Viable alternatives to a NAC 82?

Posted by: Alex S. on 10 October 2001

Are there any?

As you may know:

I have a 32.5 but realise its not the best thing since ready prepared Hovis.

I sold an 82 recently because I didn't like it.

I cannot avoid the police and aquire a 52 at the same time.

I have been told that DNM could provide a viable alternative for 82 type money.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

Alex

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Steve Toy

Densen B200, or DM 20 (second hand)

It's always a nice day for it, have a good one
Steve

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Dev B

i know this is controversial but i think a 102 is spectacular, esp when powered by a s/cap. i have heard this combination many times. an 82 is pretty unforgiving sometimes and a 52 makes everything sounds good. the verdict of the mullet panel of judges is - 102.

mullet audio
'we know best'

ps. will call you

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Mick P

Alex

You are a man of taste, wit and resource. You want the 52 so go for it because you will not be happy until its little green logo is glowing in your lounge.

I have just ordered one, so if I can do it, so can you.

Regards

Mick......I spend money on boxes not angle iron.....bah bah bah.

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Simon Matthews

Not sure what you are asking.

Alternatives to naim pre amps whilst retaining a naim power amp?

Alternatives to an 82 within the context of naim amplified system not detailed?

If you went from a 32.5 to an 82 ( with what?) and did not like it then I don't think you would like what a 52 does either. You don't explain how it altered your system performance. When I went from a 72 to 82 I thought the transformation was fantastic in every way. Still - different strokes for different folks....

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Mick P

Mr Blzepup

I like the 82 but I like the 52 even more. I do not think I am alone in that.

BTW...the tinnitus is cured thanks to the good advice given by a friend of taking Ginko Biloba.

Yes I do like SBL's whats strange about that.

Regards

Mick

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Alex S.

Go back to the Music Room immediately and stop spoiling our geeky hi-fi ramblings with Cassidy talk.

Alex

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Alex S.

My system is listed under 'personality' in the profile.

I found the 82 unforgiving/harsh/brash/etc etc

I think there must be reasonable alternatives out there especially when one condsiders that it takes the addition of a 2K+ power supply to make an already 2K+ preamp sound its best.

Yes, I mean to use a non-Naim preamp with a 250, although I might chuck that out as well and be damned to hell.

My sources will remain no matter what - CDS2/LP12

I may do as Mick says and end up with a 52. No harm in playing the field first.

Alex

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Alex S.

I thought tinnitus was having a fridge full of Fosters

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Greg Beatty

quote:

Regards
Mick......I spend money on boxes not angle iron.....bah bah bah.

I practically fell out of my chair when I read that one.

- GregB
Easily amused today

Insert Witty Signature Line Here

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by John C

"A few quick replies - I'm told the kids are hungry"

For God's sake Alex get your priorities right! We still haven't sorted out the XPS/ new preamp question. Where's your commitment?

John

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Andrew Randle

Get the DNM equivalent... however, you may need a DNM or Crimson power amp to match.

An unbelievably musical product with a "hear-through" sound that preserves the character and emotion of musical instruments. Try it.

Andrew

Andrew Randle
2B || !2B;
4 ^ = ?;

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Rico

The 82 is a fab pre. Nor is it fussy. On the old forum I posed the questions as research before acquiring my own - the results were unanimous, it plays tunes laying on it's back with a guitar on hips, on it's side up against the wall... anywhere. A 52 it ain't.

quote:

I thought tinnitus was having a fridge full of Fosters

Nice one Alex - I had a good laugh on that one! Perhaps it'll show up with "Zane the Feng Shui consultant" in their next ads.

Funny thing is hardly anyone in the southern hemisphere drinks Fosters. Most accurately compared with WD40 - nasty stuff apart from their advertising and promotion. Safer bet from the land of boomerangs is Crown Lager, Hahn, or Cascade; Coopers also is a fine drop although in a different league. Red Back also worth trying if wheat beers are your bag, but I digress.

Sorry, no decent proposals for an alternate pre. The Densen thing would certainly be worth investigating if my recent experiences with a big densen power amp are anything to go by - although wouldn't this put you in the "no-go zone" of non-naim pre with Naim power amp?

Rico - SM/Mullet Audio

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Steve Toy

Naaaah!
Yours,
The Toy with lots of fur (and innards,) but no foam at the mouth!

BTW, Rico, which big Densen power amp did you hear then? as I'm looking to upgrade mine. I was wondering if the B300XS had finally been launched, and this was what you heard.
Also, I think the issue here is pre-amps and not power amps, although I'm glad someone else agrees with me that the Densen approach to music reproduction is not exactly far removed from that of Naim.

It's always a nice day for it, have a good one
Steve

[This message was edited by Steven Toy on THURSDAY 11 October 2001 at 03:55.]

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Rico

[doffs hat]

Rico - SM/Mullet Audio

Posted on: 10 October 2001 by Steve Toy

Stick yer hat back on, man!
You don't seem like a hat-wearer/doffer to me!

