Mac mini or a new cd player

Posted by: Lee Henley on 18 February 2010

Hi

My old (12 years) CD3.5 has never been serviced, although it plays quite fine, occasionally tracks might skip but overall its been quite a loyal friend to me.

I was looking at the new price of a CD5XS (£1700)to partner my Naim Nait XS which still may be my choice but not to overlook the computer route I was contemplating a mini mac and a decent DAC. With the arrival of the new Naim DAC there is quite a few secondhand decent DAC's on the market to consider.

The mini mac would be fed via the optical out to the DAC and I would not be streaming as our internet connection is not that great and cannot be upgraded with the current supplier, I already have an Imac upstairs in the office combined with an ipod touch so I am quite conversant with Apple.

After all that my question to mac users direct into a DAC then amp is whats the overall consensus of the sound quality compared to a cd player? Also whats the quality like when played through the transport of the mac as opposed to ripping to the hard drive and playing back in lossless format?

Apologies for a long winded post and thanks as always in advance to any responses

Cheers

Lee

Posted on: 18 February 2010 by mudwolf

This is a concern for me, tho I"m going to hold off for now. It would be nice to have Mini and half size DAC on same shelf.

I put my luxury cash toward a new TT and cartridge and loads of new vinyl. It was well worth it. I"m getting added bonus of working my abs getting up and down from the couch.

Posted on: 18 February 2010 by Guido Fawkes

quote:
I put my luxury cash toward a new TT and cartridge and loads of new vinyl.

Spending your luxury cash on essentials eh?

I prefer CDs to the Mac, but I wouldn't mind an audio-computer at some stage - still I'm waiting for young munch to throw out all his CDs.

Posted on: 18 February 2010 by paulr0414

Go Mac route but rip rather than use the transport

Posted on: 18 February 2010 by Lee Henley

Interesting comments is the transport not that good then?

Posted on: 18 February 2010 by badlyread

Why would you use it as a transport? Rip it and it is there forever and easy to access. I don't get the transport question.

Neil

Posted on: 18 February 2010 by Lee Henley

Just curios that's all, I still like to have CDs, I guess I'm kinda old fashioned

Posted on: 18 February 2010 by matt303

I still have my CDs and buy on CD mostly but once I'd experienced the convenience of being able to access all my music at a tap of the finger the CD player just gathered dust, in the end I sold it to finance upgrading my amp. If you go the mini route rip your CDs in a lossless format, now I just look at CDs as slightly outdated containers of data.

Posted on: 18 February 2010 by Alonso

Once you go Mac/DAC/Sonos/Rip Route you never go back...

I still buy CD's, wrappers off, rip and store...

Today I bought my first Hi Res down load! 96Khz/24 bit! DEAD excited. Havent listened to it yet. The down side is that Sonos doesnt support such resolution. Im not thaaaaat bothered cause there is so but sooo little music of my taste in Hi Res formats that it was just like a taster ... Ill toy with it during the weekend (Toslink from macbook directly to DAC)

I hear the Nay sayers that the silver spinning discs still have the edge in performance, but IMHO there is no comparison to having your entire music collection at your finger tips, plus God's gift to humanity, Shuffle...

So in a nutshell... Go for Macmini. (or a NAS for less money and more bang!)

Posted on: 18 February 2010 by Lee Henley

Well being a current mac user mainly for computer use kind of made sense, especially as secondhand mini macs are quite attractive which was my main reason for considering that route, I also have a LCD HD tv I could use as the monitor for the mac, my only concern was a loss in sound quality using a ripped cd over a cd player, but reading the threads it appears this is not an issue, so it may be a strong consideration

Posted on: 18 February 2010 by Guido Fawkes

quote:
Originally posted by Lee Henley:
Just curios that's all, I still like to have CDs, I guess I'm kinda old fashioned

Sensible IMHO - I can't really see the point of ripping CDs beyond making a back-up copy, but I can see the point of an audio-computer and a good DAC (read Naim DAC). Computers are a bit clunky and noisy compared with better CD players, but it'll get better. iPod into Naim DAC is an option.

