Dentists ~ NHS or Private?
Posted by: naim_nymph on 08 March 2010
Any Dentists on the forum?...
After many phone-calls, this morning i was lucky enough to book an appointment for this afternoon with a NHS dentist...
The problem is a (non-painful but uncomfortable) abscess that lies under my big molar LL6.
This tooth received a lot of treatment from a previous dentist i used to see over a decade ago when i lived in the west country, (since moving away from there i haven't had a regular dentist). But around 14 years ago this tooth received a triple root canal filling and a large complex 3 surface amalgam restoration with pin retention.
It was a job done well and has lasted very well up until now! : (
The young NHS dentist i have just visited took an x-ray and confirmed the abscess, and explained to me that what had been done back then has now failed, and the next course of action is anti-biotics, and another appointment next week for a check over and almost certain extraction : (
I think he maybe right, my previous dentist was clever to rebuild this tooth, which is a very useful chewing type tooth, and gave it another 14 years, but now it's failing... doomed... bugger! : (
Anyway, private dentists in this neck of the woods are fully booked up, i can't find one for love nor money in time to give me a second opinion...
But would a Private Dentist give any other choices/options with the outcome?
Debs
Posted on: 08 March 2010 by David Scott
Nymph,
I'm sorry about your tooth and as I'm not a dentist I can't really offer any advice, but your post does raise a question for me.
Do you feel for some reason that a private dentist is likely to be better than an NHS one?
Posted on: 08 March 2010 by naim_nymph
quote:
Originally posted by David Scott?:
Do you feel for some reason that a private dentist is likely to be better than an NHS one?
Dentists are individuals, in my experience i have unfortunately met one or two shockers, (i still live with the physical and mental scars from one of them) but most i've had treatment from were very understanding, and very skilful at the job. At this moment in time i just don't know any.
I get the impression that NHS dentists are 'generally' younger and less experienced, and Private dentists have more time, and take more care with their 'client'.
But this does not simply mean NHS-bad Private-good...
The problem with going private is the expense, paying the bill hurts more than the treatment!
The young handsome NHS dentist i met today seems okay to me, trouble is it's not me he wants to pull! : )
Debs
Posted on: 08 March 2010 by Manni
Hi Debs,
sometimes a root amputation can help. The chances of success are not so good, but if you are lucky and the dentist does a good job, it is possible to avoid the extraction.
If the root amputation turns out well, a crown should replace the amalgam filling later because a tooth with root filling tends to break.
Best wishes
Manfred ( dentist )
P.S.: No comment about NHS or Private, in Germany these things are probably different to the UK.
Posted on: 08 March 2010 by hungryhalibut
Debs
I had a tooth (UL6) with root filling and a crown. Eventually (about 20 years later) it got a really bad abscess and my (private) dentist said it had had its day and pulled it out. She suggested a bridge between teeth 5 and 7, but as that would mean grinding down two good teeth, I live with the gap. It does not cause problems, though I did get a bit of rocket stuck in it earlier today.
Nigel
Posted on: 08 March 2010 by Manni
quote:
Originally posted by hungryhalibut:
Debs
I had a tooth (UL6) with root filling and a crown. Eventually (about 20 years later) it got a really bad abscess and my (private) dentist said it had had its day and pulled it out. She suggested a bridge between teeth 5 and 7, but as that would mean grinding down two good teeth, I live with the gap. It does not cause problems, though I did get a bit of rocket stuck in it earlier today.
Nigel
Nigel,
to live with the gap can be right, but take care that the teeth 5 and 7 don`t begin to tilt into the gap. In this case they can become loose later.
Manfred
Posted on: 08 March 2010 by Guido Fawkes
Posted on: 08 March 2010 by Blueknowz
NHS/Private they are all charlatans, my wife had several visits to our local dentist ,requiring several injections &treatment including 3 X Rays on each visit ££££££before they decided she had a wisdom tooth at the back of her mouth, so they arranged for her to see another dentist in Belfast the first thing he said to her was the X Rays were useless to him,she would to have more taken££££££££,then after a few more injections£££££££ the tooth was removed Total cost of treatment £ 176. I don't know why she didn't go to our friend who is a dentist he may have taken her wisdom tooth out straight away!
Posted on: 08 March 2010 by TomK
My wife's experience of going private was that she got the same dentist a bit more quickly and surprisingly not that much more expensively.
Posted on: 08 March 2010 by naim_nymph
quote:
Originally posted by Manni:
Hi Debs,
sometimes a root amputation can help. The chances of success are not so good, but if you are lucky and the dentist does a good job, it is possible to avoid the extraction.
If the root amputation turns out well, a crown should replace the amalgam filling later because a tooth with root filling tends to break.
Best wishes
Manfred ( dentist )
Hi Manni,
A root amputation sounds very intensive...
