The Mozart Thread

Posted by: Tam on 22 February 2006

To quote Tom Lehrer "It's a sobering thought that by the time Mozart was my age he'd been dead for three years." I know how he felt, though I not yet quite old enough to have outlived him, I did nearly choke on whatever it was I was drinking when I listened to the first symphony (K16) for the first time whilst reading in the booklet that he was but 8 years old when he wrote it.

Anyway, given it's the anniversary year, and we don't seem to have had a huge amount of Mozart (well, apart for Ian's thread), I thought I might try and alter that by mentioning some of my favourite works and interpreters.

We'll start with the concerti. I have a soft spot for the horn concerti which were, I think, the first mozart concerti that I ever owned. I should admit that I came to them via the the Flanders and Swan song which uses the finale from the K495. I have two recordings, the Koster/Tafelmusik/Weil reading and the Orpheus Chamber Orchestra and I think my preference is probably for the latter. I'm also rather fond of the clarinet concerto, though I only have the Orpheus's recording and wonder whether there are better out there.

Of course, no mention of the Mozart concerti would be complete without turning to the piano, particularly when I'm writing the thread, as I find the piano somehow the most satisfying instrument in a concerto. That said, my relationship with Mozart's didn't get off to a terribly good start. Following the penguin guide, I decided that I couldn't go wrong by buying Perahia's cycle (their rosettes having never steered me wrong in the past). That said, my only previous encounter with Perahia had been dreadful Edinburgh festival concert with the Academy of St Martin in the Fields where he proved (for me) why you shouldn't use a piano in a brandenburg concerto and that if, as a conductor, you're going to sing along with the music, you could at least do it in tune. But I digress. It's not that the Perahia cycle is bad, more I think that I had terribly high hopes for it and, as a result, it proved to be something of letdown and just left me a little unmoved much of the time. That said, I'm currently engaged in surveying all my Mozart piano concerti to decide which are going on my ipod (upon which space is fast becoming a premium) and his 4th and 5th have made it, so he isn't all bad. On of my favourites, though, technically not by Mozart, like all the first four, is the 2nd concerto (K39) from which I find the middle movement painfully beautiful, and Barenboim's reading with ECO particularly fine. Indeed, I would commend the whole of Barenboim's cycle, and indeed his latter, and much more refined (which has both its pros and cons) with the BPO, both of which can be had for an absolute song. Indeed, the Berlin cycle also has a rather wonderful bonus DVD with the concerti for two and 3 pianos with Solti and Schiff. Mozart's first really great piano concerto is probably the 9th (the Jeunehomme), which was recently featured on radio 3s building a library. There is rather fine mono account (though I don't know if it's available separately) with Kempff/Munchinger and the Stuttgarter Kammerorchester. Of more recent accounts Barenboim's with the BPO is rather fine, though I'm keenly awaiting the arrival of the Brendel/Mackerras/SCO version which I have on order. This latter team has so far done four discs, and I think, sadly, no more are planned, and I was much impressed when I saw the concert that followed the recording of their last effort (numbers 12 and 17). So far, however, I have only got their 20 and 24, both of which are very fine indeed. I have, somewhat deliberately, missed out a great many fine concerti, this is mainly because I want to steer clear of talking about the ones that I don't know so well, hopefully others will fill in.

I used to think that once you got below about about 25, the symphonies were rather a pale shadow of the later ones (indeed, there was recently a thread along those lines over on the radio 3 boards). Then, a few years ago, I picked up the Mackerras, Prague Chamber Orchestra complete cycle (on Telarc, most of which is, I think, available as individual discs too). - Incidentally, like most of my classical threads, with the exception of my Ring cycle and Mahler ones, this one is probably going to be a little heavy on Mackerras - Anyway, the vitality with which they play the early works is really quite something, indeed, the first few discs are among the most recommendable in the entire cycle, and now some of my favourite listening. That's not to detract from the later symphonies, which he plays very well too, but just that they lack something of the magic he brings to the youngest ones. I'm not going to mention all the fine symphonies, that would take too long and I will leave my glaring omissions to others to fill in (though I do feel a little bad skipping over 34-36). Instead, the only other ones I shall mention are two of my favourites, and the first two Mozart symphonies I ever owned: 40 and 41, the latter being one of my favourite symphonies of all time. There are doubtless many fine recordings of these two (including the rather nice Erich Kleiber/LPO 40th that I'm listening to as I write this) but I haven't heard anything, at least in the Jupiter, that touches Bernstein's account with the VPO.

