Coffee Makers

Here's a few from my shortcuts: -

Essential reading - http://www.lucidcafe.com/cafeforum/schomer1.html

Other goodies -
http://www.coffeekid.com/

Rancilio source -
http://www.coffeemachinecompany.co.uk/

Superb coffee -
http://www.hillandvalleycoffee.co.uk/

Go to see the girl with the foreign accent who works at Whittards in Woking is you can - a real rarity to receive absolutely perfect salesmanship. I traipsed round a few department stores but they don't know their arses from their elbows. I bought a Gaggia Classic which is great. 15 bar pressure is, I believe, the main criteria.

We paid £270, the girl thought milk thermometers a waste of time but a stainless milk jug worthwhile and we get 250g (I think) beans a month free coffee for a year.

[This message was edited by bornwina on THURSDAY 12 December 2002 at 00:21.]

I second the Hill and Valley as being perhaps the finest coffee available in the UK.

If you are in (or travel to) the US, I cannot recommend Peets (www.Peets.com) highly enough. IMHO, their aged Sumatras and blends (Major Dickasons, for instance) set the standard.

Enjoy,

Steven

Chaps

Mrs Mick has decided on the Gaggia Classic.

Before we buy.......what is it like to clean / maintain etc and are there any downsides to it.

Best price so far £249.00 inc del.

Regards

Mick

Mick;

Recently I went to see a new client to sort his computer out. He is a US ex-pat living in a complete and undivided, totally original Georgian house in that famously matching city not far from you. When I asked him what he did for a living, he replied quite seriously: "I divide my time more or less equally between philosophy and the search for a perfect espresso".

Come coffee time, he presented me with the most georgeous, complex and frankly flawless (to me!) espresso I've ever had. It lifted my spirits. I asked him his method. An hour later, he paused for breath. The edited highlights are:

1. Short of a professional machine, the Gaggia Classic is about as good as it gets in the sense that to beat it, you have to spend at least 3 times as much, although you will also get more capacity.

2. It makes compromises. It will do two cups at once, but they are not as good as one at a time.

3. It uses sufficient pressure, and is properly made. It therefore probably won't burst in a hurry.

4. The best raw material is Illy Espresso Ground. This is packed in nitrogen, and to duplicate their grind at home would require a grinder in the 700+ UKP price range, even supposing you could get exactly the right blend of beans. It is therefore excellent value.

5. Using still mineral water makes a big improvement. A Britta jug is very close. Not using tap water also reduces scaling to virtually zero.

6. Tamping of the coffee before brewing is crucial to get right. This is apparently something which has to be learnt.

7. Cups should be stored on top of the machine, which is designed for this. They are then always warm.

8. Anything used to make coffee should be kept as clean as you can get it. Grounds go down the sink easily, which makes everything easier. The machine itself has very little plastic, so no static, so less mess.

Basically, it seems that you've made a sound choice.

Best;

Mark

Mark

Thanks for that response......it was a great comfort factor.

Regards

Mick

...I'll even give the Illy a go. I have been a Lavazza fan for a long time.

Also the Gaggia sounds (and looks) gorgeous.

Is it then the next upgrade or a gaggia - to me it's a rounded view that the enjoyment of the coffee adds a little something to the listening experience.


Mark
(Would a dedicated mains spur add to the taste?)

Mick ,

A good grinder is essential to making excellent espresso.

1. Mazzer grinders are the best & set the standard. Go for the Mini.
2. Rancillio Rocky would be next in line.
3. Solis Maestro would probably be next.

I have a Mazzer super jolly and no complaints. It's the 552 of grinders.

I have a Mazzer Mini and could not be happier. Once you find your perfect grind, one suited with the way you like to tamp, you can 'pull' pure delicious caramel honey.......
I use this in conjuntion with a Pasquini Livia 90 semi-automatic (sounds like a gun!)
I actually look forward to getting up in the morning.

Are these grinders as important for filter coffee as for expresso? I prefer filtered light roast kenyan for the aroma.

alan

quote:

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Mazzer grinders are the best & set the standard. Go for the Mini

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at £350 they'd want to be good. Any idea how the Gaggia MDF stacks up against your list?

We have one of these and it has been great - if I can't be arsed to grind then I use Illy espresso pre-ground (in the red tin) which seems fine enough to give a good crema. I've always used an old Braun electric grinder - maybe I'm embarrasing myself into an upgrade here!

A question though: Of late the machine doesn't seem to produce a brew of as high a temp as normal and the water flow appears slow. Any ideas - maybe a descale?

I have a Gaggia classic which was my birthday present from my other half, two years ago.



For the last year or so we have only been able to use Illy ground coffee. It is twice the price of most coffee, Lavazza etc, so if you are going to moan about the price, dont try it.

It is impossible to go back in my opinion, coffee that previously tasted good tastes likes cats &*@~ after getting used to Illy.

You also need a set of Illy collection cups, as these do not only look cool, but were scientificly designed for the perfect esspresso.

http://www.illy.com/Illy_En/Art/illy+collection/The+history+of+the+cup.htm

Mrs Mick has chosen well (choice of coffee machine that is)

Simon

Where can we buy this Illy coffee in the UK please?

malcolm

quote:

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Where can we buy this Illy coffee in the UK please?

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your local supermarket will have it.

I am sure most other places sell it, (Waitrose, Sainsbury maybe)

Simon

It looks like this

for a great thread.

