shahinian

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just how much better are the arcs

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Hopefully the answer is a lot, as I wasn't impressed too much by my Compasses (now sold). Then again, maybe that's just me not getting on with the 'Shahinian Sound'...

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im hoping to sell my compass for around £1250

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Seems quite a bit. I sold my three year old pair (with 2000 spec drivers) for £650 including courier in mint- condition in oak. I'm sure (by the amount of interest my ad had) that I could have made £800 or maybe a little more, but I think £1250 would be expensive for these speakers as generally their performance is commensurate with that of a £1500 speaker and probably no more than that, IMHO..

For what it's worth I paid a little under £400 for my pair from a dealer, aged around 2.5 years when I bought them. So, I made a small profit on them, but I think you'd be hard pushed to make £1250. I really hope you do, though, it would be great for you...

TC '..'
"Girl, you thought he was a man, but he was a Muffin..."

hi kit,
i do seem to remember you saying that they were fantastic when you had them but yes, taste does change with time, the compass is now retailing at around £2700, 2 large price hikes in the last year so i think that £1250 is reasonable enough at less than 50% or retail and as far as i know no driver units have been changed since mine were bought. I wouldnt be upgrading if it wasnt for the proverbial carrot on a stick being dangled in front of me.....

Gus
Don't worry, Arcs are miles better than Compass. Even being a Shahinian fan, I didn't get on totally with Compass. For me, a no brainer really.

They should sound pretty good on the end of a 52/SC/180, a safe upgrade IMHO.

Cheers
Goose

...I submit that there is no problem here.

"they are not quite as lovely to look at as the compass so they will need to shine in order to be accepted!"

Because if they *don't* shine, then you wouldn't want them for the extra cash outlay either, right?

So maybe the two of you can make the decision together rather than from a position of trying to sell her on it.

- GregB

Insert Witty Signature Line Here

Goose,
Out of interest why didn't you get on with the Compass? I've had a pair for nearly five years now and on the whole like them with the exception that they sound very laid back unless played loud. This may be due to my amp as I am still stuck on a NAP90 and having tried them with a 250 on home demo I can see (hear!) that they are not really being driven properly. It seems that at low volume they struggle to reproduce higher frquencies with any "strength" - a friend commented that the treble is "missing" - did you encounter this?
Rgds,
Tom

Gus,

The Arcs are far better than the Compasses. There's more bass control, generally more refinement and they are more open.

You will like them.

Just don't listen to the Obelisks or you'll be unhappy with any other speaker, apart from the Hawks.

With the current price of Compasses at £2,700, you should have little problem getting £1,250, but as Top Cat said, I don't think they're worth it.

Arcs will be the best thing you ever bought; they will change your listening life.

In terms of WAF, my wife, who couldn't give a s**t about hi-fi, was so hugely impressed by the aural improvements overs my SBLs that she welcomed them into the house with open arms - your partner will love them.

Steve

Gus

The arcs are much more involving than compasses in every way. I've found that you need a 180 minimum to drive them, so you're in the right territory.

How old are the Arcs that you are considering? There was a major update a few years ago with a new passive radiator design and reinfirced internal bracing. The passive radiator design improved low end control significantly so try and go for one with those changes.

Still can't believe that Compasses in the UK cost £2700. I remember buying my Arcs ex-dem from Infidelity for £1200 when Compasses were selling for around a grand! Talk about inflation...

Afzal.

I listened to them a few years ago and being very familiar with Arcs felt there was something 'missing', sort of like your friend described..

I love the concept of a massive soundstage, but just felt they lacked a bit of 'bite'. I would still probably own them over most other conventional speakers though. I feel the Compass may not be as good value now, but I feel that their other speakers in the range are still great, they were really too cheap before (??).... Look at the amount of drive units you get in a pair of Obs/Hawks/Diapasons and the quality of the finland birch!!

Cheers
Goose

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The big Diapasion tweeter/mids with Hawks or Double Eagles however are on another plane of performance from the small fry and are much more satisfying to my ears.

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They are also on another price plane. Anyone actually spent £8,000 - £13,000 on speakers?

Yeah, as Nick L says I find them very uncoloured in comparisson to most speakers, granted the presentation is different, but 'coloured' is not a phrase that I would use at all!

I am not sure what went wrong with your experience Mr Lees, but I can guarantee you that they do not have a disconnected bass and are not steely with pianos!! :-).. Hey ho indeed! PS any new Prog around Nick?? apart from Spocks/PT?

Cheers
Goose

On a separate issue - has anyone heard the L300 yet? Any news on price?

David

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I am not sure what went wrong with your experience Mr Lees, but I can guarantee you that they do not have a disconnected bass and are not steely with pianos!!

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Goose, you have to remember that Nick was probably banging a tea-cup at the time to imitate the sound of the loose change in the pianists pocket.