It's always a nice day for it, have a good one
Steve

Posted on: 11 October 2001 by Alex S.

quote:
I think its a bit rich having the opinion that the 82 is poor because it needs a 2K plus power supply to (in your opinion) get the best from it! Isn't it the same situation (except an even higher value ps) for the 52!

I thought a Supercap cost the same no matter what preamp you plug it into.

A good thing about a 52 is you use 13/15ths of an S-cap instead of 4/15ths with an 82 and just 2/15ths with a 32.5.

I don't think an 82 is at all poor, I just don't like its presentation in my particular listening room and system. Also, I do find it slightly poor value that to get it to sound its best one needs to spend close on 5K.

I'm not saying my opinions are correct or that yours are wrong. They're just my opinions 'tis all.

Alex

Posted on: 11 October 2001 by Andrew L. Weekes

Wanna try a 112?

Andy.

Posted on: 11 October 2001 by Ade Archer

I have an 82 with one Hicap, and have occasionally wondered how much better it would sound with a second Hicap added. Naturally I would love to add a Supercap eventually, but an XPS for my CDX is more of a priority.
The thing is people describe the 82 as using approx 4/15 of it's capacity, which seems awful value for money for it's cost over a Hicap. My question is how much of my single Hicap's capacity is being used by my 82, how much would it use of two Hicaps, and how can it benefit so much by the addition of a Supercap when it seems to use so little of the Supercaps potential.

Cheers
Ade

Posted on: 11 October 2001 by Andrew L. Weekes

The reason for the comments about an 82 only using a small proportion of a supercap is because an 82 (or worse a 32 / 72 etc) only use a small number of the supplies available from the supercap.

There is a lot of unused regulators which you are paying lots of money for. Only items that use the Burndy interconnects will make fuller use of the supercap, and this is where a significant proportion of the benefits arise.

If I didn't have plans to use a supercap on a item that fully utilised it I'd personally have trouble spending that much money on unused parts.

The 82 will use 100% of either 1 or 2 Hicaps.

What we need is a super-Hicap, i.e. a Hicap with supercap noise performance. It's easy to do, but I guess it wouldn't sit in Naim's product lineup easily.

Andy.

Posted on: 11 October 2001 by Dev B

Whether a 52 uses 1/15th or an 82 uses 3/457th' of a SuperCap is all a bit useless really. The most important bit is the music (not necesarily the sonics) and naim preamps really do the business. A 32.5 might not sound as open, etc as a 82 but musically it works. Personally, I think the 102 is brilliant as is the 82 with 2 Hicaps and the 52...well that is something else entirely. The only thing I would say about 82's and 52's etc is that if your source isn't good you will hear it very very clearly. I have found 72's etc to be a bit more forgiving in this regard i.e you can plug in any old fuckwit source at it sounds Okay.

mullet audio
'the voice of reason'

Posted on: 11 October 2001 by Alex S.

Yes but, it only took 2/15ths of my brain to work out that about 2 grands worth of my Supercap is sitting around doing sod all.

No matter how much better an S-capped 32.5 or 82 is compared to a Hi-capped one, and its a lot, it does make you think about best use of resources.

Alex

Posted on: 11 October 2001 by Ade Archer

In my original post I was going to suggest that it would be nice if a power supply existed between the Hicap and the Supercap which meant that I could gain all of the benefits of a Supercap without paying for a lot of components that would be unused. This must surely apply to other components than preamps below the 52. Surely active crossovers and Prefixes etc, when powered by a Supercap are using only a small proportion of it's capabilities.
The other consideration is that even if, as I'm sure it does, the Supercap offers an improvement over two Hicaps, I could get another Hicap for around £400 second hand, whereas second hand Supercaps are very few and far between, and even then seem to go for around £1500+. I am also much more comfortable with the fact that, if Andrew's statement is correct, 100% of the money I spend on a Hicap is being used effectively.

Cheers All

Ade

Posted on: 11 October 2001 by Dev B

a supercap is a better p/s than a hicap so even though you are not exploiting all of it, it is still pretty good and the musical results in most installations is fabulous

speak soon young jedi

Posted on: 11 October 2001 by Andrew L. Weekes

Alex,

Reckon there's a market opportunity there, don't you.

I'll do the electronics, you could manufacture some fine cases.

Do you want to tell them or shall I?

Andy.

Posted on: 11 October 2001 by Alex S.

Andy: The 'Mad-Cap' case is already under development. I think it best if you tell 'em - you're the brains behind the outfit.

Mullet: 'speak soon young jedi'. I hope you don't turn out to be my father!

JW: With baby number 3 due in a month and my restoration business hardly setting the world alight finance-wise, I'm just not sure I can wait as long for my 52 as I feel I might have to. (I also want to stay married).

If I can get most way to OZ on the sly and the cheap I think I'll be happy.

Alex