What should I know about switching to Apple?

I added an Apple to my non Microsoft collection of PCs last July - specifically for the photography aspects.

AS you are in London I suggest that you go along to the Apple shop that has just opened and have a good poke around on the systems that they have on display.

So far my view of the Apple is very positive especially since I bought a two button wheel mouse.

To get a greater view of the experiences of Macs I suggest you look at the Mac Tools Forum on the www.dpreview.com web site - there are the odd tale of woe - but in the main it has a lot of good news as well as people answering very similar questions that you have just asked.

platform stability - so far so good no crashes or corruptions it works - it is a bit of a challenge getting to know the under pinnings ie the Unix bit - but that is not really required unless you are a bit of a meddler.

My only negatives is that the applications are more expensive than I have been used to but the applications are being maintained and updated.

Check out on Amazon for books on getting started eg Panther Missing Manual and the switching to Mac books.

At the visible level the product is easy to use - it is different from the windows arena - but has a lot in common, the keyboard has a few new "strange" keys.

If you like what you see at the Apple shop I suggest you go for one.

Derek

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Derek,

Which is the two button wheel mouse you speak of? Apple do not do their own do they?

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Originally posted by Willito:

I am thinking about getting a PowerBook. Will

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I wouldn't get a PowerBook now - unless it was a very cheap deal or you really need a Mac. They are underpowered at the moment - the centrinos, particulary are a better bet if you need a laptop. There's no e.t.a. on G5 PowerBooks either.



Regards

Stephen (Mac user)

quote:

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Originally posted by Richard @ Soundcraft:
Derek,

Which is the two button wheel mouse you speak of? Apple do not do their own do they?

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Any USB mouse will work with OSX - as will a mouse wheel.

Regards

Stephen

I bought the MacMice two button plus wheel mouse, it looks like a Mac product ie clear plastic and a white solid under the cover. Just no Apple logo on it

Derek

<< >>

Steven that is a statement you will need to quantify for those that have not used apple.

For Will the simple thing will be to look at processor speed, and this is not a fair comparison, why do you believe powerbooks are under powered?

I have seen 'super groups' such as pet shop and Chemical Brothers boys doing live sequencing sets with power books, and in terms of the holy trinity power is not an issue.

If you have experience I would be interested to know where they are underpowered?

They need more ram, but all apples do lol!

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Originally posted by garyi:
Steven that is a statement you will need to quantify for those that have not used apple.

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OK garyi

Centrino laptops are faster (in real terms), cost about the same or less than a PB but are usually better specced, have about 4x the battery life of a PB in real life usage and have wireless built in.

If you get a 'name' one they are very nice indeed. And usually lighter than the PB too.

Of course, if you need OSX then you have no choice but to get a PB.

The Centrinos are more of a G5 PowerBook competitor in lots of ways. Things will even up, but at the moment? G4 PBs look very tired next to the latest PC notebooks IMHO. If had to have a laptop right now I'd get a Centrinio. But as I don't, I'll wait for the G5.

You're right; speed of processor isn't always the issue. but comparing the latest Pentium variants to a G4 is like comparing a G4 to a G3 - that's why we have the G5!

Of course you can do a lot on a G4 - I use one for music too. But often we use a Mac because we want to use Logic or Pro Tools or Digital Performer and we put up with lower spec for ease of use and because we need a specific bit of software. But the latest PC laptops approach G5 performance (notice I said 'approach ) and, like the G5, leave the G4 standing.

Regards

Stephen (who much prefers Macs!)

"The Centrinos are more of a G5 PowerBook competitor in lots of ways"

Really? My understanding of Centrinos was that they were at the lightweight, lower powered, longer battery life end of things and were generally based on Pentium-M processors. ie. that they emphasised portability over power.

Consequently, I'd expect centrino laptops to be broadly equivalent to G4s at best. For better than G4 and equal to G5 you'd need to look at true dektop replacement 3Ghz P4 based laptops -- which means heavy, 2.5 hours battery life, noisy fans, etc.

Matthew

If you're just using Word, Excel, Powerpoint, etc, the Powerbook will do just fine IMHO. I can run Entourage, Word, Excel, iTunes at the same time with 512mb of RAM no problem. You'll need to learn a few new keyboard short-cuts thought. I find them quite frustrating.

