Brave Florida Cops Handcuffing Naughty 5 Year Old Black Kindergarten Girl

quote:

Although I don't compare these situ's I'll be suprised if the over-reaction by armed British police officers recently (fully on film) who shot dead a sword toting geezer on a highway early one moaning will be totally forgotten after they're pardoned by a Judge for 'Whatever he dicídes to make up at the time as his interpretation of Mick's precious Law'

FRitz,

Are you actually suggesting they were wrong to do this? (after trying less lethal means and this failing???)

quote:

As I said previously it is NOW TODAY YES TODAY Legal in UK for mickey mouse guards and bouncers to cuff people, irrespective of the speedcuff regs used by police, who in reality have to act on insinct and every situ is different, innit.

Could you show me where you found this info? I am aware group 4 can handcuff prosiners, but these persons are legally in custody...

andy c!

Methinks Fritz doth protest too much!

Here in Brighton, bouncers on the door at nightclubs now are permitted to carry and use handcuffs, following the lead taken by nearby Worthing last year.

Andy ! My old bean; to answer your question re the shooting of the 'nutter', Yes, I do think it was an 'Unlawful Killing', though I'd be very suprised if it's percieved as such after the inquiry ? I'm not going into the ins and outs of possible other 'hypothetical' arguments & scenarios, I just feel 'Knowing a few of the younger ones' that British Police gun mentality and culture is very 'childish' & 'seemingly a means to end all', and the Officer who gave the fire order, or free fire etc, will/should be brought to book, it being a dangerous precident for future situations in my view. UK having such a camera-CCTV mentality across the board (someone said recently such evidence is now permissable in court, of which I'm still dubious of, regardless of my 'shoplifting' example above !)
Obviously sometimes the press & camera's don't work in the Police's favour, as in this Florida case, and with this shooting by numerous officers ?, a helicopter conveniently for the public (and later inquiry ?) case hovering above, filming the whole caboodle. Camermen & Journo's can on occassion be a great hindrence to operations (as we see often in Warzones where they mysteriously get shot in non existant crossfire and spontaneous incidents involving nobody else). That I suppose is the balance drawm between so-called free press and operational security, many a British journo has had his/her camera/Mike wrenched from their hands by Police officers in the persuance of their duties, wether it be at a football match, or a Legal demonstration in front of the Palace of Westminster arguing the toss over fox hunting, never mind jobs for miners & car workers.
When I first arrived in Berlin in 1981 I was very suprised to see a chain of shops across the City that sold imitation guns, mega looking knives, and other gang-favourites K-D's etc, quite openly, aslo CS Gas guns and sprays, etc, all totally illegal in UK at the time, I hear these types of shops now litter UK Urbania too ? German Police having always been armed, I would say on average (normal cop) probably have to draw their weapon no more than half a dozen times (at most) during their whole career, I distinctly have the feeling & impression that the NEW UK Police, want to draw their's at every given opportunoty, and the 'Media' once again, continually emphasise the 'Armed Police' aspect, as if the SAS are turning up every bloody five minutes, and we'll all be allright then, if you get my drift ?


Fritz Von I can guess your answer already being along the lines of it being a dangerous world out there and all that, though I'll just finish up with although the Police here like other €uropean countries are armed I bet firearm incidents involving police in UK are comparable today, if not more so, and will increasingly be the case due to this bloody silly gung-ho mentality that's being allowed to drift into certain area's of the forces, and that's my two ha'penny's worth innit John.

N.B. Above thread might solve the new cuffs rules ?

Fritz,
several things spring to mind re your comments - the first being that you are sceptical over the so called rules of engagement in these situations. You also spare no thought for how the officer who pulled the triger will actually now feel, nor what kind of backing he actually got from the orgainsation he/she works for.

Whilst I accept the 'actual' circumstances will come out in a trial etc, if you were involved in a pursuit, which came to an end, and a man was coming at you with a samuri sword, what would you do, and how close would you let him get before making a decision.

Indeed, would you have the faith in yourself to have to make such a decision?

The police are under such scrutiny these days, and rightly so. Great faith is placed in them to carry out their role. If they are found wanting, then that should be taken to task. However, I personally cannot help but feel you have made assumptions on this case that are biased, and not balanced.

I respect your right to vioce your opinion. On this occasion I don't agree with your comments.

andy c!

You are wrong with your assumptions, and their feelings will/must be dealt with professionally afterwards as has always been the case, if they fail to 'recover' they should never carry arms again, it's as simple as that mate.

Fritz Von Love is blind

As an infamous Fritz afterthought to curbe any further wonderings, if I myself were in a situation (alone) confronted (in a closed space not a highway layby)) with a nutter brandishing a sword/kitchen knife, or one of Our Mick's antique nib pens in his hand, I would (hopefully ?) first warn him to drop it, then fire above his head when ignored, and I still felt in danger (go against all of my training) and take his legs out, instead of killing him/her in one. That is obviously a dream scenario that happens in the movies (and I would still be reprimanded internally) (happens here often by thwe way).
If I was lucky enough to swiftly attain the support of a quick reaction fireams unit which in this case seemingly was the order of the day, as the C.O. and taking the resulting multi-firing (which I believe was the case ?) I'd be pretty damned pissed off to put it mildly, and class it as a great failure on my part.


Fritz Von We'll just have to wait and see, there will be recommendations, and it will hopefully not happen
again ?

P.S. The Police are Public Servants and not the other way around, please don't kid yourselves otherwise, you have not earned a free luch anymore than the rest of professional society, and stupid comments by the likes of Howard (Yobs must fear the police) are in my opinion totally unproductive and will make the already tough job, even tougher, as well as building even more public apathy and derision towards the Law (The uniformed police being the first visible public representatives of it naturally)

Fritz,
Have you ever fired a sidearm? Have you fired it from 25metres. If so you'd be a bloody good shot to hit a person 'not to kill' so to speak, simply because you don't know in that spilt second what the person is going to do. Anyone that thinks otherwise has been watching too many Clint Eastwood films. If you can shoot that effectively, Fritz, you are wasted on this forum!

You are looking at the sword issue too narrow, and are not in full posession of the facts (IMO).

andy c!

I always hold it with three hands, and if I'd €5 for every time I'd heard that comment, I'd be a very rich man indeed, innit mate.

Cheers, Fritz Von 38 Specials & a packet of crisps please That's it:

I sometimes tend to think some folk regard guns as toys; and not as the deadly tools they obviously are !!! i.e. they are 'simply' not respected but 'idolised' instead, I don't refer to your own good self of course Mister

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I sometimes tend to think some folk regard guns as toys; and not as the deadly tools they obviously are !!! i.e. they are 'simply' not respected but 'idolised' instead, I don't refer to your own good self of course Mister

Fritz,
I agree that guns are treated far too lightly. I dont think they are treated so by the vast majority of officers that have to carry them.

Again, trust me in that I know that to officers that I know who are so trained don't treat this lightly, either

andy c!