David

well the jury is still out on this one.....ive borrowed them from my dealer for a few days/week or so.......when i first put them in the living room my first reaction was that they sounded really closed in and a bit muffled......i think that the treble unit might be slightly faulty, but after a few beers (nothing ever sounds good straight after coming home from work) they started to sound pretty amazing even with slightly duff treble, the bass response is absolutely amazing and nothing ive ever heard before, apart from nbls sounds quite as good. however i found a big note on them later saying "get these hideous monstrosities out of my lounge - they are even uglier than on shahinians website - they are just vile" so i think no matter how they sound when the treble unit is repaired they wont be residing in my living room. it has got to be said though that some things sounded better on the compasses and some things sounded better on the epos es14's which are still an amazing speaker. the other problem with them will be the fact that i have a terraced house and i did hear the neighbours knocking on the door inbetween tracks so i dont think they would be too appreciative if i went ahead and bought them. so all in all i think that they are great speakers but not for me......they need a big room (i think) probably a non suspended floor and a 70's decor orientated partner. so im going to keep the compass' as nothing is particularly wrong with them and im going to save my pennies for a pair of second hand 135's......unless of course anybody has some piano black sbl's...........

haha id love to! it all comes down to $$$ though....think i'll dig out my HNE plinths for the compass' and have a mess about with them.....thing is, the 135' is a easy option because i have the extra fraim level required.....sort of bought that by mistake.....
however, if i ever get a BIG house and i get a dedicated listening room the arcs will certainly be on my shortlist.....i just dont think i would ever be able to get them up to the volume i would like.......if only i lived in america, these british houses are just too small! I'll post a few pictures later on to show how much the arcs invade the room and how elegant the compass' look....ps thanks everybody for the extremely helpful input.

Gus

I would be interested in your views on these under the Shahinians. I have a pair of Arcs on a suspended floor and although they sound superb I was wondering whether a plinth would have a beneficial effect.

On a different matter I seem to recall that you are using the Isolda cryogenic I/c between your CDS and 52 - if so what are the benefits over the standard lead?

Thanks

Lambros

erm...not really done comparative dems with the plinths.....but will do over the weekend and let you know early next week......as for the townsend isolda - its no good, sold it, its just another musicworks snake oil cure, the only one that was very good but not necessarily better than the naim one is the mana stealth cable but in the end i have reverted back to all naim cabling as this gave the system the best all round balance. some instruments that were audible with the naim interconnect were completely absent with the townshend one and it also watered the bass down quite a bit.

Hi,
I bought a pair of these a couple of years ago to use with my Compass. Useful upgrade - cleaner bass and more open mid/top end.
Rgds,
Tom

really should have set them up - especially as each compass rests half on and half off a rug so these should make them perfectly level. how far out do you have your compass' tommy? 'cos when i set them up on the plinths its going to be harder to move them round with spikes on....also, on one of my compass one foot seems to be about 2mm shorter than the other ones and so they dont rest exactly level on the plinths which i think is why i never used them..ie it rocks ever so slightly.

well ive not posted as i was very unhappy with the stereo. the arcs went back, they have since found a lovely new home........however, the compass have really started to sing due to tightening up the screws in the cdx and now i am completely happy with them - i have just never heard them working at their best. i have no desire to upgrade the speakers now until i have upgraded the cdx to a cds2. / or moved to either 135's or active 250 (if i go active then i will probably get a(nother) pair of sbl's!)
so....after about 18 months of upgraditus and a lot of "i really cant hear a difference" i am very happy with the kit.
lambros - in the end i much preferred the naim interconnect, although my judgment might be wrong as the cdx has never worked properly, probably the same reason i thought the sbls' i bought were shit - i really wish i still had them. however, im still very sceptical of any items like the isolda interconnect, whatever you do if you try one make sure you get it on loan - just to be safe.
i also agree with tommy t that the hne plinths are worth a go, mine are now in place and they wont be moving anytime soon. the amps just seem to have a much better grip of the speakers with the plinths in place, more weight etc etc, im tempted to put some fraim chips under, to stop the splikes sinking into the floor but im not sure thats taking it all bit too far!

Gus,
Next step is to try some Final Daruma 3-IIs between speaker and plinth. These are isolators intended for sitting underneath equipment but I found they work under the speaker too. They consist of two metal cups with a ball bearing in the middle.
Whilst conventional wisdom is to keep the speaker still via the use of spikes, allowing the cabinet to move slightly really helps the dynamics - bass in particular tightens up and is far more articulate. You can get these from Walrus systems in London (£70 per set of 3, so you will need two sets).
Word of warning - a friend (who does not like my speakers anyway) thinks they sound better without the Darumas so perhaps see if you can borrow a pair from Walrus first.
Rgds,
Tom