Trimble ousted - what now?

As my mother lives in Belfast I take a close interest in what's happening over there. The rise of Paisleys party is worrying but I suppose an inevitable consequence of the rise of Sinn Fein.

I don't normally say things like this but I look forward to the day when Paisley is dead, as given his despicable track record during the troubles, it's difficult to see progress being made while he's still politically active.

quote:

but I look forward to the day when Paisley is dead

Isn't there a son following on to keep up the "christian POV"

Howard

I fear that it will be a return to mayhem: bombings, shootings, punishment beatings (and shootings) and violence. And all, other than the gangsters (of whatever so-called "religion"), will be the worse for it.

G

Rubbish, you're only interested in talking about it (all of us) because there's just been an election, people normally don't give a monkeys toss on this forum² about N.Ireland, or Irekand persay.


Fritz Von Wotta Bitch

It often seemed to me, that Trimble's initiatives were always somewhat fragile, trying to be all things to all men and easily diverted by the right-wing leaning members of his party. Paradoxically, Paisley could have more success in implementing any agreements he makes. He has full support of his party and a mandate from NI unionists. The question is, will he maintain stubborn resistance to power sharing or respond positively to PIRA dis-bandement/weapons de-commissioning ?

He's coming to the end of his political career, so does he see his legacy as keeping Ulster orange, or of having "beaten" the IRA and entering power-sharing on his own terms?

Lot of "what ifs ?" implicit in my post, I think the next few weeks will see statements from both the nationalists and the unionists indicating how the cards will fall.

Brian

I think it’s clearly a bad omen for NI when such a substantial part of the population still feels the need to polarize and retrench when it comes to elections. With the SF and DUP polling so highly one has to wonder whether the apparent reduction in sectarian sentiment in the community is a reality? As Brian rightly inferred, Trimble’s problem was that, insofar as he supported the Good Friday agreement, he was undermined from within his party and his electorate and to that extent his efforts were ineffectual and he was simply unable to deliver the support of the Unionist majority that the agreement required.

I think that we’re in for a period of posturing and standoffs as SF and DUP appeal to their grassroots support in facing down the enemy and being seen not to give an inch. If no progress is made for long enough then disillusioned and idle hands will get to work and the whole situation might well slip. One would hope, perhaps naively given the history, that both parties would see, or be made to see that the current situation is untenable and that failure to engage will mean a return to direct rule from an increasingly impatient Westminster. Unfortunately the DUP doesn’t appear to have a moderate wing and will have viewed the electoral demise of the OU as an indication that the Unionist electorate wants to see the scrapping of the agreement and the ostracizing of SF. Paisley Jr. Seems if anything to have the capacity to be more of a nut than his old dad.

quote:

Originally posted by Berlin Fritz:
Rubbish, you're only interested in talking about it (all of us) because there's just been an election, people normally don't give a monkeys toss on this forum² about N.Ireland, or Irekand persay.


Fritz Von Wotta Bitch

Graham, would I be correct in saying that you don't have children living in Belfast? Some of us do give a toss. That we don't bang on about it on hi-fi fora does not reflect a mere part-time interest.

Regards,

Reginald.

Reggie,
Would I be correct in assuming that the only reason you give a toss about Northern Ireland is because you have children living there ? If so all well and good, though the argumrent is weak I'm afraid, and I personally do not take interest in certain areas of the globe and their problems purely for reasons of self interest, or at least I certainly hope I don't, innit ? I'll repeat my first point, the recent election, and the Nobel Laureates demise, pale into insignificance in contrast to th´ree sisters trying to get financed in €urope to run a legal battle that the British/NI Govt don't want to spend a penny upon, that's frightening in my opinion.


Fritz Von Blöoody German's will probably give em a few bob too, how bloody embarrassing can you get eh ? or is Trimble's leaving undemocratic ?

