Crazy weather and armageddon
Posted by: DAVOhorn on 12 January 2005
Dear All,
Watching the news over the last few weeks it would appear that the world is in a very unhappy condition.
First the tsunami after the earth quake.
then the severe weather oop noorth with flooding and severe storms winds etc.
And the same in the good ole US of A.
The enormous iceberg that has gone walk about
So what is going on?
Has global warming almost hit critical mass and this is the start of the climate change that has been forecast.
Has the day after tomorrow arrived?
Here in very sunny mild suffolk i watched the above on my tv and wondered what is going on?
regards David
Watching the news over the last few weeks it would appear that the world is in a very unhappy condition.
First the tsunami after the earth quake.
then the severe weather oop noorth with flooding and severe storms winds etc.
And the same in the good ole US of A.
The enormous iceberg that has gone walk about
So what is going on?
Has global warming almost hit critical mass and this is the start of the climate change that has been forecast.
Has the day after tomorrow arrived?
Here in very sunny mild suffolk i watched the above on my tv and wondered what is going on?
regards David
Posted on: 14 January 2005 by Joe Petrik
Earpicker,
Guess the industrialized world, which also does its fair share of denuding the earth of trees at home and abroad, not to mention contributing disproportionately to emissions of CO2, is spared all culpability, then.
Phew! I was worried we'd be blamed.
Joe
quote:
Plants convert CO2 to biomass and molecular oxygen so provided Johnny Foreigner stops de-foresting the damn place we'll all be safe...!
Guess the industrialized world, which also does its fair share of denuding the earth of trees at home and abroad, not to mention contributing disproportionately to emissions of CO2, is spared all culpability, then.
Phew! I was worried we'd be blamed.
Joe
Posted on: 14 January 2005 by Steve Toy
Posted on: 15 January 2005 by Nime
I heard the other day about massive quantities of CO2 locked up in the sea bottom. Presumably as a result of the decay of billions of years worth of dead sea creatures.
Tread softly on this Earth. Particularly when you are paddling.
Nime
Tread softly on this Earth. Particularly when you are paddling.
Nime
Posted on: 15 January 2005 by Derek Wright
Re the locked up CO2 in the sea - as the water warms up due to gobal warming the CO2 will free itself and return to the atmosphere thereby accelerating the global warming
Unless there are significant amount of underwater landmass shifting and merging of the plates and over riding them which will trap the decaying matter under the surface of the rocks and form coal and oil seams for the future
Derek
<< >>
Unless there are significant amount of underwater landmass shifting and merging of the plates and over riding them which will trap the decaying matter under the surface of the rocks and form coal and oil seams for the future
Derek
<< >>
Posted on: 16 January 2005 by Tim Jones
quote:
Originally posted by Earwicker:
Atmospheric pollution is the least of our worries. Plants convert CO2 to biomass and molecular oxygen so provided Johnny Foreigner stops de-foresting the damn place we'll all be safe...!
Anyway, as I say, we're doomed so we should resign ourselves to seizing the moment. It'll take more than a few wind turbines to save the world, if you'll forgive me for sounding crude and simplistic.
What the hell. I'm going on the piss later, bugger the planet!! I've had a bad day!!!!
Earwicker
Sorry Wicker, but I've had a bad day too, I'm getting peeved with people being crude and simplistic about this, and there is a lot of gobshitery on this thread:
1. Of course climatic variation takes place. But this is man-made, profound and will damage the world for future generations
2. We can do something about it if people take action. The political problem is classic free-rider stuff. People in the developed world cannot see further than the end of their SUV; they simply will not vote for politicians who threaten them with short terms costs for long term gain and cannot see that trade-off.
3. This crap about 'not being able to do anything so we may as well think about how to adapt to a warmer, wetter, dimmer future' is either incredibly weak minded or downright criminal, in the sense that it provides a convenient excuse for inaction.
Don't what I'm going to do - try harder with recycling, perhaps, definitely vote Green next time, maybe try to work for them voluntarily.
Tim
Posted on: 16 January 2005 by Earwicker
quote:
1. Of course climatic variation takes place. But this is man-made, profound and will damage the world for future generations
No, it changes anyway. Global temperature changes are due to the rotational angle of the planet - it's called "wobble" if you want to look it up. That's what's caused successive ice ages, and the periodic cooling and warming that's defined the history of the climate. And there's nothing you can do to stop it.
