The CDS2

Have fun this week-end!

-=> Mike Hanson <=-

You might think you like it but you know you really need Mana!?!?!

You are absolutely right about the cdsii, I think it makes cd sound better than it has any right to.

My treat for the weekend will be a new cartridge. I've opted for a new Dynavector 20x-l to replace my Denon 304.

I had the opportunity to listen to the cdsii at the demo and good as the cdsii was there was no real contest (lp12/geddon/aro).......if you can ignore inherent surface noise which I appreciate some can't.

Since I bought my xps I have been buying cd almost exclusively - and whilst selling my cdx to get a cdsii remains an option, if the new tt set-up sings in the way I expect it to.........

Have fun

Chris

It's always a nice day for it, have a good one
Steve

The CDS2 has now had 44 hours to warm up and is begining to move forward. Its resemblance to vinyl is uncanny and I can see myself spending more time listening to music. This is not good because Mrs Mick wants me to take up membership in the local gym. I do not have the time for both.

I thought the CDX/XPS was good but this is so much better. You must all get yourselves one, it is that good.

I will let you know in a couple of days how it is progressing......if you find this boring please let me know.

Regards

Mick

Nice one (made me laugh) but I am not rising to it. I am in a nice mood today.

Regards

Mick

when i installed my cdsii, i was advised by my dealer to leave a cd playing continuously to help with the run in process. apparently, according to paul darwin, this runs in the transport. i played mine continuously for 4 days and there positive results were obvious -- unfortunately, by system started playing up soon afterwards.

now with my dealer's 52 and snaxo's hicap, the cdsii is really stamping its authority on proceedings, and a couple of days ago, it went another notch up.

however, what i cannot say is that my cdsii sounds analogue-like. mine doesn't sound like my lp12. but i am very happy with either source. for sheer convenience, i play cd's more often, but everynow and then when i have time for my lp12, i experience nothing less than spiritual musicality...

enjoy

ken

enjoy

You will find that this machine just keeps getting better. When I was making move into the world of CD I tried all manner of machines from Marantz's splendid SA-CD player, the wonderful Wadia 860x and the champion Linn CD12. I decided at the time, that, the CDS-II was the best value for money although the CD12 was the winner. My CDS-II is also ex-dem so run in. I plugged my machine into my 52 with anticipation and was not disappointed. The real surprise was a week later when the machine was really going and the best in CD really is good. The reason for this is Naim's use of tradional analogue electronics to achieve the same function as the usual op-amp circuitry. There's a whole load of capacitors in there which I imagine take a week to get to true optimisation. In fact I noticed another marked change after two weeks. This was confirmed when I recently moved and had to unplug and connect up in the new house. Same effect. Disappointing at first and then keeps getting better. And the CD12? I'd like to try it against my CDS-II now it's been connected for a couple of months! Enjoy and bank on playing CD's as much as you play vinyl.

Nigel

quote:

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I really don't get this 'It took 3 weeks to be listenable' stuff. I was delighted with what the CDS was doing from stone-cold, brand-new, out of the box.

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Now, I have a very different take on this.

I heard this particular CDS about two weeks after Juan got it, and I preferred his previous CDX/XPS combo very considerably.

When I first heard it I was shocked that it had much less dynamic ability than the X/X and the bass didn't seem to have any grip at all. It was much better after a month or so.

I now sounds very good, although I still wonder if the X/X would be more of a party animal.

cheers, Martin

P.S. Juan - we must get together again some time soon, and you can teach me the error of my ways.

I have just finished playing a Ricki Lee Jones album and I was surprised just how natural this CD player sounds. Everything is so clear and natural and so bloody addictive. I haven't done a damm thing today other than listen to music.

This has been my best upgrade ever and I know that its going to get better over the next couple of weeks.

I wonder what it would sound like if I replaced the 82 with a 52. Does the 82 constrict the CDS2.

I will come back in say 4 days and let you know how it sounds but I have to repeat myself, try and get yourself one of these machines, they really are good.

Going back now to play the Committments.

Regards

Mick

I recently got my CDS2 (ex-dem so well run in).

As you know, I have an 82/Super - yes it restricts the CDS2 a lot.

We both need 52s (I fear mine is some way off)

But its right to get the source first.

