Is the Recession Exaggerated
Posted by: Mick P on 31 July 2009
Chaps
I sometimes think that people like whinging for the sake of it and this so called recession has had people moaning in droves.
Some people must be a lot better off because inflation is peanuts and interest rates are low and housing is becoming cheaper to afford in real terms.
Then everyone bleats about the unemployed.
I have freelanced since 2004 as a Procurement Consultant and did pretty good out of it because times were good. My last contract expired in November last year and as I was just one month away from my sixtieth birthday, I decided to retire. My wife was going to retire in March this year. She has been constantly postponing her retirement and has now agreed to carry on working for another 12 months.
I therefore decided to re enter the job market. I am an old man of sixty so you would think I had no chance.
I put myself on the books of 3 agencies on the 30th June and had two interviews last week. I had two job offers as a result this week and am earning precisely the same as this time last year.
In other words it has taken exactly one month to land a choice of two jobs at last years rates and this confirms my belief that this country still has a load of opportunities and that getting on your bike is still valid.
Regards
Mick
I sometimes think that people like whinging for the sake of it and this so called recession has had people moaning in droves.
Some people must be a lot better off because inflation is peanuts and interest rates are low and housing is becoming cheaper to afford in real terms.
Then everyone bleats about the unemployed.
I have freelanced since 2004 as a Procurement Consultant and did pretty good out of it because times were good. My last contract expired in November last year and as I was just one month away from my sixtieth birthday, I decided to retire. My wife was going to retire in March this year. She has been constantly postponing her retirement and has now agreed to carry on working for another 12 months.
I therefore decided to re enter the job market. I am an old man of sixty so you would think I had no chance.
I put myself on the books of 3 agencies on the 30th June and had two interviews last week. I had two job offers as a result this week and am earning precisely the same as this time last year.
In other words it has taken exactly one month to land a choice of two jobs at last years rates and this confirms my belief that this country still has a load of opportunities and that getting on your bike is still valid.
Regards
Mick
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by gone
I don't think your (happy) anecdote bears any relation to whether the recession is exaggerated or not.
But congratulations on getting the job
But congratulations on getting the job
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by Mick P
Nero
The guy who I turned down spent ages asking me to change my mind. He wanted someone with a proven track record on stripping costs out of processes which is basically what I do.
Most of it is common sense so how come he cannot find anyone else out of 3 million unemployed.
It does not make sense.
Regards
Mick .. given up looking for a window cleaner.
The guy who I turned down spent ages asking me to change my mind. He wanted someone with a proven track record on stripping costs out of processes which is basically what I do.
Most of it is common sense so how come he cannot find anyone else out of 3 million unemployed.
It does not make sense.
Regards
Mick .. given up looking for a window cleaner.
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by shoot6x7
It depends on your trade and how diversified the economy in your country.
In Canada, I haven't seen so many engineers unemployed since the 90's. With little hope for the future.
It's true that in Canada we are a resource driven economy and guess what - the demand has dropped off a cliff. Demand for certain steels has gone to zero, demand for Nickel has really reduced.
So for the financial whizzes who made off like bandits in the last fifteen years ... a lot of professionals in other sectors will be suffering for your greed for the foreseeable future.
In Canada, I haven't seen so many engineers unemployed since the 90's. With little hope for the future.
It's true that in Canada we are a resource driven economy and guess what - the demand has dropped off a cliff. Demand for certain steels has gone to zero, demand for Nickel has really reduced.
So for the financial whizzes who made off like bandits in the last fifteen years ... a lot of professionals in other sectors will be suffering for your greed for the foreseeable future.
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by gone
Maybe the people who like to strip costs out of processes for a living are in great demand at the moment.
That could be related to the fact there's a recession on?
But I might be exaggerating.
That could be related to the fact there's a recession on?
But I might be exaggerating.
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by Bruce Woodhouse
Last week we advertised for 2 receptionists. Part-time and paid about £6.50/hr at most. We normally get about 10-20 applications. We have had 110 so far including ex architects, company directors and a deputy bank manager.
We hardly live in a typical area of economic deprivation.
A pretty stark example of the situation in the job market I think.
Bruce
We hardly live in a typical area of economic deprivation.
A pretty stark example of the situation in the job market I think.