A number of times and on a number of threads, Uchida's survey of Mozart's piano work has been mentioned and, to be honest, I don't think there is much to add to what has already been written. This is superb playing and should really be on every self-respecting Mozartian's shelf. I'll only point out my favourite moment, which comes in the Turkish March finale of the K331 sonata which features some of the most beautiful piano playing anywhere on disc and would almost certainly make it with me to my desert island. That said, the Solomon readings of the 331 and 576 (which couple with his unsurpassed Beethoven 5th concerto on Testament) are not bad.

Lastly I'll turn to opera. I'm about to enjoy Mackerras's (there I go again Winker) new release of La Clemenza di Tito, which was recorded just prior to a rather fine concert performance at the Edinburgh festival last summer and marks the latest instalment of his SCO cycle which has now jumped labels for the second time (by my count: it started on Telarc, went to EMI for Idomeneo, and this new issue comes from DG with Magdelena Kozena and Rainer Trost). That said, Clemenza is hardly Mozart's finest opera, even in the hands of Sir Charles. Le Nozze di Figaro on the other hand arguable is. Indeed it is one of my favourite operas and I have three recordings (none of which, you will doubtless be pleased to read is by Mackerras....yet). Part of the reason for my soft spot for Figaro stems from the fact that the Giulini/Philharmonia recording with Taddei and Schwarzkopf was the first opera I owned and I still prefer this recording above all other that I've heard. That said, purists may well object because in order to get it onto two discs Marcellina and Basilio's arias from act 4 have been lost. However, for my money that helps solve a problem in Figaro which is that most of the best music is in the first half, and the pace can sag accordingly. The only complete reading I have is Boehm with the likes of Prey, Mathis and Fischer-Dieskau, which in fact, only gets better as the opera progresses (after something of a shaky, and, to my ears, poorly recorded start). Still, it doesn't quite do it for me in the way Giulini does. The other account I have, which I can thoroughly recommend is Gui's mid 50s Glyndebourne account (which I believe is the favourite of Gramophone's good CD guide). I only purchased it because it's two sans libretto discs (cut in the same manner as Giulini) were on sale for just £6 in HMV the other day, and it would have been rude to pass them up (even when not on sale I think it only goes for around a ten pounds). This is a very fine account too, and though sound is a little 'early stereo' it is remarkably good for its time. If you're new to Figaro and/or on a budget (or even if you're not) it's well worth picking up. At this point I should probably leave a little space so that Graham can demand to know why I haven't yet tried Erich Kleiber's account - it's on my list! The only other operas I'll mention are Don Giovanni, which I have in the form of Giulini's very fine account, though I wonder whether it's a opera that really needs to be seen as well as heard, since it doesn't quite seem to capture the wit and sparkle of the Opera North production I saw last year. Lastly, there is the Magic Flute, I only have one recording, and it comes from Charles Mackerras (who else) and the LPO and is the only account in English and is very fine indeed.

I have doubtless missed many great works and interpreters off this list and, there was a certain degree of intent in that direction, the hope being that others will want to fill in the awful gaps my shameless Mackerras bias may have left. So, the floor is open!

regards, Tam
Posted on: 03 March 2006 by Tam
I really don't think it's possible to say enough good things about Uchida's sonatas - anyone who doesn't own them should. It's a shame that her concerti haven't got such good reviews (but they're about to get a rerelease at budget price so I probably won't be able to help myself....)