A CDS2/52 is mind blowing, but I also listened to CDX/XPS/52 and it was rather unpleasant; CDX/XPS/82/Super is a better match since the CDX's deficiencies, such as they are (a slightly harsh top end and an aggressive streak), are better masked.

The bottom end, which suddenly springs to life with a CDS2, positively explodes into action with a 52 - and everything else is better too.

With deference to ken c:

enjoy.

Alex

I suspected that I need a 52 but I only have a 250 power amp.

Would the 250 restrict the CDS2/52 combination.

Should I also get, say, two 135's.

I have never heard a 52 or 135's so I don't know what they are capable of.

I have just played Sarah Brightman and she sounded great. The CDS2 must be regarded as a compulsory purchase for serious Hifi. I know it sounds extreme but its just so good.

Regards

Mick

It's good to see you enjoying your new purchase, I have however a few questions regarding the longevity of the CDS 2 as I feel a little apprehensive at this present time investing in this player.

I don't doubt for one minute the player's ability as I have heard one many times, I am however aware of the current exploration on the DVD front.

Having just attended the BBQ, I would have assumed that you would have checked out the current situation regarding the CDS 2 and any subsequent future replacement/modifications.

Buying a player at this level represnts a large investment and I would be happier knowing that there was at least 3 to 4 years before any future moves to incorporate new formats into a purely music based system were annouced.

I would be grateful if you could pass on any information gained from said gathering.

Regards,

Ian

I can see where you are coming from, but I could not give a damm if the CDS2 was superceded by something else tomorrow morning.

I have just finished a CD by Jacque Loussier and it sounded stunning. That particular CD cost me £3.00 in a second hand shop. Thats the basis of my point, there are enough CD's in the world to keep me going for years to come.

Also if Naim came up with some super black box for lets say DVD-A, thats easily sorted, buy one and play it alongside the CD, the tuner and the TT.

Also we must be realistic, no sensible (and Naim are very sensible) manufacturer will ever hint at a new model until its ready for release.

I am happy with the CDS2 and I am not worried about whats around the corner.

Regards

Mick

i bought the cdsii more than a month ago. the question of the changing formats, etc did enter my mind, but i figured no matter what happens on this front, i have a large enought(and growing) number of ordinary cd's that i will enjoy playing on my cdsii for a long time to come. i believe one doesnt need necessarily to jump onto this new format bandwagon, especially given that s/w may be limited to start with.

enjoy

ken

Buy your CDS2 with confidence and do not worry about the CD format being superceded by something else.

Casette tapes are being phased out in this country but they are still being produced for the poorer countries in the far east. In this day of the internet , you can still buy tapes from anywhere in the world.

The same will apply to CD's.

Regards

Mick

I was at a London dealer last week, worried that my CDI wasn't up to it anymore (despite sounding fab - you know how it is, reading all this CDS2 stuff etc). Anyway, I listened to the naked CDX and a CDS2 (both well warmed up). There was no doubt that the CDS was better but, in absolute terms, the difference was relatively subtle. I felt the uplift essentially musically irrelevant especially given the difference in wedge (many, many ££££s) and the CDs this could buy.

If money were no object then OK, but I for one don't feel I'm missing out on too much? For those mortals who haven't had this dem done, do try soon. It'll give you a sense of perspective, one way or the other. I'm not knocking anyone who's fortunate enough to have this level of kit, just trying to make those of us who haven't feel a little less bad about it...

Regards, Steve

the cdsii, to me, is another league, but until you live with one for a while, i dont think this matters. you cant miss what you dont know. better still, in your case, you didnt find the cdi->cdsii upgrade worth the extra dosh.

i definitely didnt need to upgrade. in fact, ever since my first naim system, i never needed to upgrade. i simply wanted to. and i have never regretted it.

you are right to recommend that people dem the cdsii --i dont know whether naim are going to be able to make enough to meet the demand that you have just triggered by that advice!!

enjoy

ken

I ran a naked CDX for six months

I then added a XPS.....result big improvement

Six months later, replaced CDX with CDS2...result even bigger improvement. I am not the sort of person who chucks money around, I am bloody tight, but take my word for it, the CDS2 is superb and well worth the lolly.

I respectfully suggest that hearing at a dealer and in your home are two different kettles of fish.

Regards

Mick

Would not a new format player incorporate the ability to play cd's as well?