Bruce
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by gone
would you trust a deputy bank manager to answer the phone?
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by Bruce Woodhouse
quote:Originally posted by Nero:
would you trust a deputy bank manager to answer the phone?
It might be a new experince for her. Whenever I ring my bank it is answered at a call centre!
Bruce
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by Mick P
Avole
Companies have always been stripping costs out of their systems, that is why things get progressively cheaper in real terms. Today we call it cost reduction, in the sixties it was called work methodology, it boils down to the same thing, getting leaner and more competitive.
Secondly, how come I have not seen a window cleaner in years, you would have thought some bugger would come around knocking on doors.
Regards
Mick
Companies have always been stripping costs out of their systems, that is why things get progressively cheaper in real terms. Today we call it cost reduction, in the sixties it was called work methodology, it boils down to the same thing, getting leaner and more competitive.
Secondly, how come I have not seen a window cleaner in years, you would have thought some bugger would come around knocking on doors.
Regards
Mick
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by 555
quote:Once a bigot always one.
Maybe you should hit that edit button while you have time avole?
I went to London a couple of weeks ago on business.
The minicab driver who took me from the airport to W12 told me he was a solicitor by profession & made redundant six months ago.
Although he was practising for five years before this, & has applied for "100s" of jobs he's fully qualified for, he has not received any offers.
Were I work approx' 40% of the staff are being made redundant,
due to a massive drop off in work.
IMO the financial meltdown of 2008 has sent massive shock waves through most economies,
& many people are suffering.
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by shoot6x7
The problem I see is this:
To reduce operating costs the key companies in my (former) field opened up engineering offices in Egypt, China, India and Brazil.
They then forced us to farm out the 'donkey work' to them. They then started reducing head-count because the overseas engineers cost way less per hour than we do.
Now I'm not going to talk quality here because sometimes it's fine, other times not.
For a global corporate entity this makes sense, use the cheapest resources you can, it improves margins.
But my question is, if so many jobs go overseas, then who will be consuming in the west ? Because so many of us will have lost our jobs to overseas operations !
To reduce operating costs the key companies in my (former) field opened up engineering offices in Egypt, China, India and Brazil.
They then forced us to farm out the 'donkey work' to them. They then started reducing head-count because the overseas engineers cost way less per hour than we do.
Now I'm not going to talk quality here because sometimes it's fine, other times not.
For a global corporate entity this makes sense, use the cheapest resources you can, it improves margins.
But my question is, if so many jobs go overseas, then who will be consuming in the west ? Because so many of us will have lost our jobs to overseas operations !
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by gone
quote:Originally posted by Mick Parry:
Secondly, how come I have not seen a window cleaner in years, you would have thought some bugger would come around knocking on doors.
Probably because they avoid the properties that are owned by people who patronise them in a Dick Van Dyke accent
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by 555
I imagine being addressed as a bugger is probably a disincentive.
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by gone
quote:Originally posted by 555:
I imagine being addressed as a bugger is probably a disincentive.
I am feeling very constipated in a smiley kind of way. You're doing well.......
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by 555
"No Laughing"
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by gone
hehehehehehehe
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by Simon Matthews
Stats show that a large proportion of the newly unemployed are young, either not long out of school or recent graduates. Sustained periods of unemployment in this age group is particularly damaging and unhealthy as it can create an overriding sense of apathy and lack of worth in people setting off into their careers.
The recession is very real from what I am seeing.
The recession is very real from what I am seeing.
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by Absolute
I have a First Class BSc and an MSc but am still struggling to find a job. The last one that I applied for, nearly 500 people applied for the post.
This recession is deep, and we haven't even seen the last of its effects by a long shot. Anyone who says we'll be out of it by the end of the year is having a laugh.
This recession is deep, and we haven't even seen the last of its effects by a long shot. Anyone who says we'll be out of it by the end of the year is having a laugh.
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by Mick P
Chaps
I agree that school leavers are vunerable. The Education system in this country is a joke, we have hundreds of thousands of youngsters walking around with worthless degrees and a mountain of debt to pay for it.
The careers advice service is also one step from being useless. Therefore youngsters have the sympathy vote because they have been badly let down by an inept system.