Speaking of the piano concerti, I have just been listing to a few discs of Brendel/Mackerras/SCO (of which I now have all four) and when I've done with them I'll post my full thoughts - however, suffice to say they're pretty good.

As to DG's sound, it can be a little funny sometimes. I'm sure I've read elsewhere that they go in for a philosophy of 'the more the merrier' in terms of microphone placement, and this may have something to do with it. That said, the recent Mackerras Clemenza (also on DG) is wonderful, and the use of plenty of microphones helped with the balance of Trost who (in the concert they did afterwards) was a little quiet in relation to everyone else.

regards, Tam
Posted on: 03 March 2006 by graham55
Well, bugger me, I meant to type "1791" above, but I can't change the effer.

And yet I can change other postings that I've made on other postings.

Is this entirely random, or is it some sort of joke on Naim's part? I just don't see the humour in it all. Come on, moderators, shape up, for fuxxake!

Graham
Posted on: 03 March 2006 by Tam
Graham,

I think it may be down to how old the post is. But either way it is very silly indeed and should be dealt with.

regards, Tam
Posted on: 03 March 2006 by graham55
Tam

No, it's not that, but no matter.

I'm enormously excited to see that DGG are just about to release a 3CD set of Friedrich Gulda called "The Mozart Tapes" (if I remember correctly) in which he plays "10 sonatas and a fantasia". I'll get it from Germany, where it's already available (once the new CK LvB7 is out).

Graham
Posted on: 03 March 2006 by Tam
Well, having listened to the last of my Brendel/Mackerras/SCO discs I can thoroughly recommend them all (well, save for the 22 and 27 which had some kind of scratch covering the last two minutes of the disc :O). Working in something approaching chronological order then:

First up is a disc of 9&25 which (I think is most commonly now available as a SACD, I think a hybrid). As I've said above, the 9th is one of my favourites and this reading doesn't disappoint. However, it does feel (as indeed, does this whole disc) ever so slightly 'by the numbers'. That's not to say there's anything wrong with it, quite the reverse, there is some stunning playing all round, but the readings just seem to lack a certain something (especially in comparison to the other three discs).

Next (and in terms of recording dates, most recent) is a coupling of 12&17. I suppose that I should declare something of an interest on this one in that I was at the concert they did of this pairing at the 2004 Edinburgh festival just after they'd recorded them. I suspect that lends an extra special something to the recordings for me that might not be the case for those who weren't there. That said, on this disc everything seems to click: Brendel's delicate playing and Mackerras's perfectly judged accompaniment. If you only get one of this four discs, in my view this is the one.

I'm not going to dwell on the last two discs in detail (the 22&27 already mentioned and the coupling of 20&24), both are very fine and fall somewhere in between the two already mentioned. My preference for Mackerras as a Mozartian (and, frankly, just about everything) else is well recording and I think he gets some wonderful playing out of the SCO. One of the things I've noticed about him as a conductor is how well he is able to accompany (I think I mentioned this when I was talking about Clemenza) and you see it here with Brendel time and again.

In short, if you buy any of these discs you are unlikely to regret (well, unless one of them is scratched). Amazon currently has them going for £8 or £9 each. Bargain, frankly. If you get just one, try the 12&17, it really is rather fine indeed.

regards, Tam
Posted on: 03 March 2006 by Basil
quote:
H.C. Robbins Landon


I can't resist, sorry.

I met the man at the Bridgnorth Haydn Festival many years ago.
Posted on: 04 March 2006 by graham55
Basil

Naimdropper!

Graham
Posted on: 05 March 2006 by Basil
I know!

What he doesn't know about Haydn and Mozart isn't worth knowing.

