Equipment support..?
Posted by: ChrisG on 06 August 2003
Hi
What's the thoughts on BASE paltforms under Naim equip, I have one under a CDS2 and it seems to work a treat. When placed under the 82 pre there is a noticeable improvement to the sound. My equipment is all supported on MDF shelves in a recess isolated from the walls with target spikes from the shelf supports to the MDF.
But I do have a lot of sssssssssibilance!!
Chris
What's the thoughts on BASE paltforms under Naim equip, I have one under a CDS2 and it seems to work a treat. When placed under the 82 pre there is a noticeable improvement to the sound. My equipment is all supported on MDF shelves in a recess isolated from the walls with target spikes from the shelf supports to the MDF.
But I do have a lot of sssssssssibilance!!
Chris
Posted on: 06 August 2003 by prowla
I've got Stands Unique carbon isolators under my CDX, 82 and 250, on a glass Optimum rack. They definitely improve things, and only cost (just under) £20 for 3 feet.
No sibilance, nice bass (my speakers are Kans!).
I've been wondering about trying BASE/Isoplat/Nuance etc. just to see what they're like.
Paul Rowlands
No sibilance, nice bass (my speakers are Kans!).
I've been wondering about trying BASE/Isoplat/Nuance etc. just to see what they're like.
Paul Rowlands
Posted on: 06 August 2003 by ChrisG
Paul
Thanks for the info, I had my CDS1 (now CDS2) on a Target wall shelf on their standard board and the inclusion of the BASE platform transformed the sound, which of course it should I guess, as it probably cost more that the entire Target set up!
I have SBL's and am told that they do "exagerate" sibilance (wait for the backlash!), I have plenty and it's more evident since I had my 250 (circa 1984) recapped recently. I only have a Hi-Cap on the 82 I think a Supercap is supposed to clean up any sibilance?
It's becoming annoying!
Chris
Thanks for the info, I had my CDS1 (now CDS2) on a Target wall shelf on their standard board and the inclusion of the BASE platform transformed the sound, which of course it should I guess, as it probably cost more that the entire Target set up!
I have SBL's and am told that they do "exagerate" sibilance (wait for the backlash!), I have plenty and it's more evident since I had my 250 (circa 1984) recapped recently. I only have a Hi-Cap on the 82 I think a Supercap is supposed to clean up any sibilance?
It's becoming annoying!
Chris
Posted on: 06 August 2003 by Bas V
That sibilance won't be solved with a supercap. I have an 82 with HiCap myself and don't hear any sibilance. So that can't be the problem. Perhaps you have your speakers facing a window or a mirror?
Posted on: 06 August 2003 by ChrisG
Bas
No the speakers fire across the room directly at the listening sofa. I think the problem is elsewhere, maybe cable dressing,mains supply( I do have a separate spur but it runs via an RCCD on the consumer unit and I'm informed that these devices kill the sound),Thanks for the Supercap comment, I'll hold off until I have this sorted.
I'm planning on another consumer unit with only the Hi-Fi on it, unfortunately it will still only have one spur, but when I eventually build an extension I'll do it all properly with mulitiple spurs etc.
Anyone out there experience sibilance problems with 82/Hi/250/CDS2/CDPS/SBL's? Actually it's also on the tuner and LP12!!
Chris
No the speakers fire across the room directly at the listening sofa. I think the problem is elsewhere, maybe cable dressing,mains supply( I do have a separate spur but it runs via an RCCD on the consumer unit and I'm informed that these devices kill the sound),Thanks for the Supercap comment, I'll hold off until I have this sorted.
I'm planning on another consumer unit with only the Hi-Fi on it, unfortunately it will still only have one spur, but when I eventually build an extension I'll do it all properly with mulitiple spurs etc.
Anyone out there experience sibilance problems with 82/Hi/250/CDS2/CDPS/SBL's? Actually it's also on the tuner and LP12!!
Chris
Posted on: 06 August 2003 by dave simpson
Chris,
Try removing the rubber pads on the bottom of the BASE platform feet (they introduce a compliance which impedes the CDS2's suspension from working as designed). I don't know if it will affect the sibilance problem you're experiencing but it may improve other aspects of the sound significantly.
regards,
dave
Try removing the rubber pads on the bottom of the BASE platform feet (they introduce a compliance which impedes the CDS2's suspension from working as designed). I don't know if it will affect the sibilance problem you're experiencing but it may improve other aspects of the sound significantly.
regards,
dave
Posted on: 07 August 2003 by ChrisG
Dave
Thanks for the tip, although aren't they an integral part of the "BASE" design?
I guess this only applies to the CDS2 with the hard feet and not the other Naim runbber fet on the electronics?
Will try it though. The BASE certainly improves the 82 preamp.
Chris
Thanks for the tip, although aren't they an integral part of the "BASE" design?
I guess this only applies to the CDS2 with the hard feet and not the other Naim runbber fet on the electronics?
Will try it though. The BASE certainly improves the 82 preamp.
Chris
Posted on: 07 August 2003 by dave simpson
Hi Chris,
"Thanks for the tip, although aren't they an integral part of the "BASE" design?"
I'm sure they (the rubber pads) are integral with the design, but they allow too much movement (bounce) which interferes with the CDS's suspension. (It no longer does it's job of isolating the components as well and you'll hear the consequences).
"I guess this only applies to the CDS2 with the hard feet and not the other Naim runbber fet on the electronics?"