However if you are in your 40s, 50s or 60s, you have had 16 years of economic growth and we have had it dead easy compared to previous generations and the ones coming up behind us. If you haven't done well then frankly you shouldn't be allowed to walk the streets.
This brings me back to my original opening of this thread, If I can get two offers of a job in less than a month, I take a lot of convincing that things are really bad for anyone with a brain.
If you have had 16 years of growth, you have had 16 years to get your act together and make yourself immune to economic swings.
Regards
Mick
I agree that school leavers are vunerable. The Education system in this country is a joke, we have hundreds of thousands of youngsters walking around with worthless degrees and a mountain of debt to pay for it.
The careers advice service is also one step from being useless. Therefore youngsters have the sympathy vote because they have been badly let down by an inept system.
However if you are in your 40s, 50s or 60s, you have had 16 years of economic growth and we have had it dead easy compared to previous generations and the ones coming up behind us. If you haven't done well then frankly you shouldn't be allowed to walk the streets.
This brings me back to my original opening of this thread, If I can get two offers of a job in less than a month, I take a lot of convincing that things are really bad for anyone with a brain.
If you have had 16 years of growth, you have had 16 years to get your act together and make yourself immune to economic swings.
Regards
Mick
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by Absolute
quote:
This brings me back to my original opening of this thread, If I can get two offers of a job in less than a month, I take a lot of convincing that things are really bad for anyone with a brain.
I think this shows a very narrow minded view of the economy. Certain markets are still contracting, as such there are fewer jobs. Just because you 'have a brain' doesn't mean you can get a job just like that. The recession has had a resounding impact across the entire world, i know solicitors and other very clever professionals in the property sector that have been made redundant, they are struggling to find work. Id hardly say they 'didn't have a brain'.
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by Willy
Myopic.
Regards,
Willy.
Regards,
Willy.
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by 555
Another group severely affected by the situation are 13-16 yr olds.
I was this age during the late 70s - early 80s recession,
& it was an extremely disheartening experience.
Many of my peers effectively gave up on school because they thought they had no hope of a job & decent standard of living.
I was this age during the late 70s - early 80s recession,
& it was an extremely disheartening experience.
Many of my peers effectively gave up on school because they thought they had no hope of a job & decent standard of living.
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by Steve O
Mick,
I find your post very patronising and very wrong.
I have been out of work for eight months and have had one job interview in that time. The job was advertised as 'salary negotiable, depending on experience'. I did twenty five years in my last job and thought I was in a fair position to get a reasonable salary offer. I was told I was the 'stand out candidate' and was actually brought in for interview before the deadline for applications had closed. In the end I declined the job as they were offering less than half the money for a similar role. This was within six weeks of being made redundant and I foolishly expected to be the stand out candidate for other potential employers. How very wrong I have been proved.
I'm not educated to degree level but I have 'A' levels and 'O' levels, as well as professional qualifications I achieved through employment, so I think I can claim to have a brain.
There are some lucky people who because of interest rates being so low have never had so much disposable income. I on the other hand have worked to buy my own property and have investments. I am now unable to claim a a single penny in benefits as my contribution based job-seekers allowance has ran out, (you are entitled to this for six months only), and I don't satisfy the means testing for the income support benefits. It pisses me off that had I spent all of my income instead of trying to build a nest egg for my retirement then the state would have to bail me out. As it is I will have to spend all of my savings, except the last £6K, unless I can get myself a job. I need no more motivation than that believe me, but the work is not out there. Yesterday another 300+ people were laid off at the local Hotpoint factory. Yet more competition for jobs. Take a bit more notice next time the news comes on and compare how many job losses are announced against how many new jobs are created.
Last week the jobcentre tried to bully me into taking a job 35 miles away from my home, working twelve hour nights, for £6 an hour. Last year I was earning more than double that. I was told if I did not apply for the job my benefits could be withdrawn. I pointed out if they give me nothing then they can take nothing away.
It appears that your field of work requires staff, while mine is still laying people off. It looks like I won't get new employment until I have gained additional qualifications and diversify.
Instead of trying to write off the whole recession as a fantasy I'd take a look at the bigger picture and just consider yourself lucky.
Steve.
I find your post very patronising and very wrong.
