Well, I finally got a chance to hear David Antonelli's system. For all of you who don't know, he listens to:
CDSII/XPS
52/supercap
250
Headline with Sennheiser headphones (model???)
Royd Albions soon to be replaced by WB Act Two's
WB stands for the CDSII and the equipment
First of all, let me say thanks to Dave for allowing me to hear his system. He's a nice, laidback guy. Almost exactly what I pictured since I am used to Chemistry professors. Just picture a Chemistry grad student (or any other grad student for that matter). Apparently he has great taste in wine, although I'm no oenophile so he was sort of wasting his breath on me. I guess that's the next phase of my maturation after becoming an audiophile 
Alright, I have to begin by saying that his system was a let down but this can be attributed to one word -- APARTMENT! Although it's very nice and has angled ceilings, it's unsuitable for a good listening environment causing all sorts of problems. I recommended another location for his speakers, but I'm not sure if it will help matters or not. Also I wonder if his power was sufficient. I know it was a bad time for power but still...
I also think I was expecting too much from the Albions. I've never heard them before and after hearing the Sorcerers at Petrik's old place, I thought I would hear an enhanced Sorcerer at Antonelli's place. Sadly, this was not the case. I guess they are really picky about their environment. Even Dave admitted they sounded better at his dealer's shop. The midrange was beautiful but the two extremes are a different story. Bass was not what it should be and the treble wasn't as smooth as I was expecting either. Again, I think it all comes down to the room. Then again, I guess $4000 speakers on the end of a $50,000 system might not be ideal. I won't be hearing his Act Two's any time soon but I'm sure Dave will comment on the transformation of his system. I have my doubts whether the 250 is enough for them, but I already voiced my opinion about that to Dave.
The CDSII is a great player but I think it was being held back. Hearing it through the Headline was another story though! Amazing, simply amazing. Those Senn's are wonderful but since I'm not experienced in headphones, I can't really comment. They sounded great to me! I can see why Dave prefers them to the 250/Albions.
Listening to his system through the Albions allows the Nat 03 to shine moreso than the CDSII. The tuner sounded wonderful overall.
I'm sure 135's would help matters some but after hearing the 500, nothing else even comes close.
Oh yeah Vuk, the Corrs sounded better at Antonelli's place so it's your bare CDX that's holding back your CD listening. If you had a CDSII, I don't know if you would consider your P9 as your primary source. There are reported cases of people selling their expensive turntables after buying their CDSIIs.
So, who's next???
Posted on: 10 December 2000 by David Antonelli
Arun,
Thanks for coming by. I feel pretty much the same as you do about the albions in my room. That's why their time has come. The WB ACT 1s sound a lot better in my apartment than the Albions do (about a supercap's worth of difference and then some). Having borrowed 135s before and seeing that the difference in my system was large but nowhere near as great as the step from Albions to Act 1s, I opted on ACT 2s with my 250. As for the 500, just too expensive for me now. Maybe a year or two down the road. My system with ACT 1s was by far the best system I have ever heard (with Cardas Neutral, of course (he he)) and that includes CDS2/52/135s NBL and a full blown levinson system with Mezzo Utopias. But I haven't heard a 500 based system yet.
As for arun, he's a very cool guy and thanks for the chocolates. A true gentleman indeed. BTW That bottle of wine I showed you is the best Chambertin since the legendary 1949 LeRoy. I guess if I hadn't bought so much wine I might have a 500 by now, but hey, life is for living. Let someone like Mme. LeRoy have some of my money instead of naim for once.
Now we open the floor for an attack by Vuk...
daveô
Posted on: 10 December 2000 by David Antonelli
Vuk,
To be honest, I expected a pointed critique of my system based on
1) poor choice of source (not a P9)
2) poor choice of stands (not mana)
3) poor room placement
4) poor speaker choice
5) questionable upgrade path
While I think Arun was expecting (although he did not say this to me) a critique of music choice.
However, Arun did say that your P9 was very stellar and made a believer out of him. Said it was like the best of analogue and digital.
daveã
Posted on: 10 December 2000 by David Antonelli
Vuk,
Steve did about as much as he could with my apartment and got me the equivalent of a seperate spur. He came about 2 years back with an oscilloscope and the whole power shabang. As for the stand thing, I am open minded but I will probably be moving within a year or two and wouldn't do a side by side demo of stands until I had other things sorted out. The Wilson Benesch stands do great things, but of course other stands may or may not be better. Richard from Holland found them better than both Hutter and Mana, but then found a local brand he prefered to all three.
My system currently is optimized to sound the best from my sofa where I often work on my lap top late into the night or the kitchen where I cook. Arun tried to find a sweet spot between the speakers but was dissapointed. Because of weird room reflections my stereo sounds best at less-than-obvious angles to the speakers.
