Some basic HDX queries
Posted by: Bruce Woodhouse on 02 January 2009
I'm kicking around replacing my CDS3 with an HDX.
I've been looking through this part of the Forum and I'll be honest, much of it is absolute gobbledegook to me, and I cannot find the answers to some fairly simple questions. I'm not a PC network whizz-be nice to me.
The queries.
My house has a router with wireless and good coverage in the listening room. Can I connect the HDX wirelessly and will this cause any problems? Do I need a gizmo on the back of the HDX to receive wirelessly?
At the moment we don't leave the router on all the time, only connecting it and switching it on when we want to go online. Would this matter (provided it was not disconnected when the HDX was accessing the online database)? Can you tell from the control panel when the HDX is online-and therefore realise it must be left connected? If I ripped a CD whilst it was offline will it acess the database etc when the network is re-connected?
Bruce
I've been looking through this part of the Forum and I'll be honest, much of it is absolute gobbledegook to me, and I cannot find the answers to some fairly simple questions. I'm not a PC network whizz-be nice to me.
The queries.
My house has a router with wireless and good coverage in the listening room. Can I connect the HDX wirelessly and will this cause any problems? Do I need a gizmo on the back of the HDX to receive wirelessly?
At the moment we don't leave the router on all the time, only connecting it and switching it on when we want to go online. Would this matter (provided it was not disconnected when the HDX was accessing the online database)? Can you tell from the control panel when the HDX is online-and therefore realise it must be left connected? If I ripped a CD whilst it was offline will it acess the database etc when the network is re-connected?
Bruce
Posted on: 02 January 2009 by garyi
The HDX is not natively wireless. Probably your safest bet would be the wireless over electric plugs, however this is probably likely to effect the mains.
Really the best way is with an ethernet lead to your router, and if I were you really think about how you can achieve this. Its usually very doable. I have ethernet into every room in my house, I did it myself and it was not difficult. (I have home dect phones so actually reused the old phone sockets in the rest of the house.
As for turning the router off, I cannot fathom why you would do this, they use less than a 20 watt light bulb and the point of the router is that its there when you need it. It should not be an issue, but I would find having to turn the router on and waiting five minutes for it to stabilise before being able to rip a cd most perplexing, especially as there is no reason for it.
Really the best way is with an ethernet lead to your router, and if I were you really think about how you can achieve this. Its usually very doable. I have ethernet into every room in my house, I did it myself and it was not difficult. (I have home dect phones so actually reused the old phone sockets in the rest of the house.
As for turning the router off, I cannot fathom why you would do this, they use less than a 20 watt light bulb and the point of the router is that its there when you need it. It should not be an issue, but I would find having to turn the router on and waiting five minutes for it to stabilise before being able to rip a cd most perplexing, especially as there is no reason for it.
Posted on: 02 January 2009 by Bruce Woodhouse
Garyi
Thanks for that, and for maiking sense!
I'll explain the problem in more detail and you may see why I asked what I did.
We have a small annex to the house used as an office. It has an extension running from our phone line that connects to another router as it is too far away to get wireless coverage from the router in the house. The router in the house has to be switched off and disconnected when the office router is online (and vice versa) as they 'clash' and will not work simultaenously. At the moment the house wireless router is on and connected probably less than 10% of the time because we access the web in the main house fairly rarely-but this one would be serving an HDX (either wirelessly or via an ethernet cable if I ran one to the listening room). Running that cable is awkward due to the geography of the house, although not impossible. However I presume I'd still have the network 'clash' when the office is in operation. Really I can see I need to run an ethernet cable to the office from the house router and that would simplify everything
Anyway I hope you can see now why I asked the question.
Bruce
Bruce
Thanks for that, and for maiking sense!
I'll explain the problem in more detail and you may see why I asked what I did.
We have a small annex to the house used as an office. It has an extension running from our phone line that connects to another router as it is too far away to get wireless coverage from the router in the house. The router in the house has to be switched off and disconnected when the office router is online (and vice versa) as they 'clash' and will not work simultaenously. At the moment the house wireless router is on and connected probably less than 10% of the time because we access the web in the main house fairly rarely-but this one would be serving an HDX (either wirelessly or via an ethernet cable if I ran one to the listening room). Running that cable is awkward due to the geography of the house, although not impossible. However I presume I'd still have the network 'clash' when the office is in operation. Really I can see I need to run an ethernet cable to the office from the house router and that would simplify everything
Anyway I hope you can see now why I asked the question.