I have been out of work for eight months and have had one job interview in that time. The job was advertised as 'salary negotiable, depending on experience'. I did twenty five years in my last job and thought I was in a fair position to get a reasonable salary offer. I was told I was the 'stand out candidate' and was actually brought in for interview before the deadline for applications had closed. In the end I declined the job as they were offering less than half the money for a similar role. This was within six weeks of being made redundant and I foolishly expected to be the stand out candidate for other potential employers. How very wrong I have been proved.
I'm not educated to degree level but I have 'A' levels and 'O' levels, as well as professional qualifications I achieved through employment, so I think I can claim to have a brain.
There are some lucky people who because of interest rates being so low have never had so much disposable income. I on the other hand have worked to buy my own property and have investments. I am now unable to claim a a single penny in benefits as my contribution based job-seekers allowance has ran out, (you are entitled to this for six months only), and I don't satisfy the means testing for the income support benefits. It pisses me off that had I spent all of my income instead of trying to build a nest egg for my retirement then the state would have to bail me out. As it is I will have to spend all of my savings, except the last £6K, unless I can get myself a job. I need no more motivation than that believe me, but the work is not out there. Yesterday another 300+ people were laid off at the local Hotpoint factory. Yet more competition for jobs. Take a bit more notice next time the news comes on and compare how many job losses are announced against how many new jobs are created.
Last week the jobcentre tried to bully me into taking a job 35 miles away from my home, working twelve hour nights, for £6 an hour. Last year I was earning more than double that. I was told if I did not apply for the job my benefits could be withdrawn. I pointed out if they give me nothing then they can take nothing away.
It appears that your field of work requires staff, while mine is still laying people off. It looks like I won't get new employment until I have gained additional qualifications and diversify.
Instead of trying to write off the whole recession as a fantasy I'd take a look at the bigger picture and just consider yourself lucky.
Steve.
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by shoot6x7
Sorry to hear that Steve,
We are truly in a different time.
The last fifteen years have been built up on the fantasies of the financial markets. Value was perceived out of nothing, but they made millions at it trading bits of paper.
In industry CEOs are earning more money than ever, the engineers, technicians and the trades are getting less and their getting canned.
I don't know when I'll be able to get re-hired. The oil price will have to go up, people will have to start buying cars, creat a demand for steel, nickel, rubber, power then maybe the nuke projects will go ahead and steel production will re-start, etc..
The economy as we knew it last year or the year before is gone.
I wish I'd been an unscrupulous merchant banker made a few million, retire at 40 and laugh at everyone else who couldn't screw someone over to make a fortune ..
We are truly in a different time.
The last fifteen years have been built up on the fantasies of the financial markets. Value was perceived out of nothing, but they made millions at it trading bits of paper.
In industry CEOs are earning more money than ever, the engineers, technicians and the trades are getting less and their getting canned.
I don't know when I'll be able to get re-hired. The oil price will have to go up, people will have to start buying cars, creat a demand for steel, nickel, rubber, power then maybe the nuke projects will go ahead and steel production will re-start, etc..
The economy as we knew it last year or the year before is gone.
I wish I'd been an unscrupulous merchant banker made a few million, retire at 40 and laugh at everyone else who couldn't screw someone over to make a fortune ..
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by 555
Greed, and a complete lack of social responsibility, is by no means restricted to politicians
Posted on: 31 July 2009 by Stephen Tate
There has not been sixteen years of growth, it was a fairy tale! Sixteen years of borrowing more like.
Banks are not lending because most jobs are at risk.
There is no work and no money to play with on a social level, Fact!
On the other hand these so called politicians end up smelling of roses no matter what happens or what they do.
Your best bet is to go inside, grab all the free education and help that you will get paid to do and come out on the otherside, qualified to the hilt, ready for the good times when they come back. I don't class anyone more clever than me, only lucky or more deceiving because as usual the genuine and hard working have been kicked in the teeth yet again!
Steve
Banks are not lending because most jobs are at risk.
There is no work and no money to play with on a social level, Fact!
On the other hand these so called politicians end up smelling of roses no matter what happens or what they do.
Your best bet is to go inside, grab all the free education and help that you will get paid to do and come out on the otherside, qualified to the hilt, ready for the good times when they come back. I don't class anyone more clever than me, only lucky or more deceiving because as usual the genuine and hard working have been kicked in the teeth yet again!
Steve