What with Yes Man Wally Peter Hain now in charge there things could get worse, that his constant inane grin will not wear over there, so he's well out of his depth. I believe they use PR in NI if I recall, maybe Tony wants to get rid of that horrible attack & threat on New Labour's Demockery by another method ?

Fritz Von Sgt Wilson would be more effective

quote:

Originally posted by Berlin Fritz:
Reggie,
Would I be correct in assuming that the only reason you give a toss about Northern Ireland is because you have children living there ?

Fritzy, (me old mucker)
Your assumption is, Lord Elpus, correct. It is in the nature of things to care most about that which has a direct influence upon one's personal life. If, when one expresses concern about goings-on in, for example, Northern Ireland, one were required, in the interests of 'political correctness' to put a foot-note to all one's posts to the effect that "I, the undersigned, wish it to be known that I consider all social injustice, from all countries from Azerbaijan to Zanzibar, to be of equal proportion", discussions may become a tad unnecessarily lengthy. Which may restrict bandwidth for the likes of

ReggieVonUndecipherableSignOffLines.

(Innit )

quote:

Originally posted by Berlin Fritz:
I'll repeat my first point, the recent election, and the Nobel Laureates demise, pale into insignificance in contrast to th´ree sisters trying to get financed in €urope to run a legal battle that the British/NI Govt don't want to spend a penny upon, that's frightening in my opinion.

Firstly, you are wrong. The McCartney case is a spent force. Like it or not, even if they achieve a successful civil verdict, it's had all the effect that it will ever have. It's trivial in comparison to the election result.

Secondly, it is not your place to dictate the terms under which the members of this forum initiate discussions. If you don't like it, you can f*ck off.

quote:

Originally posted by Reginald Halliday:
Some of us do give a toss.

Graham can't see beyond his own massive ego and therefore likes to tar everyone with the same brush. Like you I have family in Northern Ireland so have always taken an interest in the politics there.

Back in the late 80's and early 90's I was in the armed forces and when I visited family in NI (which I did regularily) it used to be quite scary at times and I used to get a security briefing and permission before I was allowed to visit.

Great to see the expected pompous hypocracy seeping out once again from some of you chaps, innit.


Fritz Von I trust you both do actually vote when permitted to ?

I might as well throw in a few points seeing as:-
A I was born and lived in Belfast for 24 years.
B One parent is a Nationalist and the other a Unionist.
C I went to a school of the opposite religion to the one I was brought up in.
D I don't care what country N.I. is in or might become part of (although Australia would be nice).
E I don't live there anymore (I'm in sunny Hertfordshire).

I don't think that the demise of Trimble is of any great consequence. The DUP already had a substantial lead over the OUP. I don't regard Him as a moderate either. After all He's (as far as I know) still in the Orange Order. I think the DUP and Sinn Fein will eventually come to some sort of agreement. Why? Because their mutual lust for power will eventually force them into bed together. This will take some time as there will need to be arms given up etc. I would rather see the decline of the DUP and Sinn Fein to the advantage of the OUP and SDLP as I regard the DUP and Sinn Fein as basically fascists who feed off their respective communities rather than helping them. Many younger people in N.I. don't vote as they feel that no party represents them.
The current biggest stumbling block is not Trimble's demise but the Republican movements' addiction to paramilitarism. No Unionist party will deal with them until this stops.
The government could do more outside politics to improve the situation. (Here comes my hobby horse) The education system stinks. Not in the quality of education but in the fact that it is segregated. Catholics go to Catholic Chuch schools and Protestants go to State Schools. What hope is there while this situation exists? Childhood would be the ideal time for mixing of the populations so each can see the other hasn't got horns and a pointed tail. I was brought up in a mixed community but most of my relatives live in those which are not. My views differ greatly to theirs. People who grow up in a mono culture have no one to tell them the other lot are OK.
Here ends the rant (and my lunch break). I've got to say I've been heartened by the generally intellegent comments/discussion on this forum. Most people from N.I. assume most people over here would rather we fell into the Atlantic.
Rich.

A wonderfully timed post Sir