Bruce
Bruce
Posted on: 02 January 2009 by Claus-Thoegersen
quote:Originally posted by Bruce Woodhouse:
I'm kicking around replacing my CDS3 with an HDX.
I've been looking through this part of the Forum and I'll be honest, much of it is absolute gobbledegook to me, and I cannot find the answers to some fairly simple questions. I'm not a PC network whizz-be nice to me.
The queries.
My house has a router with wireless and good coverage in the listening room. Can I connect the HDX wirelessly and will this cause any problems? Do I need a gizmo on the back of the HDX to receive wirelessly?
My dealer has found a box that will take a wireless signal and have plugs to a standard wired connection. You have to kno how to set it up in order to have it to work, but it can be done.
At the moment we don't leave the router on all the time, only connecting it and switching it on when we want to go online. Would this matter (provided it was not disconnected when the HDX was accessing the online database)? Can you tell from the control panel when the HDX is online-and therefore realise it must be left connected? If I ripped a CD whilst it was offline will it acess the database etc when the network is re-connected?
I do not thik it automatically will rescan the cds you rip while the HDX is offline, but you can tell it to scan the database and it should get the cds information. I thik you also can type in the cds yourself but probablly something you would not want to do very often.
Like gary I see no reason for switching the router on and off and avoid these problems.
Claus
Bruce
Posted on: 02 January 2009 by Bruce Woodhouse
Looking into this more carefuly it appears I may be able to configure my routers so they can work simultaenously. That way I could leave both on all the time. May be a solution, I shall investigate further.
Bruce
Bruce
Posted on: 02 January 2009 by garyi
Yea, you need to set the routers up as WDS, This allows one router to piggy off the other.
Don't ask me how, I have never had too
Don't ask me how, I have never had too
Posted on: 02 January 2009 by DaveBk
Another potential solution to the 2 router scenario would be to locate one router high up in the loft. I had a similar problem where I could not get the whole house covered from my office (also in an annex at the far end of the main house). I found a single router high up in the main part of the house gave me coverage everywhere. You still have to run a cable to this point, but for me this was the easiest solution.
I use a Slim Devices (now Logitech) Transporter which is natively wireless.
I use a Slim Devices (now Logitech) Transporter which is natively wireless.
Posted on: 02 January 2009 by QTT
quote:Originally posted by Bruce Woodhouse:
My house has a router with wireless and good coverage in the listening room. Can I connect the HDX wirelessly and will this cause any problems? Do I need a gizmo on the back of the HDX to receive wirelessly?
Bruce
Very simple, Bruce. Get an Apple Airport Express, connect the HDX to the AE via an ethernet cable. The AE connects to the router wirelessly i.e.
Internet <- Wired -> Router <- Wireless -> AE <- Wired -> HDX
Cheers,
QTT
Posted on: 03 January 2009 by Bruce Woodhouse
Garyi. I have no idea what a WDS is!
DaveBk. The annex is some distance from the main house, and the walls are several feet thick solid stone. Wireless is just not going to work!
QTT. I'm not using Apple computers, is this still an option?
Bruce
DaveBk. The annex is some distance from the main house, and the walls are several feet thick solid stone. Wireless is just not going to work!
QTT. I'm not using Apple computers, is this still an option?
Bruce
Posted on: 03 January 2009 by QTT
quote:Originally posted by Bruce Woodhouse:
Garyi. I have no idea what a WDS is!
DaveBk. The annex is some distance from the main house, and the walls are several feet thick solid stone. Wireless is just not going to work!
QTT. I'm not using Apple computers, is this still an option?
Bruce
Bruce,
WDS means Wireless Distribution System. I think this setup is not applicable to your case where this distance too far away for the two routers.
Regarding the AE for Windows, I think it does not really matter. All you need is to download the Airport Admin Utility for Windows and just follow the screen instructions to set it up.
I use the AE for the Slingbox in a Windows/Mac environment where the Slingbox is too far away for any physical ethernet cable connection.
Cheers,
QTT
Posted on: 03 January 2009 by garyi
Bruce what is your wireless router right now?
