dealt with accordingly.
Cheers
Mike
Responsibilty starts at the top, Brown sold off 600 Publically owned properties
knowingly to a firm based in tax haven Bahamas, and it's been well publised as
you well know., costing the public purse Billions for years to come, as with
many other little tax breaks for PFI inspiered con-jobs for quick fixes that
leak terribly epon any kind of inspection. You all forget one simple aspect of
your perfect Tax Plans (Human Nature) if they can't be seen to be playing
cricket at the top, Why the fuick should anybody else follow suit, I ask you,
you'll be wanting window tax back again soon !
TRUST HAS TO BE ÈARNED NOT CAJOLED BY CROOKS & HYXPOCRYTS. who vanish from the
scene conveniently, leaving the mess, and bearing no culpabilizty, and please no
comments about being democratically voted in by the people, the gathering of tax
is not the problem, (that's the smokesscreen) the Problem² is the Policing of
its re-distribution, so What's New ?
Professional financiers & Lawyers naturally have a vested interest and will
continue talking in circles until the cows come home at no loss, when the
punters refuse to buy your 'Services' anymore or your 'Patter' you will have to
change pitch and also reconsider instead of assuming that the general public are
Stupid²
Citizen G.G.v.€uro
Obviously unenforcable/unwilling to enforce are good money earners too yer
Lordship, innit. Bit of Quality Control in certain industries from independant
professions might not be a bad idea ?
oldie,
Is it just possible that....
you have managed to finish this thread?
jon
Is it just possible that....
you have managed to finish this thread?
jon
No Jon, I don't think so,
UNFORTUNATLY last night I forgot the golden rule about debating, and that is never loose one's temper or resort to personal insults,for if one does, you forfit any claims of credibilty and last night I fell foul of the former
.So hence the apology.
But just to keep the ball rolling,
AS REPORTED ON BBC LOCAL[Southern Countys] RADIO this morning.
Another example of how money begets money and how unjust our systems are.
It would seem that the community tax[ old rates] on Blairs new £3.5 million pile is just £1200 per year[ aprox.] as it falls into the "H" band of assesment,the joke being that this amount is probable less than most people on this forum pay. It would make intersting reading to see just what value of property the "Men of New Labour" have I remember last year Mark Tomas did a report on Meacher and he had 8 houses in London I wonder how the rest of them stack up.
oldie [ in a more composed frame of mind
]
UNFORTUNATLY last night I forgot the golden rule about debating, and that is never loose one's temper or resort to personal insults,for if one does, you forfit any claims of credibilty and last night I fell foul of the former
.So hence the apology. But just to keep the ball rolling,
AS REPORTED ON BBC LOCAL[Southern Countys] RADIO this morning.
Another example of how money begets money and how unjust our systems are.
It would seem that the community tax[ old rates] on Blairs new £3.5 million pile is just £1200 per year[ aprox.] as it falls into the "H" band of assesment,the joke being that this amount is probable less than most people on this forum pay. It would make intersting reading to see just what value of property the "Men of New Labour" have I remember last year Mark Tomas did a report on Meacher and he had 8 houses in London I wonder how the rest of them stack up.
oldie [ in a more composed frame of mind
][QUOTE]Originally posted by Tom Alves:
I do hope not. I'm still waitng for Mick to answer the question I asked him about the Post Office workers.
I wonder if he thinks they are lazy because they are paid so little.
Tom,
If I was you I wouldn't hold my breath, Mick has never been very fast at answering questions that might have put him on the spot or that might have queried his credabiltyas he see's it, he probably thinks everybody is paid a pittance because we are all lazy compared to himself he probably thinks that whilst he was bunking off to Londons most expensive pie and chip cafe["Rules" been there and didn't rate it that high] not a single stamp was licked or piece of post moved
oldie.
I do hope not. I'm still waitng for Mick to answer the question I asked him about the Post Office workers.
I wonder if he thinks they are lazy because they are paid so little.
Tom,
If I was you I wouldn't hold my breath, Mick has never been very fast at answering questions that might have put him on the spot or that might have queried his credabiltyas he see's it, he probably thinks everybody is paid a pittance because we are all lazy compared to himself he probably thinks that whilst he was bunking off to Londons most expensive pie and chip cafe["Rules" been there and didn't rate it that high] not a single stamp was licked or piece of post moved
oldie.
D'yer reckon Our Tony will stay at Marky Mark's Gaff in South Afrique over the next day or two ?
A Bloke
A Bloke
quote:
Originally posted by Mick Parry:
Sorry I have not replied earlier but I have just got home from a days work keeping customers happy.
Regards
Mick
Mick and just how on earth do you do that? if you communicate with customers with the same distain and contempt you appear to have for most of the population it would seem that keeping them happy would be a very difficult task. Some how I can't see you in the role of Customer liaison officer, sorry manager,
it would be like putting Shipman in charge of a old peoples home SORRY TOM,
slap on the wrist duly accepted
my apoliges to MICK who is obviostly trying to make up for his years of riding on the backs of theeeeee Oppppppppps here I go again
oldie.
slap on the wrist duly accepted
my apoliges to MICK who is obviostly trying to make up for his years of riding on the backs of theeeeee Oppppppppps here I go again
oldie.
"I sometimes wonder why I bother but"
Mick you know why you bother ,you can't resist it, your just like a fish sniffing around a anglers bait we/I cast it in and you take it hook line and sinker But in all honesty I wouldn't have it any other way. As, has been said many times before I certainly do not nor would ever agree with you, no thats not true either, as If I remember I have agreed with you on a couple of occasions. But I would defend to the death, no thats not true either,perhaps I'd take a bit of a slapping, your right to be a complete ars---,Oppppp's I'm slipping again no sorry, your right to express your opinions freely
ps one of my roles at the Uni before[ ah well I wont go into that] was as the dept.Purchasing
"manager", but I found that being pleasant and polite gained the best results, but I bow before a expert.
Tom
slightly of thread but you have a question in the One for Tom thread.
oldie.
Mick you know why you bother ,you can't resist it,
your just like a fish sniffing around a anglers bait we/I cast it in and you take it hook line and sinker But in all honesty I wouldn't have it any other way. As, has been said many times before I certainly do not nor would ever agree with you, no thats not true either, as If I remember I have agreed with you on a couple of occasions. But I would defend to the death, no thats not true either,perhaps I'd take a bit of a slapping, your right to be a complete ars---,Oppppp's I'm slipping again no sorry, your right to express your opinions freely ps one of my roles at the Uni before[ ah well I wont go into that] was as the dept.Purchasing
"manager", but I found that being pleasant and polite gained the best results, but I bow before a expert.
Tom
slightly of thread but you have a question in the One for Tom thread.
oldie.
quote:
Originally posted by Tom Alves:
p.s. At least I haven't been accused of whinging
... yet.