We have now got the Morphy Richards machine. Like Jonathan Gorse we looked at all the machines & decided that this one was just the job, at such an incredibly cheap price.

We now use the Illy coffee. This is rich & manages the almost impossible trick of being both smooth yet giving a good kick. We were keen to invest in a grinder but the results are now so good that we will stick with the pre ground beans.

One small query. We use a straight-sided stainless jug to prepare the frothed milk for cappuccino. To get the milk to a perfect creamy but not frothy consistency it is just a little cooler than we would like & means that the coffee should be drunk immediately. Would it be OK to partly pre-warm the milk before frothing?

I have tried this but don’t get quite the same creamy texture to the milk.

We got this kit to save us money at our favourite coffee house in Bristol, Coffee #1 in Clifton village. We are beside ourselves that in our humble opinions we now make an even better coffee at home!

Bob

Unless you can purchase pre ground expresso coffee in 50gm sealed bags or you consume 250gms (the standard package size) within a few days (alt.coffee chat is about 5 days or less) then you run the risk of getting stale expresso coffee with possible flavour and crema loss. I experience this when storing open bags of coffee in the freezer. (another alt.coffee reccomendation)
Plus the cold grounds cool the filter group and the water in the shot pulling process.

I am currently trying out some small plastic boxes to hold two or three days supply of grounds to see if the coffee stays fresher and does not get flavour contaminated.

Using a grinder does overcome this as roasted whole coffee beans last at least a week in the open before they can get stale.

Dualit do a burr grinder (also sold under the *$ label in *$s)for about £50 - £60.


Derek


And for the curious *$ is Starbucks

I bought some Illy today in place of my usual Lavazza - I'm not convinced yet.

However, I also bought the de-caf pre-ground as I have a self-imposed afternoon ban on espresso. It just slays me at night.

Anyway, it's no use pretending that it's the same as the full-leaded but for a substitute it ain't half bad! Good crema and smooth, strong delivery of flavour.

A good analogy would be NAD to Naim. Not A1; but very good and a most acceptable substitute.

quote:

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One small query. We use a straight-sided stainless jug to prepare the frothed milk for cappuccino. To get the milk to a perfect creamy but not frothy consistency it is just a little cooler than we would like & means that the coffee should be drunk immediately. Would it be OK to partly pre-warm the milk before frothing?

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Unlike a previous comment I feel a milk thermometer is essential.

Start steaming the milk with the steam pipe at the bottom of the milk, move it around at this level until the milk reaches maybe 110 deg F, it will warm but not generate much froth. Then move the wand higher in the milk to generate the froth, taking the milk to a final temperature of 140 deg F (no further I suggest).

From your description it sounds as if your making small latte's rather than frothy cappuccino.

Andy.

Bob,
I agree with Andy except for max temperature. Use a 30 degree differential between steaming and frothing. I steam up to 130 degrees and froth to 160 degrees. Milk starts to scald at 180 degrees, so keep it below that. My coffee brews at about 190 degrees so when mixed with milk I have a drink at about 170 degrees; exactly how I like it!

BTW, check your thermometer's accuracy regularly. Put it in a cup of ice water and it should read 32 degrees. Most thermometers have a nut under the dial which adjusts this. I have often found novices are unaware of this adjustment.

Ron The Mon,
Life Is Short;
Stay Awake For It!

quote:

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I have often found novices are unaware of this adjustment.

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Even I was unaware - will go and check it out, Thanks.

Andy.

Andy (and all),
I've been following this thread and have to say that timers and thermometers are extremely important to a good cup of coffee. I've found most home-brewers of espresso also don't time their shots. I brew 22-25 second shots. If you don't use a timer, you will never have consistency. Same with a thermometer. Often, the coffee beans or machine get blamed when it is actually brewer error.

The trouble with most drip-brew and espresso machines is the water doesn't get hot enough. Whether it's espresso, drip-brew, or french-press, the water should be between 180-200 degrees as it hits the grounds. Many people are surprised when their coffee-maker doesn't even aproach this. Many times I've heard claims that french-press makes the best cup of coffee when it is in fact the hotter water of that brewing style that is creating the result.

A trick I've learned is not to get a new coffee maker but to maximise the efficiency of the one you have. All coffee machines say not to use "hot" water but what they technically mean is not to use water from the hot-water tap. The water that passes through your hot water tank is nasty and possibly poisoness. However, if you brew coffee in the morning, simply put the water in the reservoir the night before and by morning it will have risen in temp by about 30 degrees!! Then in the morning, run half the water into the pot and pour it back in the reservoir. This increases the coffee-makers final brewing temperature by about another 15 degrees. Try it, and measure it, the taste will convince you.

The difference between commercial coffee machines (espresso and drip-brew) and home machines is the fact that most home machines don't have a water reservoir which is constantly on and has water always available at about 190 degrees. Next time you're at Starbux (or wherever) notice there is a light that comes on, or a meter, when the coffee machine is ready, which identifies the proper brewing temperature.

Ron The Mon,
Coffee-Freak

Chaps

Just a quick note to advise that we have got the Gaggia classic up and running and its making great coffee.

We really need to buy some smaller drinking cups and a small jug for the milk.

Final question.....what gives the best result, low fat or full cream milk. We tend to use semi skimmed.

Thanks for the advice.

We have had six cups already.

Regards

Mick

Mick,
The less fat, the more froth.

Skim milk=foamy.


Ron The Mon,
Coffee-Freak