Posted on: 03 January 2009 by DaveBk
quote:DaveBk. The annex is some distance from the main house, and the walls are several feet thick solid stone. Wireless is just not going to work!
Oh, I see. My 'annex' is connected to one end of the house...
Regarding your router problem, I assume from your second post they are both ADSL broadband devices that are wired into your phone lines, thus the reason you can't have both on at the same time?
If this is the case it's highly unlikely from my knowledge of ADSL that you can connect them both at the same time. The exchange side of an ADSL line is called a DSLAM and I beleive can only support one device at the other end of the wire.
If your router has ethernet (RJ45) connections as well as wifi you could run a ethernet cable (called cat5 or cat6 depending on the speed it can support) from the house to the annex. You could connect the HDX directly to this, or connect another wifi router or access point to give you further coverage. Needs a bit of networking knowledge, but not too difficult.
Posted on: 03 January 2009 by e-h
Bruce, your wireless routers should be able to coexist without interfering with each other. Just configure them to use different wireless channels (if router #1 uses channel 1, the second should use channel 4 or higher). When it comes to connecting the HDX I second adding an Airport Express. It can operate as a client of the network and bridge it to the Ethernet port of your HDX.
Posted on: 03 January 2009 by Guido Fawkes
Absolutely right - you cannot subscribe to Broadband twice on the same phone line - so if you have a phone extension then you cannot run a broadband connection from this if you are already running a broadband connection on that line.quote:If this is the case it's highly unlikely from my knowledge of ADSL that you can connect them both at the same time.
Posted on: 03 January 2009 by Bruce Woodhouse
quote:Originally posted by munch:
Stay with your very nice cdp.
Is that from experince of the HDX?
Bruce
Posted on: 04 January 2009 by garyi
Bruce what is your router?
Posted on: 04 January 2009 by Roy Donaldson
Bruce,
Do you have power out to the other building ?
If so, is it connected back to your main house ?
If so, just use some of the ethernet over mains products you can buy.
Roy.
Do you have power out to the other building ?
If so, is it connected back to your main house ?
If so, just use some of the ethernet over mains products you can buy.
Roy.
Posted on: 04 January 2009 by gary1 (US)
Bruce,
The HDX is a terrific bit of kit. Obviously you have the XPS2 to use as a power supply with it when you trade in the CDP if you choose to do so. It adds alot to the presentation, although the 555PS is better. Interesting to hear an owner of a CDS3 considering this change and obviously it all depends upon how you want to access your music and how you feel the CDS3 and HDX compare "head to head" music wise.
To use the HDX if your collection is ripped onto the HDX, you only "require" the internet and access to rip your music collection so that the HDX has access to AMG for the data and artwork. Afterwards you can use the HDX without any internet access by using the front panel and remote. Internet access would only be required if you have "shared folders" or if you want to control the HDX from a Tablet PC, PC, netbook pc, internet handheld like the Nokia since you need the internet to access the HDX's local IP address and this can be done wirelessly. If using the HDX for ripping/network sharing a direct ethernet connection is obviously the best way to go.
The HDX is a terrific bit of kit. Obviously you have the XPS2 to use as a power supply with it when you trade in the CDP if you choose to do so. It adds alot to the presentation, although the 555PS is better. Interesting to hear an owner of a CDS3 considering this change and obviously it all depends upon how you want to access your music and how you feel the CDS3 and HDX compare "head to head" music wise.
To use the HDX if your collection is ripped onto the HDX, you only "require" the internet and access to rip your music collection so that the HDX has access to AMG for the data and artwork. Afterwards you can use the HDX without any internet access by using the front panel and remote. Internet access would only be required if you have "shared folders" or if you want to control the HDX from a Tablet PC, PC, netbook pc, internet handheld like the Nokia since you need the internet to access the HDX's local IP address and this can be done wirelessly. If using the HDX for ripping/network sharing a direct ethernet connection is obviously the best way to go.
Posted on: 04 January 2009 by Bruce Woodhouse
Garyi
One router is a BT Home Hub v 2.0 and the other a Netgear of some variety. I also have a spare Home Hub v1 I can use if need be.
Roy, the other building has its own mains supply.