The PB offers excellent build, great looks, wifi and bluetooth integration and is extremely portable (esp the 12" model). The screen however is not that much chop, but then buy a TFT and use the DVI out.

Mines crashed once in 6 months.

J

Moved from a Dell Inspiron to a Powerbook 12" (not the current model) about five months back. Best computer move I've made in a looong time.

Some Powerbook points: battery life is far better than I got with the (bigger) Inspiron. My PB12 doesn't feel as quick as my Athlon XP1800+ desktop but quicker than the Dell PIII I had. The screen isn't as bright as the Dell and is lower resolution, but has better colours and I've grown to like it. Build quality trounces the Dell, except for the power socket whose connection is a bit on the loose side for the job.

Otherwise, everything is a plus: an operating system that I can depend upon, default security that works, great looking, very efficient in use (Expose is a great feature) and everything works as it's meant to.

I'd recommend a Powerbook in a heartbeat, but for the point made by others here, which is that there is a chance that a G5 PB might be in the near future (who knows?). The other point is that the new iBooks are exceptional value for money, and I'd go as far as to say buy an iBook 12" and then put the remainder of the savings into RAM and the future desktop Mac that you will subsequently plan to buy.

Believe me, it's as good as the hype!

John (who is delighted to say that he has successfully convinced a friend to buy a new iMac G5 instead of a similarly priced PC. Result!)

On an aside: I struggled a bit to adjust to the single button trackpad on my PB12", and last month added a Logitech MX510 corded USB optical mouse which is sensational, and from around £27 delivered from Amazon. I ended up going for corded as there's not so much point having cordless when you have to sit with the laptop anyway...

Just a recommendation from a happy customer.

John

quote:

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Originally posted by matthewr:
"The Centrinos are more of a G5 PowerBook competitor in lots of ways"

Really? My understanding of Centrinos was that they were at the lightweight, lower powered, longer battery life end of things and were generally based on Pentium-M processors. ie. that they emphasised portability over power.

Matthew

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Matthew

You're right to a point - that's why I didn't directly compare them. I use computers to do a lot of intensive processing (music and video) and there are a lot of other reasons than (relative) processor speed that the centrinos are faster than the G4 in real life usage (bus, hard drive thruput, video output). However, they feel faster with day to day processing too IMHO.

I've been using a Panasonic Toughbook to edit video and I'm finding render times well up on my G4 PB - and I'm getting @2-3 hours battery life doing video edits (about 40 mins on the PB). Normal battery life (word etc) @2 hours PB, 4-5 hours Centrino)

It makes a change, Matthew, you defending the Mac while I criticise one!

Don't get me wrong; if you need OSX a G4 PB or (more sensible financially) iBook still makes sense. But they are at the end of their lives....

Stephen (writing on a G4 12 incher)

Hi everyone,

Thank you for all of your views!

I've taken the plunge and gone out and put a 15inch PowerBook. Consequently, my heart nearly sunk when I read Steven's first post as my laptop that has just died was a Centrino and I was decidedly unimpressed with it .

Reading through the posts a very balanced and helpful view has emerged. It is unlikely that I will be anything as processor intensive as video edits, so I think that I will be okay on the battery life side. Most of my battery use is on planes. As most long haul carriers now have power sockets, it is only on the short flights where I will really have a concern.

Out of the box, I was impressed with the ease of the PowerBook's set-up. It took me a few seconds to figure out how to eject the Office installation CD (luckily the Help function was very straight forward). First impressions are very positive, though I find myself instinctively trying to right click. The same is true for shortkeys. All this will come with the fullness of time I guess (although I am still trying to figure out the Apple equivalent of the delete key). I downloaded Podworks, and was impressed with the ease of uploading all the music files off of my Ipod.

So once again, thank you everyone for your help. I'll let you know how I get on.

All the best,
Will

Anyone who buys a PowerBook at this end of the year will probably kick themselves come January (as this is when new Powerbooks "appear").

However, a competent reseller should currently be able to put together a pretty compelling package based around the iBook G4 1.2ghz 12" AirPort/Bluetooth with 1GB RAM, the factory h/disk removed and put into an external aluminium "shirt-pocket" FireWire case for backup (no mains required) and replaced with a Hitachi 7200rpm 60GB unit internally. These make a substantial difference to overall performance and will in my limited experience take it beyond all (current!) stock PowerBooks. Should cost under a grand.