I don't know if this would be possible with my molar, the problem is that much of the original tooth has been replaced by amalgam with pins, i think this maybe why mine is not crowned?
...and a couple of years after getting this tooth fixed i accidentally bit into a date-pip breaking off the inside plate... my records read, "
Breakage of inside cusp of LL6. Lingual cusp fractured to gum margin and below. Difficult repair."
I would expect any attempt to rebuild this tooth to involve considerable cost, and i wouldn't like to gamble on luck of success.
But there must be some advances in this field of surgery, if one has plenty of money to spend on dental work, what's the best treatment available these days?
Talking of medical advances... while i was 'in the chair' yesterday, my Dentist took an x-ray of my lower left row, and within a few seconds a very clear picture image of my problem tooth was seen overhead on a LCD screen. I am very impressed with that, the last time i had a dental x-ray taken this super quick method hadn't been invented!
thank you for your reply Manni : )
debs
Posted on: 08 March 2010 by naim_nymph
quote:
Originally posted by Blueknowz:
...a wisdom tooth
Apparently, after another few hundred thousand more years of human evolution, we will stop growing wisdom teeth!
We just don't need them, or use them these days, i suppose we don't need the bone crunching leverage (as like the caveman once did). So should end up growing only 28 teeth. This is good news! : )
Or so i was told anyway.
I haven't always been unlucky with my teeth. In my early twenties i was referred to hospital for wisdom teeth removal. All four at the back taken out, and carried out under general anaesthetic, at NHS expense.
Although the facial swelling looked quite heinous for a few days after!
Debs
Posted on: 09 March 2010 by Manni
quote:
Originally posted by naim_nymph:
quote:
Originally posted by Manni:
Hi Debs,
sometimes a root amputation can help. The chances of success are not so good, but if you are lucky and the dentist does a good job, it is possible to avoid the extraction.
If the root amputation turns out well, a crown should replace the amalgam filling later because a tooth with root filling tends to break.
Best wishes
Manfred ( dentist )
Hi Manni,
A root amputation sounds very intensive...
I don't know if this would be possible with my molar, the problem is that much of the original tooth has been replaced by amalgam with pins, i think this maybe why mine is not crowned?
...and a couple of years after getting this tooth fixed i accidentally bit into a date-pip breaking off the inside plate... my records read, "
Breakage of inside cusp of LL6. Lingual cusp fractured to gum margin and below. Difficult repair."
I would expect any attempt to rebuild this tooth to involve considerable cost, and i wouldn't like to gamble on luck of success.
But there must be some advances in this field of surgery, if one has plenty of money to spend on dental work, what's the best treatment available these days?
Talking of medical advances... while i was 'in the chair' yesterday, my Dentist took an x-ray of my lower left row, and within a few seconds a very clear picture image of my problem tooth was seen overhead on a LCD screen. I am very impressed with that, the last time i had a dental x-ray taken this super quick method hadn't been invented!
thank you for your reply Manni : )
debs
Hi Debs,
of course the root amputation is a sort of gambling. Even when the dentist did everything right, it is possible that the tooth has to be removed later because of an infection.
As this tooth has at least two roots and the bone is rather thick at this region, the operation is not so simple, so it can be better to visit an oral surgeon.
There is no problem to make a crown even when the tooth has a big amalgam filling with pins. If there is not enough dental substance to fix the crown, it is possible to insert a solid and long pin in one of the root canals after removing the root filling.
Kind regards
Manfred
Posted on: 09 March 2010 by Fraser Hadden
[/QUOTE]Apparently, after another few hundred thousand more years of human evolution, we will stop growing wisdom teeth![/QUOTE]
Evolution doesn't work like that! It filters out harmful characteristics - the neutral, even if useless, persists. We will have wisdom teeth to the end of (our) time.
Fraser
Posted on: 09 March 2010 by hungryhalibut
quote:
Evolution doesn't work like that! It filters out harmful characteristics - the neutral, even if useless, persists. We will have wisdom teeth to the end of (our) time.
As we have evolved from apes our jaws have shortened, hence why wisdom teeth are gradually disappearing. Evolution works by giving greater reproductive success to those better adapted to their environment, so it's more about selecting the positive rather than deselecting the negative.
Nigel
Posted on: 09 March 2010 by Mike Dudley
No no no no no...
It was all created by a Magic Sky Fairy four thousand, oh sorry - new extimate, six thousand years ago, and hasn't changed since.
Don't you know anything?
Posted on: 09 March 2010 by Fraser Hadden
quote:
Evolution works by giving greater reproductive success to those better adapted to their environment
By your own argument, how will wisdom teeth confer reproductive disadvantage?
By extension, why is, say, genetically-founded poor visual acuity so prevalent, even in the young? Your mechanism would have bred it out as it was plainly disadvantageous in distant historical times. And so on........
I stand by my argument. The standard schoolbook argument is as you state but doesn't explain the survival of neutral and non-critically disadvantageous characteristics through generations.