This is the basis for my apprehension to invest so heavily in a player that may or may not have a limited life.

I can also appreciate it being hard to press any manufacturer for future model information.

I will just have to procrastinate a little longer.

Regards,

Ian

quote:

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although I must admit to not agreeing with either of your predictions for the longevity of a stand alone CD player.

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i dont believe i made any such prediction, did i?
what i meant is that regardless of whether new players incorporating new this and that appear, i have enough software on ordinary cd's to enjoy my cdsii for a long time. the only thing that would worry me is if naim discontinued the cdsii and there were question marks on future parts availability and service. yes, that would worry me. but i am not bothered if naim produce a DVD player -- i will not feel i have made a mistake with my cdsii.

enjoy

ken

Any future new player regardless of format compatibility would have to be expected to be superior to it's predecessor.

Given the age of the cds2 and subsequent moves towards dvd, I thought it would have been at the top of the list to try to ascertain this product's lifespan from somebody who had recently purchased one. This was my initial query to Mick.
His response however did not answer my anxiety,but I am grateful to both of you for replying, if not with the answers I was looking for.

I think it almost certain to assume that the introduction of a dvd player would spell the end for the cds?

Regards

Ian

quote:

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I think it almost certain to assume that the introduction of a dvd player would spell the end for the cds?

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you may be right. doesnt bother me though. provided my cdsii can still be serviced.

so, are you waiting for a naim dvd player?

if so, arent you worried that as soon as its out, the big companies will start talking about yet another format just to keep consumers buying new machines?

enjoy

ken

Every now and then the same question comes up. I remember asking a similar question about the CDX to Julian Vereker on the old Naim Forum. It must have been at least two years ago. He suggested to me to buy the CDX and enjoy the music until a new format is established. He was right, the introduction of new players has been much slower than I expected and the quality of the new formats, especially with traditional CD replay, is not that convincing. In the meantime I have become quite sceptical if DVD-A or SACD will be the new standard and frankly I don't care. I'm very happy with my CDS I and I don't feel the need to change anything about it. So I think it still makes sense, if you have a lot of CDs and you can afford it, to buy a CDS II.

Ciao!

Willem

If you can afford it, I would go for the 52 first. I think you will find that the improvement from 82/sc to 52/sc is about the same as the upgrade to CDSII, although different in what it does.

I'm currently using a 250. I've had 2 home demos of 135s, and although the upgrade is significant - particularly in tightening up the treble/mid and revealing layers of bass the 250 doesn't reveal, the 52 is the priority. 135s are a very worthwhile upgrade, but I'm still holding out hope that a power amp with a bit more muscle, and more affordable than a NAP500 will come on to the market which will work well with Naim.

I agree that hearing at a dealer and having the equipment set up are very different. I had 3 shop demos and 2 home demos before I was convinced that the CDSII was worth the cost. In the end when you've made the purchase, I think you relax, get out of A/B demo mode and more into appreciating the music, and it's then you realise how good the CDSII is.

Enjoy the CDSII and then get the 52.

David

quote:

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I suspected that I need a 52 but I only have a 250 power amp.
Would the 250 restrict the CDS2/52 combination.
Should I also get, say, two 135's.
I have never heard a 52 or 135's so I don't know what they are capable of.

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Point 1 is: never listen to Naim equipment unless you're willing either a) to spend a lot of money or b) to be rather disappointed.

Leaving aside speakers and dealing only with electronics I would advise the following:

1. Since you have invested in a Supercap it would be madness not to put it to full use at some stage on a 52. The addition of a 52 into a system is the biggest upgrade I've heard (I've not heard the Nap500), but it must be done with CDS2 as the source, anything less is exposed.

2. A 250 is an easily good enough power amp for a CDS2/52 so long as your speakers are not too difficult to drive. Nonethless, 135s are a significant improvement on a single 250 (and also on 2 250s which I presently use).

3. Leaving the NAP500 and future pre-amp developments aside, a sensible end of road would be CDS2/52/135s.

4. To recap: follow the usual hierarchy: Source/Pre/Power. Don't listen to a 52 unless you think you can buy one soon enough. A CDS2/82/Super/250 is a satisfying system which you can live with happily for a long time but the 52 tips it firmly into Mike's "Magic Zone".