Best;

Mark

Bugger -- cross post. Sorry Will!

If you need any help, use the ichat facilty on your powerbook to hook up to me.

My name is garethnaim on ichat

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Originally posted by Willito:


So once again, thank you everyone for your help. I'll let you know how I get on.


Will

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If you're happy, I'm happy

That is one of the problems with PCs; Which one do you get? With a Mac it's easy. With a PC, there are so many models and variations, some great, some crap and usually no way to check before you buy, that it makes it all so hard to choose.

I have one too remember

Stephen

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Originally posted by garyi:
If you need any help, use the ichat facilty on your powerbook to hook up to me.

My name is garethnaim on ichat

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Just don't mention Battlestar Galactica...

Stephen

It bears re-asking...

How does one 'Delete' (as opposed to 'Backspace') on a Powerbook or iBook? I've not figured that one out yet myself...

Probably really obvious...

John

I honestly didn't know there was a difference, there dosn't appear to be on the PC laptops exccept the delete key does nothing lol

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Originally posted by Top Cat:
It bears re-asking...

How does one 'Delete' (as opposed to 'Backspace') on a Powerbook or iBook? I've not figured that one out yet myself...

Probably really obvious...

John

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John

Its Fn/Delete (funcation/Delete)

yeah, really obvious

Regards

Stephen

Hi,
Having never needed a laptop my experience might not be strictly relavent but...
I got tired of pc related problems (Windows crashes, pc's being made of "bits" and various hardware conflicts etc etc) so bought an eMac 18 months ago....Pure bliss. I feel OSX is vastly more stable than any Windows platform, and I have had no problems at all. Sadly, I have to use several pc's when at work and every time we have a problem, either software or hardware it reminds me I made the right decision. I know not of Apples laptop specification versus a pc of similar cost but think of it this way, seeing as we are on a Naim forum, I presume you are familiar with their amps, for example. Why would someone pay 2 grand for a 70 watt power amp (NAP250) when a seemingly higher spec Arcam, Cyrus etc is available for less than half the cost with a free preamp and probably a remote control too.
Give a Mac a try, you may well be converted.

quote:

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Originally posted by Top Cat:
How does one 'Delete' (as opposed to 'Backspace') on a Powerbook or iBook? I've not figured that one out yet myself...

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Stephen's answer was correct, but it's an interesting question. The MacOS usually assumes something to be selected before a command is invoked (hey you, do this) -- thus the command is applied to the selected object. The "Del" key on a PC works the same as any other key _except_ "Backspace", in that in will delete the character to the right of the insertion point, where as Backspace moves the insertion point to the left, deleting as it goes.

On an Apple Extended keyboard, you get a Del key, and I've seen it referred to as "Forward Delete", which is quite a good description on the Mac.

I think all this is in line with the ASCII equivalents between Windows and MacOS being sometimes not quite what you would expect. The best example is that a Return on the Mac generates both a CR and LF as a single character, whereas these are separate on anything else. Viewing a text file from another platform on a Mac will often show redundant LF characters, which the Mac doesn't interpret as it has no concept of LFs on their own. The logic is "why would you execute a CR without an LF", which is of course an excellent question!

When I first encountered a Mac, I was using DisplayWrite 4 under DOS 4.11 (yes -- the one with the Shell!) in everyday life, and having learned the concepts involved in using this antedeluvian WP, I was amazed how commonsensical the Mac was by contrast. In the days when Apple could supply a choice of keyboards, the "standard" board didn't have any of the "terminal keys", just alpha with a number pad, arrows, home/end, screen up/down -- it was tiny, and lacked not a lot. Your PB keyboard is much closer to this than anything else!

Davewarehouse:
Excellent analogy -- nice one.

Best;

Mark

I loved the earlier mac keyboards with their lovely clackaty clack, I think people really knew you were working with them babies!

The mice were nice as well.

I heard a rumour someone was going to bring back the clacky clack keyboard for mac, I hope so.

I quite miss the simple days of OS6 on a mac LE. (Two floppy drives don't you know!)

Only one application open at a time, screen the width of A4 paper (How clever was that) and adobe pagemaker, Mac Paint and Mac Draw, snigger!