Fraser
Posted on: 09 March 2010 by hungryhalibut
quote:
By your own argument, how will wisdom teeth confer reproductive disadvantage?
Wisdom teeth will often become impacted as our jaws shorten and if untreated would lead to pain, infection and possibly worse - hence the disadvantage.
It is easy to see how a shortsighted wildebeest would not make the annual migration - hence why such a trait tends not to be passed on. But humans have more sophisticated support, so weaknesses can continue.
Nigel
Posted on: 09 March 2010 by David Scott
Nigel,
it's only a disadvantage if it makes you less likely to breed successfully. As the chances of dying of an impacted wisdom tooth before you reach breeding age - or being rejected as a sexual partner because you have toothache - are fairly small, wisdom teeth could be around for a while.
Also, an evolutionary trend towards shorter jaws has to stop at some point. No reason to assume this isn't it.
Posted on: 09 March 2010 by BigH47
No one here written a book on Evolution we can't get, to read?
Posted on: 09 March 2010 by naim_nymph
Howard,
Going by the huge time-scale, we really need not worry about evolution.
But by using Genetic Engineering they will one day quite soon isolate the wisdom-tooth gene, and for evermore humankind will grow only 28 teeth.
Let's just hope they don't miscalculate slightly and isolate the wisdom gene!
Debs
Posted on: 10 March 2010 by Rockingdoc
You need to find a denist who specialises in endodontics. I have never had success in this outside the private sector, probably because it involves significant investment in speciaist equipment to do the best job.
I have need five teeth treated in this way in the last two years, so feel painfully experienced.
Posted on: 10 March 2010 by BigH47
quote:
Let's just hope they don't miscalculate slightly and isolate the wisdom gene!
I think it is already happening!
Posted on: 10 March 2010 by Willy
The dental practice I was in quit NHS work about 4 years ago. Spent months phoning around trying to get onto the books of another NHS dentist with no luck. Even finding a private dentist to take me on took a while. Waiting time for an appointment is a minimum of six weeks, even private. I broke a bit of LL5 last week and my appointment to get it looked at is 16th April. If it starts to hurt then they'll try to do something sooner.
What really annoys me in all this is when some bloody politician pops up on th enews to tell us that teh state of dentistry in the UK is better than it ever was. Shame Bupa don't do teeth.
Willy.
Posted on: 12 March 2010 by Stuart M
Had problems getting a decent NHS dentist 10 years ago but now, no problem (I'm in South London). Apointments normally within 3 days but if an emergency will squeze you in. Tooth hurt beging of last week, dentist last Tuesday (cleaned and descalled) and apt made for wisdom tooth extraction and fitting for a new crown next Tues. Seems to be working well.
The new contacts seem to work quite well as unlike before there is no temptation for dentists to "drill and fill" to make income ( I have my own horror story on that!). Also the three 3 price bands that cover all NHS work max £198 make it easy to work out cost.
That said, I have heard where people that have teath that requires extensive work they find it difficult to get accepted by an NHS dentist as the cost of the patients treatment would be significant to the practice. Whereas before when paid by work performed these would have been profitable patients.
Posted on: 12 March 2010 by naim_nymph
quote:
Originally posted by Stuart M:
The new contacts seem to work quite well as unlike before there is no temptation for dentists to "drill and fill" to make income ( I have my own horror story on that!)..
Hi Stuart,
I can give you lots of empathy on your horror story...
My teeth got 'The NHS Trench Treatment' when i was only 17 years of age. I was far too trusting and naive when young : (
My only consolation is thinking that the dentist who carried out that abuse was fairly old back then so he is most probably dead by now… and smoking in Hell for his sins.
Hopefully with a demon clamped firmly to his head ‘eternally’ drilling his pegs out and saying, "So this is what you did just for fun and a few extra bucks is it?"
I’ve been paying very dearly for his mistreatment ever since!
Debs
Posted on: 12 March 2010 by Stuart M
quote:
I’ve been paying very dearly for his mistreatment ever since!
Debs. your use of "Trench" is so appropriate.
Me got so bad that I had to go to an emergency dentist to release the preasure (private) from abcesses on a weekend. He told go straight back to to the dentist and demand an emergency apointment. I did and thought he was fixing things and doing other work at the same time but he trenched the other side and the temp filled both sides doing nothing about the abcess.
Several hours later I paid in agony for his work and had to go back to the private dentist and while he would not say a word against the dentist I was aparently his only NHS paitent. (This was around 84 when I was a student)
My dentists hell is simple just a nice juicy abcess under every tooth he wreaked and being fed the best tasting food available that was very chewey (Think onglet steak, that evil toffee a relative used to make etc). Oh and of course the constant drill whine intermitantly playing through the a full on Naim setup so it really gets to him.
Better stop now or this could be a Saw VII script LOL
Stuart