Personally, I believe it's dependant on the system/support stand and room. For example, a friend at NANA once liked his Naim rig with the rubber pads removed from all (metal or rubber-footed) Naim boxes when used with the complete AF/BASE platform/rack support system. At the time, I was using all AF/BASE supports also and removed the AF rubber pads from the remainder of my BASE shelves supporting my rubber-footed Naim boxes per his suggestion. I didn't like the results one bit. I'm sure our differences were due to completely different rooms, floor-types, systems, etc.
Give it a try under the CDS transport unit's BASE platform only. If you like the results (and after several days of getting used to the new sound), try removing the rest of the BASE pads under the remaining gears' platforms and see what happens. As you've probably discovered, the pads are held on to the feet with the equivelent of double-sided transparent tape or some similar adhesive. They are easily placed back on the BASE feet and will stick even if you try and put them back on a year later!
hth,
dave
P.S. The tip of removing the pads from BASE with a CDS in use came from Paul Stephenson (and Naim R&D)...and before the first Naim forum existed.
[This message was edited by dave simpson on FRIDAY 08 August 2003 at 01:29.]
"Thanks for the tip, although aren't they an integral part of the "BASE" design?"
I'm sure they (the rubber pads) are integral with the design, but they allow too much movement (bounce) which interferes with the CDS's suspension. (It no longer does it's job of isolating the components as well and you'll hear the consequences).
"I guess this only applies to the CDS2 with the hard feet and not the other Naim runbber fet on the electronics?"
Personally, I believe it's dependant on the system/support stand and room. For example, a friend at NANA once liked his Naim rig with the rubber pads removed from all (metal or rubber-footed) Naim boxes when used with the complete AF/BASE platform/rack support system. At the time, I was using all AF/BASE supports also and removed the AF rubber pads from the remainder of my BASE shelves supporting my rubber-footed Naim boxes per his suggestion. I didn't like the results one bit. I'm sure our differences were due to completely different rooms, floor-types, systems, etc.
Give it a try under the CDS transport unit's BASE platform only. If you like the results (and after several days of getting used to the new sound), try removing the rest of the BASE pads under the remaining gears' platforms and see what happens. As you've probably discovered, the pads are held on to the feet with the equivelent of double-sided transparent tape or some similar adhesive. They are easily placed back on the BASE feet and will stick even if you try and put them back on a year later!
hth,
dave
P.S. The tip of removing the pads from BASE with a CDS in use came from Paul Stephenson (and Naim R&D)...and before the first Naim forum existed.
[This message was edited by dave simpson on FRIDAY 08 August 2003 at 01:29.]
Posted on: 08 August 2003 by ChrisG
Dave
Thanks again.
I actually only have one Base platform and that's under the CDS2, so I'll give it a try. I did try the platform under the 82 briefly and that was noticeably improved. I was going to invest in platforms for the other equip, but then started to read the forum, and wondered if anyone had any experience of Base, not having seen it mentioned.
I have an electrician coming around this morning to look at a dedicated consumer unit for the Hi-Fi, it's so difficult to get skilled people to do any work in this area, as everybody's tied up with the building boom in Surrey.
Thanks again, I'll get back to you with the result.
Cheers
Chris
Thanks again.
I actually only have one Base platform and that's under the CDS2, so I'll give it a try. I did try the platform under the 82 briefly and that was noticeably improved. I was going to invest in platforms for the other equip, but then started to read the forum, and wondered if anyone had any experience of Base, not having seen it mentioned.
I have an electrician coming around this morning to look at a dedicated consumer unit for the Hi-Fi, it's so difficult to get skilled people to do any work in this area, as everybody's tied up with the building boom in Surrey.
Thanks again, I'll get back to you with the result.
Cheers
Chris
Posted on: 08 August 2003 by prowla
Elsewhere somebody recommended I try my isolation under my 250. I reckon it made more of a difference than under my 82.
As you say, it may be worth looking at cable dressing & mains. (Though I'm not sure if "killing the sound" and adding sibilance are the same thing?)
Obvious comment: if the sibilance is evident on all sources, then I'd suggest it's not associated with your CD player.
It might be worth trying the remove and reinsert plugs routine too?
Paul Rowlands
As you say, it may be worth looking at cable dressing & mains. (Though I'm not sure if "killing the sound" and adding sibilance are the same thing?)
Obvious comment: if the sibilance is evident on all sources, then I'd suggest it's not associated with your CD player.
It might be worth trying the remove and reinsert plugs routine too?
Paul Rowlands
Posted on: 08 August 2003 by Greg Beatty
I have a BASE platform and have tried/used it under loads of kit.
To my ears, it adds *too much* compliance. The sound gets thicker, but its a bit too much. Removing the pads may help this - I've not tried.
My kit is all on glass now and I can't see going back to wood or MDF anytime soon.
I had a sibilance problem for a while but it is long gone now. I had a ground loop and fixing this helped. The Allaes running in also helped.
- GregB
Insert Witty Signature Line Here
To my ears, it adds *too much* compliance. The sound gets thicker, but its a bit too much. Removing the pads may help this - I've not tried.
My kit is all on glass now and I can't see going back to wood or MDF anytime soon.
I had a sibilance problem for a while but it is long gone now. I had a ground loop and fixing this helped. The Allaes running in also helped.
- GregB
Insert Witty Signature Line Here
Posted on: 08 August 2003 by dave simpson
quote:
Originally posted by ChrisG:
Dave
Thanks again.
Cheers
Chris
You're welcome Chris.
dave
quote:
To my ears, it adds *too much* compliance. The sound gets thicker, but its a bit too much. Removing the pads may help this - I've not tried.
Exactly as I found Greg (though with my rig, it sounded worse). This might be a solution worth pursuing if you still own the BASE platform and want to try it in your system again.
regards,
dave