The Wilson benesch speakers, although relative newcomers to the audio ring and hence not popular with the old school naim crowd that seems to bark whenever you use anything other than SBLs, Kans, Isobariks, or DBLs (there are other speakers you know), are completely devoid of any glare or harshness, yet have a liveliness to them that makes my albions sound flat and lifeless. Of course the better the spoeakers, the better the amp has to be, but what I heard with a simple 250 was AWESOME, even given my unusual room. It was like a power amp upgrade by several hundred watts. All the nuances of vocals coming out, lyrics which sounded like mumbling before suddenly being clear and pure. On these speakers EVERYTHING sounds like a live broadcast on an 01. Even the Live Birthday Party Album - which sounds like concentrated bleach on any other system - as poorly recorded as it is, sounded brilliant.
As for a London visit I would certainly like to hear your P9. Arun spoke very highly of it. We do Raman Spectroscopy at UWO so I might just surprise you some day.
dave
W
Posted on: 11 December 2000 by David Antonelli
Rico,
I agreed for the most part with Arun's observations. We were actually listening for almost 4 hours! But it was clear that he was a kind of round earther, as maybe I am to a small extent. A lot of teh eighties dance music he was putting on is stuff I haven't listened to for a long time and I tend to be fairly comfortable with my system because it is more optimized for sixties music, jazz, electronica, and classical. I have my Human League moods, but I think the albions tend to make mucis of this type a bit harsh sounding. Maybe that's why I listen to what i do now. Funny how your stereo's strengths and weaknesses can dictate what you listen to.
When I want loud powerhouse rock and slam I dive into my phones for a session. The tuner, which sounds brilliant on the albions, sounds thin on the headphones. I think albions have trouble, at least in my room, communicating very deep punchy bass, where the headphones excell in this domain.
Drum and bass just soars on those senns!
dave0
Posted on: 11 December 2000 by Arun Mehan
Yeah okay, I guess my posting did come out sounding that way. I'm really not that bad though, my mentor was Joe "Flat Earth" Petrik himself and he taught me well.
Dave's system has potential for sure though. With the headphones, it's simply amazing. I guess I could have been a bit more descriptive about the bass, but that would require another essay since I went from mobile audio to home audio and these car systems were meant for bass so I've heard all sorts of it! What I wanted to say was that the bass should have been deeper and louder in comparison to what I heard at Petrik's place in London because the Albions have two woofers, not one. The bass was tuneful though. The treble was bright at times and different than the reference I keep referring to which is shocking because I believe they use the same tweeter, no? I still think it's the room. Maybe some more experimentation with positioning might help.
John Schmidt is another UWO chem grad! I guess only completing a BSc. in Chem/Biochem I didn't get into the Raman Spectroscopy. My favourite course was analytical chemistry, especially the Atomic Spectroscopy and Gas Chromatography.
Posted on: 11 December 2000 by Joe Petrik
Arun,
quote:
The treble was bright at times and different than the reference I keep referring to which is shocking because I believe they use the same tweeter, no?
The Albion uses a 19mm Scanspeak dome tweeter; the Sorcerer uses a Royd proprietary 19mm dome tweeter. I think both models use the same 5-inch cast-chassis bass/mid driver, except the Albion has two (both without phase plugs) and the Sorcerer has one (with a phase plug).
I also think that the Sorcerers are much more flat earth than the Albions, although the Albions give a warmer sound that many would prefer.
Joe
Posted on: 11 December 2000 by John Schmidt
quote:
...to what shall be called "politics" ....
Dave, Arun (and whoever else cares).
Ah, yes, chemistry departments haven't changed much since I graduated. Although they probably have become a bit safer. I hope.
Yes, I'm a UWO chem grad, B.Sc. 1979, Ph.D. 1986, with a short stint at Dow Chemical (Sarnia) in between. After graduation I did a NSERC Industrial Research Fellowship at Paprican (Pulp and Paper Research Institute of Canada) in Pointe-Claire QC (soon to become part of the mega-city of Montreal, for which we can all blame Mike Harris, having shown pere Lucien that you can get away with it. But I digress) and stayed on as regular staff. Most of the faculty I knew when I was there have retired, although I think that Alan Weedon, who was an unofficial thesis advisor, and Nils Pederson, who was on my committee, are still going strong.
Cheers,
John Schmidt
"95% of everything is crud" - Theodore Sturgeon
[This message was edited by John Schmidt on MONDAY 11 December 2000 at 20:15.]
Posted on: 11 December 2000 by Mike Harris
Thats right - Blame me...
Since I changed my SBL's to Active ATC's, on Mana, I seem to get the blame for everything.....
I used to get quite a bit of hate/pleading mail from people, on your side of the world, something to do with my .net private email address, I guess ;-)
Mike Harris (UK not Canada)