Also (what the hell, in for a penny) I managed to speak to Jack Brymer after his performance of the Mozart clarinet concerto.
Posted on: 05 March 2006 by u5227470736789439
Name-dropping mode on! Big Grin

I once turned the pages for Catherine Evans (Mrs Alan Hacker, pianist wife of the great clarinetist) in the Kegelstadt Trio with Hacker and a lovely viola player, whose name escapes me now! That was the most unpleasant experience I have had at a concert, and I was more nervous than if I had been actually playing something too hard for me! Mrs Hacker was delighted by my efforts, which of course were of a different order to turning at the desk in the orchestra, where you know the other player well, and how early to turn and so on.

Alan Hacker is a charming man, whom I had the pleasure to meet before the rehearsal, though I did not realise I had already been singled out for page turning duties! We talked for a couple of hours on matters musical. Apparently the impressario had told him about me and he was keen to talk to a mad boy from the countryside, who was described to him as 'musical.' People are nice aren't they! It was because of him I took up the bass!

Fredrik
Posted on: 06 March 2006 by graham55
I happened to be awake at 4.45am today, when the BBC World Service started an eight-part adaptation of Peter Schaffer's "Amadeus" read by F Murray Abraham. Now, as I've said above, "Amadeus" is sh*te, biographically speaking (so far as Mozart is concerned), but this included the extraordinary scene where Salieri hears and describes his first hearing of Mozart's Gran Partita (K 361) and runs from the room in tears, thinking that he has heard in Mozart's music "the voice of God". I found that scene in the film indescribably moving, and so it was again this morning.

Does anyone know whether this is this just an imagined inspiration by Schaffer or did this happen?

Graham
Posted on: 06 March 2006 by Steve Bull
For anyone interested in his sacred works, there's a performance on R3 this evening at 1900. BBC Concert Orchestra will be playing Regina Coeli, K276; Ave verum corpus, K618; Mass in C K257 and Credo MassMass in Cm, K427.

Steve.
Posted on: 06 March 2006 by Huwge
Graham,
I seem to recall from an earlier thread that you speak / read German. If I have not erred, I think you would really enjoy Brandauer liest Mozart, where the actor Claus Maria Brandauer reads from the letters of WAM. They have been playing these on the radio as part of the Mozart anniversary celebrations and they are very enjoyable and also insightful.
Huw
Posted on: 06 March 2006 by graham55
Huw

I'm a silly sod, really, as I've just spent the last few minutes ordering them, following your alerting me to them here. (I also ordered the Friedrich Gulda "Mozart Tapes", not yet released in the UK.)

I might now have to see whether the F Murray Abraham reading that I heard this morning is available.

Graham
Posted on: 29 March 2006 by Tam
Thought I'd bump this thread back up in order to post some more detailed thoughts on a couple of Mozart recordings that I've mentioned in other threads lately.



First up the Uchida/Tate/ECO cycle of Mozart piano concertos. Available for around £40 on 8 discs (which means, very annoyingly that several of the works, 16 and 19, are split between two discs). It doesn't (as is fairly normal) contain the first four concertos, which were only arranged by Mozart. I view this as something of a shame since I would dearly love to hear Uchida's playing in the slow movement of the second concerto. It doesn't include the concertos for two and three pianos nor the rondo KV386, though the latter is, in my view, no great loss.

So, how does it stack up. Well, those who read my post on Fredrik's library thread may have noted I kept it when pruning rest of my library for that list. Of the four complete cycles I now have (Perahia and both Barenboim's are the other three) it is by far the most consistently satisfying. It has the finest recorded sound of all of them and, I would argue, the finest orchestral playing (in general), about which more later. The downside, if such it be, is that the set has, with perhaps some justification, been criticised elsewhere as being 'over-pretty', and such a description would probably not be altogether surprising for those familiar with her piano sonatas. However, I think that such would be something of an unfair generalisation. In a number of cases she produces the finest accounts I own: the early concertos (5, 6 and 8) are especially fine, 12, 17, 19 and 25 are also highlights, though I also own fine Brendel/Mackerras recordings of many of those. Indeed, her 25 is wonderfully exciting and totally defies the adverse criticism I mentioned above.

