Trampolin question
Posted by: jpk73 on 16 June 2001
The LP12 will sit on a SolidSteel Rack on a wooden floor: should I order my LP12 with or without Trampolin?
Jun
Nice to see Mr. Pig and I agree on something--the Trampolin is a nasty, evil bit of pure Linn profit.
Leave it off !
Cheers,
Bob
Ride the Light !ยบ
Definitely without Trampolin, and if you are going for a geddon and expect to get an Aro (be quick) why not ask if Linn can supply it pre-Cirkus!
....or try for a pre-Cirkus s/h LP12 but get the Aro now.
Chris 
quote:
As far as I can tell, only a small minority of LP12 owners dislike the Cirkus.
I must be one of that small minority, and I am obviously letting my prejudices show. Actually "dislike" is too strong, I just wasn't convinced by the change, and kept my LP12 un-Cirkussed.
I am aware however that my preference is based on comparisons made some years ago, even though the cirkussed LP12 had the benefit of an Arkiv over my (then) Troika.
Using Naim amps and speakers, I found the difference between Cirkussed and non-Cirkussed LP12 even greater if an Aro was used on both decks and if they were on Mana.
It simply proves that we have to make our own decisions - although I am not convinced that it would be as easy to make the same comparisons now.
Chris
Anyway, my dealer is not able to demo the comparison between pre- and post-Cirkus!
Thank you for your answers,
Jun
The main change with a Cirkus kit is a new bearing, inner platter and subchassis. The Cirkus kit also included new springs, grommets, belt. All new LP12's include these new parts.
There are some folks who actually prefer the music from the pre-cirkus LP12. I had the Cirkus upgrade done on my 1986 deck and years later pulled it out and went back to the old glued subchasis and bearing and inner platter. I found the music became more soulful sans the Cirkus. With the Cirkus the LP12 sounded sterile in comparison, more like a CD player. Removing the Cirkus brought back memories of why I bought the LP12 in the first place.
.
quote:
However, once I got used to the very different sound of the Cirkus - which took a long time - I preferred it by far.
......but what were you comparing it with after all that time?
Or was it just your memory of what went before?
Chris
To me the difference was much greater. I was using a Lingo, Ekos2, Klyde with mana feet on a Audiotech wall shelf for the deck. The rest of the gear was on dedicated supports by Archidee, Sound Organisation, and Audiotech. I lived with the old bearing for 6 years, bought the Cirkus and lived with it 6 years. Then a few years back I read an old article in Listener written by Art Dudley where he did this same comparison between the bearings using his own LP12. This made me curious, I still had the old bearing around so I knew I could pop it in and try it but I wasn't that convinced. The feeling I got from the first Naim forum was that most that had opinions preferred the pre-cirkus bearing. I then got the same impression from JW at Mana along with some of his vocal followers. I started reading more of what was said by these same folk and made these changes over the course of a few months.
1. Tried removing my Trampolin and going to old baseboard and Linn feet and going back.
2. No baseboard, Linn feet.
3. Replace Linn feet with 3M Mana feet.
4. Replaced Cirkus with old bearing, subchassis,
inner platter.
5. Replaced Audiotech wall shelf with Mana wall shelf. [Mana really had my respect at that point.]
6. Added a Mini Table to Wall Stand.
At this point I lived with everything for about a month. I thought now that I have everything setup well and everything is settled in with the system, I thought I would again switched back to the Cirkus just to see what my impressions would be. At the point before the switch I was very happy with how the system was sounding. I had felt I have moved the deck in a very positive direction for little or no cost. The feet change didn't cost me a cent. The bearing was also a freebie that I had held onto and had stored in my basement. Well I popped the Cirkus back in gave it some time to settle in but I never thought it came close with the music that I was getting from the old bearing.
"It's puzzling how different people can have widely differing perceptions of what one would expect to have been somewhat similar experiences. It's just as well, I suppose, the forum would be a lot duller otherwise" Jeremy
I think there are very few people that I know of who have lived with the old bearing, Cirkus, and then old bearing again for any amount of time. I waited awhile before I got the Cirkus and just bought it, as Mr Pig describes it did all the hi-fi things better but if you listen past those things with the old bearing I think the music will eventually win you over. Improving the stand will get you all the Hi-Fi things back IMO in spades.
[This message was edited by John Gilleran on TUESDAY 19 June 2001 at 20:14.]