Posted on: 18 February 2010 by Guido Fawkes

I'd like to hear the iPod option as the iPod touch has no noisy discs and it doesn't pump stuff back in to the mains (as it is not connected). Assuming it has a DAC bypass operation then it is an interesting option. Doubt it'd beat a good old CDX2 though

PS - I heard an iPod playing HMHB and preferred it to a CDX2 playing Barry Manilow.

quote:
Would you rather have Keano or Alex?

Neither - I want to be the next in line (wouldn't mind José Mourinho) - applied for the England job once, but they gave it to Graham Taylor: did I not like that.

Posted on: 19 February 2010 by djh1697

quote:
Originally posted by Lee Henley:
Just curios that's all, I still like to have CDs, I guess I'm kinda old fashioned

If a CD is ripped your computer will re-read the disk to correct any errors, indeed the HDX checks each bit upto four times. EAC (other programs are available) operates on a similar principle. The data is then bit perfect, whereas a standard CD player will just read once.[/QUOTE]

Posted on: 19 February 2010 by o.j.

Hy there.
my point of view: i hate it to sit infront of an computer to bring music (maybe i have payed
in the net for it)to my equipment to listen to it. to me its work.

Next thing is: ihave to download covers and information from the internet using the cds i have until now via server.

and the visual information is NOT so easy to get out ,as it is possible on a cd cover ,
sitting in the chair during an listening session.

also important for me: iwant to listen a piece of music in my car. so what to do?.
burn it on a cd with the computer.
bring it into the i pod and plug it in my car?
i have four cars.

and now to my ears the most important point:

i own an naim amplifier because of i prefer
its sound quality to the newest and most innovative digiamps. (tact millenium,as an example).

most of us listen to vinyl,out of sheer sound quality.

and i (my ears) can NOT admit, that one of those
new digistreamers(klimax ds, ps audio perfect
wave, and a lot of others can bring the same
bass sound quality,and overall freqency homogenity than any good cd-player.

at last: highest and clearest information is NOT
the same what icall "following the tune of music" Music has nothing to do with single effects,that are not in perfect connection
to the "whole homogen and essential Sound"
O.J.

Posted on: 20 February 2010 by Tony Russell

If you go the computer route then make sure you have a backup drive and back up regularly. Computer hard drives can and do fail.

Posted on: 20 February 2010 by JeremyB

Technically I believe that CD versus a 16 bit PCM file played through a DAC is worth about 2 bits of resolution, that is 4 times as much or two levels of Naim equipment upgrade. The subjective difference is even greater with music having wide dynamic range. That's exactly how it sounds to me whenever I hear the comparison. Maybe it's just me but I actually find MP3s more musical and involving than PCM16 files whenever I have compared.

Posted on: 20 February 2010 by Joppe

quote:
Originally posted by Lee Henley:

The mini mac would be fed via the optical out to the DAC and I would not be streaming Lee

Does a mac mini even have an optical out?

Posted on: 20 February 2010 by JeremyB

quote:
Does a mac mini even have an optical out?

yes it's a combination jack. Mac Mini is a Macbook with more useable I/O due to it's form factor. All its components are from a laptop instead of a desktop PC.

Posted on: 20 February 2010 by james n

Lee - its a great solution. I can't see why anyone would invest in a new CD player now when a computer audio solution can be so good (and now Naim make a DAC i'm sure it'll change the minds of a few that listen with their eyes rather than ears). The Mini makes a great music server and is very quiet (even quieter with a SSD drive). All my music sits on a NAS drive in the study. It's so easy to browse my whole collection and i dont think i've spent so much time listening to music as i have since i've gone down the computer route. The iPod touch makes a great remote control too.

James

Posted on: 20 February 2010 by Lee Henley

quote:
Originally posted by james n:
Lee - its a great solution. I can't see why anyone would invest in a new CD player now when a computer audio solution can be so good (and now Naim make a DAC i'm sure it'll change the minds of a few that listen with their eyes rather than ears). The Mini makes a great music server and is very quiet (even quieter with a SSD drive). All my music sits on a NAS drive in the study. It's so easy to browse my whole collection and i dont think i've spent so much time listening to music as i have since i've gone down the computer route. The iPod touch makes a great remote control too.