I think it was Basil, in another thread, who asked me for my views on the 23rd. Sadly I found this to be a little disappointing. It wasn't bad, indeed it was very accomplished (as is all the playing), but in this case there was some degree of soul and sparkle missing. My guiding light for the 23rd is the stunning Horowitz/Giulini recording with the orchestra of La Scala; unbelievably it was made when he was in his 80s yet, especially in the finale, he seems more dextrous than Uchida and in the middle movement his playing more beautiful. Sadly (criminally, even) this recording is, as far as I'm aware, not available separately but only as part of DG's six disc set of Horowitz's complete recordings for them. However, this isn't so awful, because the whole set is very good and entirely worth having; fans of the 23rd ought to seek this out.

No complete survey is every going to completely satisfy or hold all the keys, but Uchida's will probably be my last (though I suspect I will still buy the odd individual recording). I suspect part of the reason I have enjoyed it so much is that I simply prefer her kind of style or pianism. While listening to this set I have occasionally turned back to the Perahia again (still at a loss to explain its popularity) and one of the things I have noticed is just how 'percussive' his pianism is, generating a sound that I simply do not find appealing. Barenboim, for the record, falls somewhere between the two.

Which leaves me one more thing to mention. I said at the start that this set had very fine orchestral playing. What is interesting is that three of my four complete cycles feature the same orchestra, the ECO and Uchida's recordings follow very closely after Perahia (so one assumes that many of the players were the same). On the one occasion I saw Perahia live it was deeply disappointing (he did a Brandenburg concerto, the Beethoven 1st concerto and I think the Mozart 38th symphony, it was certainly one of the late 30s, with the Academy of Saint Martin in the Fields), what was so awful about it was how badly he conducted the orchestra, there was absolutely no cohesion at all. However, looking at the relative quality of the orchestral playing, I am now wondering whether having the orchestra directed from the piano is detrimental (as on all my other cycles). Of course, I have seen Barenboim live, and he is a pretty good conductor, but the orchestral playing on his recordings is generally good, without being in any danger of being great. And, as I look through the list of concertos I have chosen for my iPod, I discover that almost always I have opted for combinations where there is a conductor (except in concertos 1-4 where I do not have any such recordings, if they even exist). It makes me wonder why it is such a commonplace practice in the first place. I know Mozart did it, but none of the artists on record is Mozart. I also wonder whether part of the reason he did it was either that he was using much smaller forces or simply that it was much cheaper. I wonder what others who know more think about this?

In summary, however, it is a great set, and well worth getting.

regards, Tam
Posted on: 29 March 2006 by Tam
(Note - if you've clicked straight to the last page of this thread, this is the second of two posts I've made bringing it back to the front pate.)



The second set I want to review (more briefly this time) is the Mackerras Clemenza di Tito as I said to Fredrik that I would give it another listen before giving it an unqualified recommendation (this, in part, because I wanted to make sure my appreciation wasn't entirely coloured by having been at the excellent concert performance at last summer's festival).

I've said good things earlier in this thread about Mackerras as a Mozartian, and this set only helps to confirm that. As mentioned in reference to their piano concertos, Mackerras and the Scottish Chamber Orchestra are a wonderful combination, indeed, in many ways one wishes he had done the Mozart symphonies with them instead of the Prague CO. Anyway, I came home on Monday after something of a tiring day at work and felt the urge to spin some Mozart and this seemed as good a time as any for Clemenza. From the electrifying opening of the overture Mackerras had me hooked and feeling much better.

I'm told that the drawback with this work is that the continuo is not by Mozart, but Mackerras has apparently cut it back to the bare minimum for this recording. I must say that what is left doesn't seem to me to be debilitatingly poor, though it does feel second rate next to Mozart's own wonderful writing for the arias. And wonderful they are, and very well sung. Even Rainer Trost (about whom I had doubts in the concert) sounds very good. Kozena is wonderful in the title role, and Christine Rice is a superb Annio. We also have Lisa Milne and John Relyea.

