To FRAIM or not to FRAIM

Hello Geoff,

I would agree that Fraiming the whole lot would be the way to go if you've currently got it sitting on a run-of-the-mill stand. I've found that entry-level kit isn't quite as picky with regard to stands, but the higher up you go in the Naim range the better the boxes respond to good supports.

If you have the room, get two Bases and build two separate stacks making sure that there's a space of approx. 30 cm between the boxes on one stack and those on the other -- it really does make a difference.

Thomas

Hi Geoff

I've contemplated a Fraim upgrade, but eventually decided on the XPS2 as my next step . Admittedly this was without audition, but my reasoning was...

1. I can get a reasonable rack which will do for a couple of years for way less than the Fraim. Won't be as good, but will be better than the Target 2 shelf jobbie I had. Settled on a 4 shelf Stands Unique in the end, with 10 mm glass at £350.

2. I've heard the XPS2 with the CDX2 & its totally blown my mind. Basically I can't rest until I've got one

As an alternative, with your system, I'm guessing you could sell the 2 HiCaps if you went the SC route, which would make it a cheaper option, so maybe you could get a better (but not Fraim) stand, and an SC???

Personally I will be getting Fraim eventually, but it's just not made it to the top of my list, mind you if I ever get the chance for a proper A/B dem maybe I'll change my mind (my dealer is Fraimless at the mo, but keeps threatening to get one in...) Hmm, decisions decisions...

Geoff,

Dont complicate the matter. A Fraim is ESSIENTIAL if youre intrested to know how your system performs. There is no way around it, to my knowledge at least.

Fraim now, upgrade later. And yes, Ive done it mayself and Im extremly pleased.

Jonas

Thanks guys

So far it looks like a clear vote in favor of FRAIM as "the" upgrade if only so I will know what my kit really sounds like before adding more electronics.

Thomas,
Your comment about two stacks is interesting if expensive. So lets look into the future here (probably a long way unless I can get away with crime). Is this the right way?

Stack 1: Bottom to top.
XPS2
CDX2
282
Stack 2: Bottom to top
250
Napsc / HiCap (leading off to Stageline on sperate stand w.TT)
Supercap

If Steve Toy reads this as the "rack expert" maybe he can also comment.

The cheap option is 1 stack of 4 with bottom to top:
250
Spare shelf for future XPS2
CDX2
282

Other PS's in a seperate wooden rack. Currently 2x HiCaps (for 282) & napsc.

GEOFFP

hi,
not wishing to start off another Fraim v Mana debate, I nontheless looked at the finances invloved:
I already have a Mana 5 shelf amp rack and soundstage. Including planned upgrades I need another 3 shelves. To buy two 4 shelf Fraim arrays would cost over £2k. To buy another 4 shelf amp rack + soundstage would be £600-£700 tops. Therefore is the Fraim £1300 better than a Mana? My wife certainly agrees with others that Mana looks like an oil rig, and Fraim looks really cool.
I won't buy Fraim until I can get one home and actually listen to it...
The simple reason is if you treat it like any other upgrade the benefit will vary dependant on room siting and equipment its used with etc...

As the Nike ad says.............

You wont look back and it will do far more in depth to your current system IMO than any of the new bits you mention.

It will take what is already intrinsically good in what your have and ramp it all up bigtime. It will also work across everything whereas, while an XPS will undoubtedly give a better front end, the Fraim will settle the whole picture down and produce a result that you cant put down to the usual things new black boxes do like more and bigger bass and detail. The main effect I think is it enables you to drive greater volumes with far less stress or grit, graininess and glaze and provides far more space between instruments, highs and lows and allows better timing and following music passages.

It looks damn fine too especially in the wood finishes and is so precisely designed and manufactured.

Go for it.

Jono.

A system as good as yours NEEDS a Fraim.

And yes, it IS £1300 better than a Mana.
It's soooo ugly, and life's sooooo short...

Joe90

quote:

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.... and life's sooooo short...

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Ahh Joe, that hit home.

This is probably my last set of hiFi kit before pension and penury take over, so I shall probably "go for it" as they say.

Thanks for the inputs lads

GEOFFP

Sounds even better when graced by a CDS3.

But then.........

I couldnt possibly comment.

quote:

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It's soooo ugly

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Fraim Mana or both?

Chris

Geoff,

With the components you've listed I would suggest (top to bottom):

FRAIM 1:
CDX2
282

FRAIM 2:
XPS2
Supercap
Hicap/NAPSC
250

The main thing is to keep everything that contains a transformer away from the stuff that doesn't. You can then also experiment with the top-to-bottom order.

Thomas

Chris,

quote:

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Fraim Mana or both?

---

That did cross my mind - get one rack of Fraim - pay for it - then get the other rack...

Geoff

I have a similarish system to your's and Fraiming it all will cost approx £2500 which is a lot (Currently on Quadraspire Q4). What I am considering is Fraiming the source and leaving the Power on Q4. so I would have

Fraim (from top)
CDX
82
Lingo (extra height shelf)

Quadraspire
XPS2
Suppercap
135
135

Not tried this but this Fraim will be about £1000 and I would have thought will give the best cost/benefit.

Yep!
2.5K is a lot which was what prompted this thread in the first place.
So the economy model with the sources on Fraim and power supplies on "A N Other" makes sense.
It would be nice to have some level of visual match between the two so what "A N Other" looks at least half sensible alongside a Fraim?

regards
GEOFFP