I'm not saying human activity doesn't make a difference, but I hope no one imagines that the climate is in some perpetual equilibrium disturbed only by CO2 and other gaseous emissions characteristic of our civilisation.
Best wishes,
Earwicker
Posted on: 16 January 2005 by Tim Jones
When has anyone said that the climate is in perpetual equilibrium?
More importantly; why is the fact that huge natural variations have existed and will exist any kind of excuse for not trying to do something about a huge man-made variation?
Tim
More importantly; why is the fact that huge natural variations have existed and will exist any kind of excuse for not trying to do something about a huge man-made variation?
Tim
Posted on: 16 January 2005 by Earwicker
quote:
Originally posted by Tim Jones:
When has anyone said that the climate is in perpetual equilibrium?
More importantly; why is the fact that huge natural variations have existed and will exist any kind of excuse for not trying to do something about a huge man-made variation?
Tim
There's certainly no point deliberately sabotaging the environment, but it'll change anyway and as I say, not necessarily for the better. I don't know the extent to which global warming, for example, is due directly to CO2 emissions. Personally I'd be more worried about other toxic pollutants and radioactive waste - they're bad news and we can certainly control them. As for the planet getting warmer, I should just get used to the idea!
Earwicker
Posted on: 16 January 2005 by Paul Ranson
quote:
3. This crap about 'not being able to do anything so we may as well think about how to adapt to a warmer, wetter, dimmer future' is either incredibly weak minded or downright criminal, in the sense that it provides a convenient excuse for inaction.
What's your actual proposal?
Fully implementing the Kyoto agreement would (according to the computer models predicting disaster) have delayed things 6 years in 100. At an enormous cost, both monetary and human.
So a bit more than insults is required for you to be taken seriously.
Paul
Posted on: 16 January 2005 by Tim Jones
I don't care if you take me seriously or not. As far as I can tell I haven't insulted anyone - just the poverty of their argument.
I don't have a 'proposal'. All I can say is I'm going to try to do my bit.
Tim
I don't have a 'proposal'. All I can say is I'm going to try to do my bit.
Tim
Posted on: 16 January 2005 by Steve Toy
Global warming is a result of rising temperatures increasing the capacity of CO2 in the atmosphere - reversed cause and effect against politically correct notions of man-made global warming?
The rising global temperatures are themselves just a result of an on-going retreat from the last ice age.
Eventually the ice caps will melt and the warm ocean currents/air streams will be once-again cut off by the cold waters running off from the melting ice, and we will return to a much cooler age.
These things are cyclical, and man's activities play just a tiny role.
Regards,
Steve.
The rising global temperatures are themselves just a result of an on-going retreat from the last ice age.
Eventually the ice caps will melt and the warm ocean currents/air streams will be once-again cut off by the cold waters running off from the melting ice, and we will return to a much cooler age.
These things are cyclical, and man's activities play just a tiny role.
Regards,
Steve.
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by Earwicker
quote:
Originally posted by Steve Toy:
Global warming is a result of rising temperatures increasing the capacity of CO2 in the atmosphere - reversed cause and effect against politically correct notions of man-made global warming?
The rising global temperatures are themselves just a result of an on-going retreat from the last ice age.
Eventually the ice caps will melt and the warm ocean currents/air streams will be once-again cut off by the cold waters running off from the melting ice, and we will return to a much cooler age.
These things are cyclical, and man's activities play just a tiny role.
Regards,
Steve.
I've just told 'em that!!
Earwicker
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by Stephen Bennett
quote:
Originally posted by Steve Toy:
Eventually the ice caps will melt and the warm ocean currents/air streams will be once-again cut off by the cold waters running off from the melting ice, and we will return to a much cooler age.
These things are cyclical, and man's activities play just a tiny role.
Regards,
Steve.
Steve
I'll pop this e-mail over to the Climatic Research Unit here in Norwich and to all the climatologists I know. I suspect they'll be looking for new jobs and slapping themselves for mis-interpreting the data they've gleaned over the past 30 years.
Maybe they could all become taxi drivers.
Could you give them any tips?
Stephen
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by 7V
quote:
Originally posted by Stephen Bennett:
I'll pop this e-mail over to the Climatic Research Unit here in Norwich and to all the climatologists I know.
That's a good idea.
Please report back with their comments if there's any response.