I summary, I have no difficulty in recommending this to anyone who is new to the work. As to how it stacks up against the competition, it is impossible for me to judge since this is my only recording: there may well be more out there, but this disc doesn't leave me wanting to go looking for it.

regards, Tam
Posted on: 29 March 2006 by Cosmoliu
Thanks, Tam, for bumping this thread back up; saves me having to search for it.

I have since received and listened to Anne-Sophie Mutter's Mozart violin concertos and I like the recordings very well. As has been said of her other offerings in recent years, her interpretations are often quite different from the main stream, and definitely different than her earlier performances with Herbert von Karajan. All in all, I find her new work refreshing. She may have laid it on a little heavy with the photos this time, however.



Norman
Posted on: 29 March 2006 by Cosmoliu
Darn, can't seem to get this link to photo URL thing down. Confused

Norman
Posted on: 29 March 2006 by Tam
Norman,

Right click on the image in question (assuming it's on the web somewhere) and select the option closest to 'copy image address to clipboard' - it's important what you get is the image address. The in your post you write {img}http://www.image.com/photo.jpg{/img} where the address is that of the image in question (which you can put in by doing edit-paste) and where the {} are replaced by [].

regards, Tam
Posted on: 29 March 2006 by graham55
Tam

Without trying to appear tendentious, I must say that I don't think that La Clemenza di Tito deserves a place anywhere near Mozart's four unarguably great operas: Figaro, Don Giovanni, Cosi and Zauberfloete.

Indeed, if I had to add a fifth to the list, it would be Die Entfuehrung. To my ears, not even the genius of Mozart could kick the dull dog that is 'opera seria' into life.

I'd suggest that any newcomer to Mozart, having got the Piano Concertos, the late Symponies and the four operas named above, would be far better advised to look to the mature String Quartets, the String Quintets and the Piano Sonatas, before going near Tito.

Just my opinion, of course.

Graham
Posted on: 29 March 2006 by Tam
Graham,

I think you're probably right - it isn't quite on a par with the four operas you mention, but there is some stunning music in there and when it is well played it's wonderful. I much prefer it to, say, Idemeneo. That said, if I had to choose between having it and the sonatas in my collection I'd choose the latter without even thinking about it. I don't know about the quartets, but then I don't know them well enough (and really ought to develop my cd collection in that area - as in so many others).

regards, Tam
Posted on: 29 March 2006 by graham55
Tam

Please just don't mention Idomeneo! Three (or more) of the longest hours of my life were spent sitting through the Glyndebourne Touring Opera's production of Idomeneo in Guildford (or was it Woking - I've tried to erase all vestiges from my mind) a couple of years back. Not even the fact that some idiot director had designed the stage to appear as a woman's pudenda could hold my interest, although I had to laugh when my chum, slightly slower on the uptake, guffawed some 50 mins into the performance and informed me that the stage set was a giant f*nny!

I've given recommendations for the String Quartets and the Quintets above. Do try to hear them. Among Mozart's greatest works, in my view. Oh, and there's a very fine recording of Mozart's greatest Quintets, K515 and K516 by the Allegris on Naim's very own label.

All best wishes.

Graham
Posted on: 29 March 2006 by Cosmoliu
Tam,

Thanks very much. I tried right clicking, opened the image in a new window, then cut/pasted the URL in the green thingy second from the right in the tool bar for the post a reply window. Here goes:

[img]http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/images/B000AD1IQ2/ref=dp_image_0/102-6631478-6200946?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=5174&s=classical[img]
Posted on: 29 March 2006 by Cosmoliu
Confused

I'm not a tech idiot, really.

Norman
Posted on: 29 March 2006 by graham55
Norman

I don't even try!

Graham
Posted on: 29 March 2006 by Tam
Norman,

Almost right, the final bit should read /img not just img.

regards, Tam