The reason for considering a change is to do with storage, ease of access to music, the ability to access it in both buildings, and also that I'm buying more music files rather than CD's and can only see that trend continuing. Audio quality IS important but I'm prepared to accept some loss for other benefits.
I have come to the conclusion that I need to get the netwrork wiring sorted when we get our building work done, and allow our current system to stay for a bit! As for the HDX, a demo at some point I think.
Bruce
One router is a BT Home Hub v 2.0 and the other a Netgear of some variety. I also have a spare Home Hub v1 I can use if need be.
Roy, the other building has its own mains supply.
The reason for considering a change is to do with storage, ease of access to music, the ability to access it in both buildings, and also that I'm buying more music files rather than CD's and can only see that trend continuing. Audio quality IS important but I'm prepared to accept some loss for other benefits.
I have come to the conclusion that I need to get the netwrork wiring sorted when we get our building work done, and allow our current system to stay for a bit! As for the HDX, a demo at some point I think.
Bruce
Posted on: 04 January 2009 by gary1 (US)
Bruce, I was wondering if any CDS3 owners would sacrifice a little of the music presentation by switching to an HDX because of the other benefits now and as you I believe will continue and increase in the future. Some have posted that they think that the HDX with PSU is better than the CDS3, but I believe the consensus is that the CDS3 is better with 16 bit.
Definitely, get the internet, router issues settled. I have everything ethernet connected and if possible this is the way to go using switches, etc... so that all pcs and other devices are "hard wired" with the added flexibility of using wireless devices as well.
Good luck
Definitely, get the internet, router issues settled. I have everything ethernet connected and if possible this is the way to go using switches, etc... so that all pcs and other devices are "hard wired" with the added flexibility of using wireless devices as well.
Good luck
Posted on: 04 January 2009 by Alan A
I will ask Phil our tech Support Manager to post a detailed reply here, as having a network available to the HDX sometimes but not always needs to be properly managed.
Not a big deal but it needs to be thought through.
Then all will be nice and simple!
Phil will probably post in the morning.
Thanks
Alan
Not a big deal but it needs to be thought through.
Then all will be nice and simple!
Phil will probably post in the morning.
Thanks
Alan
Posted on: 04 January 2009 by jon h
It would be nice if there was a network on/off soft switch in the HDX UI?
Posted on: 04 January 2009 by SC
quote:Originally posted by Roy Donaldson:
If so, just use some of the ethernet over mains products you can buy.
What is Naim's view on ethernet over mains - isn't there the potential here for a 'dirty' source of interference, especially if going to such lengths as dedicated spurs or separate psu on the HDX ?
Posted on: 04 January 2009 by QTT
quote:Originally posted by SC:quote:Originally posted by Roy Donaldson:
If so, just use some of the ethernet over mains products you can buy.
What is Naim's view on ethernet over mains - isn't there the potential here for a 'dirty' source of interference, especially if going to such lengths as dedicated spurs or separate psu on the HDX ?
IMO, this is a (very) bad advice. You can hear it immediately.
Posted on: 04 January 2009 by Bruce Woodhouse
quote:Originally posted by QTT:quote:Originally posted by SC:quote:Originally posted by Roy Donaldson:
If so, just use some of the ethernet over mains products you can buy.
What is Naim's view on ethernet over mains - isn't there the potential here for a 'dirty' source of interference, especially if going to such lengths as dedicated spurs or separate psu on the HDX ?
IMO, this is a (very) bad advice. You can hear it immediately.
Interestingly the ethernet over mains solution was precisely what Naim advised me-I emailed this query to them directly at the same time I posted here. As mentioned it does not really help anyway as I want to be able to access the networked HDX in the other building-which has its own independent mains supply.
quote:I will ask Phil our tech Support Manager to post a detailed reply here, as having a network available to the HDX sometimes but not always needs to be properly managed.
Not a big deal but it needs to be thought through.
Then all will be nice and simple!
Phil will probably post in the morning.
Thanks
Alan
That will be interesting, thanks.
Bruce
Posted on: 05 January 2009 by SC
quote:Originally posted by Bruce Woodhouse:
Interestingly the ethernet over mains solution was precisely what Naim advised me
Hmmm, that is interesting Bruce....My guess would have been they wouldn't go anywhere near it. Oh well !