James

James many thanks for that, is that a Weiss DAC that you have there, how do they sound?

BTW it was your picture in another thread on here that got me thinking about using a mini mac, another option just to test the theory out could be to unplug the imac and set that up downstairs, all beit I dont have a DAC yet but could borrow one from the local dealer just to try it out

Cheers

Lee

Posted on: 20 February 2010 by frotter16

Jame n=
I would like to ask your help and email you directly if possible, but I have been doing a ton of research on line as to how to use a DAC and a Hard Drive/computer to direct music to my 552/500/NBL's. One could read for DAYYYYSSSS about amarra/monkeymedia/jukebox this or that...but my question is even more sophomoric.
You have a Mac Mini
It is connected to the DAC
1. What software stores the music on the HD?
2. An NAS I understand is a Network Attached Storage device...What is your Storage Device?
3. How does your Mac Mini access your stored files?
4. How do you manage the library of music stored on the Hard Drive?
5. What does a Naimnet Server do that a Hard Drive attached to a Mac Mini does not do?
6. What software do you use to PLAY the music and how do you see that software...soley on
the Iphone?
7. Has anyone taken a long optical cable from a laptop or Hard Drive and put that to the
DAC?
8. What MAC programs play WAV files?

I have been emailing some trade members here in the states, and there is not much information...for example...what software browses the hard drive of a naimnet server?
Any answers are greatly appreciated, and by all means, if you feel charitable..

Fred

Posted on: 20 February 2010 by winkyincanada

quote:
Originally posted by JeremyB:
...CD versus a 16 bit PCM file played through a DAC is worth about 2 bits of resolution, that is 4 times as much or two levels of Naim equipment upgrade.

Bollocks! But believe it if you want.

Mac Mini via SPDIF to the DAC is a great option. Run it headless with a remote laptop and/or iPod/iPhone.

Posted on: 20 February 2010 by Keith L

Fred,

You need to start messing around with iTunes. Most answers can be found on the web. I'm surprised you cannot get answers from "trade members". See below for my quick answers.

Keith

quote:
Originally posted by frotter16:
Jame n=
I would like to ask your help and email you directly if possible, but I have been doing a ton of research on line as to how to use a DAC and a Hard Drive/computer to direct music to my 552/500/NBL's. One could read for DAYYYYSSSS about amarra/monkeymedia/jukebox this or that...but my question is even more sophomoric.
You have a Mac Mini
It is connected to the DAC
1. What software stores the music on the HD? Ripped with iTunes or XLD
2. An NAS I understand is a Network Attached Storage device...What is your Storage Device? Drobo (NAS).
3. How does your Mac Mini access your stored files? Amarra playing iTunes.
4. How do you manage the library of music stored on the Hard Drive? iTunes.
5. What does a Naimnet Server do that a Hard Drive attached to a Mac Mini does not do? Don't know
6. What software do you use to PLAY the music and how do you see that software...soley on
the Iphone? Amarra / iTunes. iPhone or iTouch or Laptop or monitor & keyboard.
7. Has anyone taken a long optical cable from a laptop or Hard Drive and put that to the
DAC? Yes, but it is better to keep cables to about a metre.
8. What MAC programs play WAV files? iTunes and many many more.

I have been emailing some trade members here in the states, and there is not much information...for example...what software browses the hard drive of a naimnet server?
Any answers are greatly appreciated, and by all means, if you feel charitable..
email me and I would be forever indebted
Fred
fredbartlett@me.com

Posted on: 21 February 2010 by Jono 13

I supplimented my 3.5 with an AppleTV and would recommend one any day. You get optical digital with no pc/mac needed to support it. Plus you get all the iTunes functions with YouTube.

I would also say that once you get into ripped tunes you won't go back.

Jono

Posted on: 21 February 2010 by Jono 13

I also meant to add the ATV is less than half the price of a mac mini and will plug into the hdmi port on the telly for photo and home video viewing.

Try one!

Jono

Posted on: 22 February 2010 by MontyMusic

is it possible to stream music from a Time Capsule to Apple TV? The hard drive is pretty small.....