Trusting your own ears
Posted by: Alex S. on 27 August 2001
I find it almost impossible to judge anything in a dealer's listening room. My own exact (premodified) system sounds horrendous at Grahams. You must judge the suitability of equipment in your own listening environment. And you must do it with run-in, vaguely warmed up, equipment over a number of days if possible, not hours.
You must also decide what you want from a system. I won't repeat everything here but we all know that any given manufacturers' equipment does not excel in every single area of music reproduction and Naimophiles generally have decided to prioritise those time-honoured virtues of PR&T. The earth is generally flatter here than it is round.
I know these are my priorities (with a few trifling asides), but I'm also a creature of habit. It took me until late 1995 before I could bring myself to buy a CD player, and even then I felt forced into it. I prefer analogue sound, its what I'm used to, its what my ears, brain and body have become attuned to. (Unfortunately, a lack of new vinyl led me to neglect my LP12. Now I'm buying loads second hand for next to nothing. And there is quality new vinyl out there too).
In my own terms I have made very few purchase mistakes but I have made moves for one reason or another which were unneccessary. And there are common factors to these "errors":
1. I didn't have a clear and steadfast idea of exactly what I was trying to achieve but just thought I wanted to upgrade.
2. I didn't trust my own ears.
2. I had neither the wit nor the confidence to refuse to bow to dealer pressure.
When my dealer said "Wow, doesn't that 82 just blow the 32.5 away". I thought "no, not really", but I bought the 82. When my dealer said "doesn't that CDX sound just magnificent" I thought "kind-of". What I should have thought on both occasions was "well yes and no; they both do things very well which are not that important to me. I'm here to follow the tune and to get my feet tapping with a big smile on my face. They help but they do not transform my pleasure. And they're both expensive".
With hindsight (and one bit of foresight) I would say that certain changes have dramatically increased my listening pleasure. These are, in no particular order: Buying 32.5/Hi-Cap/250. Buying Troika. Treating room with acoustic foam. Buying a power supply for the CDX. Buying a Supercap. Buying a CDS2. Putting the speakers on granite stands. And the foresight bit - buying a 52.
Here are the things which, in my own terms, have moved me sideways, a small step forward or a small step back: Getting rid of the Troika. Buying CDX. Buying 82. Buying AE1s. Getting rid of Kans.
The moral of this story is, bow not to dealer or forum pressure; trust your own ears - never trust hearsay, but most of all, be clear about why you're buying this stuff in the first place and measure "upgrades", "downgrades" and "sidegrades" against your own important set of parameters and not somebody else's.
[This message was edited by Alex S on MONDAY 27 August 2001 at 15:58.]
For interest, the Rotel 965BX is better than a £300 CD player should be. To my ears, of course. 
A friend of mine has an Arcam CDP and it sounds very dull and lifeless.
Brian
Slightly different to my situation Patrick.
You say that although these things didn't do it in 5 seconds you could still hear a difference. In my case, I couldn't hear any difference at all.
Also, if I understand you correctly, you're saying that, even though you didn't think these items 'did it', you bought them on the say-so of your dealer and on the reputation of the manufacturer in the hope that they would in fact 'do it'. In that case, are you saying that with the Ittok and CDX it became clear only after a couple of weeks what they were doing and then you were happy? 
An interesting aside is that, re-using the examples you gave, I knew immediately that the Ittok was better than the Akito (which is better than the Basik IMO), and, using the CD3.5 as a benchmark against the CD5, I knew instantly I was listening to a superior machine in the CDX. The improvements from both of these upgrades for me were so large for it to be almost beyond belief that someone couldn't hear this straight away. But there you are. You didn't think so. Same as others must think I'm deaf for not being able to appreciate a HICAP.
I've posted at length about what I think of dealers. I've come across some great dealers, I love the sound from Naim systems and I think they're an excellent manufacturer. But, I won't buy anything just because a dealer tells me it's better or because Naim tell me it's better. If I can't hear any improvement (not just difference), I won't buy it. That's what 'trusting my ears' means to me. If I can't appreciate what others can then so be it. As Mike says, perhaps I have cheap(ish) ears.
Brian
quote:
Assuming a person is using 'x' system and it finds the pitch, tempo and timing "right" what exactly is this person trying to get when upgrading? How can the pitch, tempo and timing be any better than right? BD
It is all down to the relationship between the level of detail and the level of musicality, and the delicate balance between them.
A modest system can sound "right," but will still sound better following an upgrade, provided that the enhancement of detail is not achieved at the expense of musicality, i.e: PR&T.
I have heard wires (for example) that improve detail, but present it in a fashion that makes it irrelevant to musical enjoyment, and PR&T is lost.
My new QS Ref table has added detail, but has integrated it well, so that PR&T is enhanced.
It's always a nice day for it, have a good one
Steve
quote:
but for me the only way to be sure is to try something for an extended audition and it has to be at home.
Agreed. The paradox is that something can be a absolute no-brainer and take quite a bit of time to sink in - Once you fully 'get it' it is then a no-brainer
Tony.
quote:
Originally posted by Tony Lonorgan:
Agreed. The paradox is that something can be a absolute no-brainer _and_ take quite a bit of time to sink in - Once you fully 'get it' it is then a no-brainerTony.
Tony,
before (*edit here*) I first took the CDS-II for home demo I was actually not at all convinced that I would be buying it.
When my friend 'Juan' had previously (*edit here*) upgraded from CDX/XPS to CDS-II I was disappointed that it didn't seem to have the immediate impressiveness, even after a couple of weeks of burn-in. It took a month before things started to tighten up and I didn't think he'd made a mistake. Since then he's completely changed the way the system sounds, and the CDS-II really shows it's worth.
In my own system, the CDS-II initially didn't impress. I suffer from severe room problems and I'd balanced a 52/active system to get the best I could from a bare CDX. It took me quite some time to get past a less "impressive" tonal balance, and hear just how much more of everything was coming through.
Now that I have adjusted, friends' mid-range systems, which before sounded superb, are now good but seem superficial.
Unfortunately, I struggle really to articulate what this difference is, as I can't think of any words that could have been used to make me understand before I'd heard it for myself.
As I hinted above, some systems are setup to get the most from a certain component (or combination of) and this may carry you through some upgrades, but eventually you really need almost a complete re-think of the whole installation.
Hmm, lunch-break over - must get back to work!
cheers, Martin
* Edited to clarify 1st & 2nd paras.
[This message was edited by Martin Payne on WEDNESDAY 29 August 2001 at 18:18.]
quote:
(the second one was greed)
Send it to me then. Let's face it, greed is bad for the soul.
Brian
quote:
Poor Mike Hanson, we should all be feeling sorry for him really!
That's funny!
Let me reiterate something: Every configuration since CDX/102/NAPSC/Hi/140/Albion has given me loads of pleasure, with the occasional twinge of wondering whether it could be even better. The upgrades were not done out of insecurity, but because I wanted to do it, and I had the cash to spare. Each upgrade has given more pleasure than the last.
Some think that I've done this very quickly, but it took 3 years to get from a Panasonic midi system to CDX/82/Super/250/Albion. That isn't exactly fast. I'll admit that the last batch of upgrades (the CDS2, 52 and 135s) were pretty rapid, but I knew what I wanted and didn't see any benefit to delaying my increased pleasure.
I'm focused on what I want, and I'm not afraid to run for that goal. I feel sorry for those who can't do the same, for whatever reason.
-=> Mike Hanson <=-