Thanks
Steve M
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by Earwicker
Stephen,
Just ask your friends this: "Will global waming cease if we cut CO2 emmissions?"
Cyclic global warming and cooling has been around a lot longer than the internal combustion engine as I'm sure your mates will tell you. The strongest case against fossil fuels is they stink and exacerbate respiratory conditions.
Earwicker
Just ask your friends this: "Will global waming cease if we cut CO2 emmissions?"
Cyclic global warming and cooling has been around a lot longer than the internal combustion engine as I'm sure your mates will tell you. The strongest case against fossil fuels is they stink and exacerbate respiratory conditions.
Earwicker
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by Paul Ranson
quote:
Don't what I'm going to do - try harder with recycling, perhaps, definitely vote Green next time, maybe try to work for them voluntarily.
Well if that helps you feel better.
Try halving your total energy consumption.
Paul
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by Stephen Bennett
quote:
Originally posted by 7V:quote:
Originally posted by Stephen Bennett:
I'll pop this e-mail over to the Climatic Research Unit here in Norwich and to all the climatologists I know.
That's a good idea.
Please report back with their comments if there's any response.
Thanks
Steve M
Oh, how I wish we had ironics as well as italics...
Stephen
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by Stephen Bennett
quote:
Originally posted by Earwicker:
Stephen,
Just ask your friends this: "Will global waming cease if we cut CO2 emmissions?"
Cyclic global warming and cooling has been around a lot longer than the internal combustion engine as I'm sure your mates will tell you. The strongest case against fossil fuels is they stink and exacerbate respiratory conditions.
Earwicker
Most think Global warming is inevitable now; however, the magnitude of the effect can still be reduced.
Those who are suggesting that the burning of fossil fuels has no impact on global warming are really applying a Bush-like logic.
I know you'd all like it to be so that man isn't affecting the global environment; but there's hardly a researcher in the area who isn't funded by the oil companies who'd agree with you.
Stephen
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by Derek Wright
So why is there no visible effort to stabilise CO2 (apart from the odd tree planting activity) or to split the gas into it's two components.????
Derek
<< >>
Derek
<< >>
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by Earwicker
Derek,
The best way of splitting CO2 into its 2 components is biological carbon fixation. I don't know of any industrial method of taking CO2 and ending up with O2 and a lump of coal!!!!!
EW
The best way of splitting CO2 into its 2 components is biological carbon fixation. I don't know of any industrial method of taking CO2 and ending up with O2 and a lump of coal!!!!!
EW
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by Derek Wright
EW
Thanks - I would have thought that the industrialisation of biological carbon fixation would have been one of the most keenly competed area of non medical research
Derek
<< >>
Thanks - I would have thought that the industrialisation of biological carbon fixation would have been one of the most keenly competed area of non medical research
Derek
<< >>
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by Bob McC
I do hope that all of you who have been ranting for the last 3 pages now turn your Naim kit off at night to help save the planet.
Bob
Bob
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by 7V
quote:
Originally posted by Stephen Bennett:
Oh, how I wish we had _ironics_ as well as _italics_...
I realized that you were being :ironic: but I assumed that you really did have friends who were climatologists and that they might have some interesting views on the issue of to what extent 'these things are cyclical, and man's activities play just a tiny role.'
Steve M
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by Steve Toy
Mr Bennet,
A long time before I first drove a taxi I went to University. For the first two years of my modular degree course I studied geography, meteorology and climatology.
Back in the eighties, before anti-car propaganda reared its ugly head on the political stage, it was widely accepted that global warming was the enevitable consequence of retreating from the last ice age.
Regards,
Steve.
A long time before I first drove a taxi I went to University. For the first two years of my modular degree course I studied geography, meteorology and climatology.
Back in the eighties, before anti-car propaganda reared its ugly head on the political stage, it was widely accepted that global warming was the enevitable consequence of retreating from the last ice age.
Regards,
Steve.
Posted on: 17 January 2005 by Joe Petrik
Steve,
So, a long time ago you took a few undergraduate courses on geography, meteorology and climatology. Well, that would make you an authority on climate change.
Joe
quote:
A long time before I first drove a taxi I went to University. For the first two years of my modular degree course I studied geography, meteorology and climatology.
So, a long time ago you took a few undergraduate courses on geography, meteorology and climatology. Well, that would make you an authority on climate change.
Joe