help with classical ?

Rich2513,

Here are two excellent performers on the piano which I highly recommend:



http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classi...rt-Nr-2/hnum/7287281



http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classi...es-Aufn/hnum/9431629

The Ravel contains two discs.

Regards,

Haim

Why not try something different, have some sense of adventure :-)

I recommend giving some Beethoven Symphonies a try (I recommend 3 and 7), and the Bach Brandenburg Concertos.

Many good examples to choose from.

Bach - Brandenburg Concertos / Il Giardino armonico

Beethoven - Gardiner/ORR

For the Brandenburg Concertos try this free 16/44 download from Czech Radio:

http://www.rozhlas.cz/d-dur/download_eng

http://www.bbc.co.uk/proms/2010/

The BBC proms is broadcast, and webcast, as well as TV broadcasts on BBC2 and BBC4 throughout every summer. Some is obscure, some quite modern, but there are old favourites in the programme too.

The above link may will have more information. I am presuming that the link is useful and that you are able to receive webcasts from the BBC where you are, or even the TV in the UK.

Another place I have found useful for music as well as film, is to look at credits on imdb.com (internet movie database), quite surprising how many credits Beethoven has on there despite having died many years before the medium was created.

I found starting with classical from a rock background can be a bit daunting, but is well worth it. This forum is of course a fantastic resource too, as those who know the pieces you like can guide you to other works.

Somebody's off to a good start :-)

I'd recommend starting by buying a book which lists recommended recordings.

Examples include:

• The Penguin Guide to Recorded Classical Music
  
• Gramophone Classical Music Guide
  
• The Rough Guide to Classical Music
  
• 1001 Classical Recordings You Must Hear Before You Die
  

The final two offer discussion about the music itself, rather than just reviews of the recorded performance.

The performance of a classical work can profoundly effect your perception, and ultimately your enjoyment of it. While most will disagree with some of the recommendations in books like those above and be astounded at a few absences, on the whole, their recommendations are pretty good--certainly they'll help you avoid the dross (and there's plenty), and steer you towards some of the very best recordings of any particular piece.

For DSCH



For Rachmaninov


For Ravel - Martha Argerich

An easy method to get a grasp on what you're hearing when you listen to classical music, is to let yourself feel tension and release in the music.

This musical tension is created by a quality called dissonance. It endows music with forward momentum, makes it sound like it's going somewhere.

Rhythm comes later than this.

This should be the first thing.

Well, that's one view :-)

thanks for the suggestions guys, i will follow them all up

and yes, i will explore as much as time will permit

but initally I want to try and get some CD's without making the mistake of buying bad quality ones !

are there any labels or series to avoid in terms of the quality of teh recordings ?

one of my all time favourites is here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Debde_E8m-8


I find the problem with classical is how one gets more music exactly 'like that', shoudl i look for more works by Elgar from the same time period ?

Since you have already developed an affection for Elgar, you should get some more, at least until you're full :-)

Pick by artist, not by label.

All labels have both good and bad recordings, both soundwise and performance. I'd start by buying a recommended disc in each of the major catagories of classical music. For instance:

BAROQUE--Bach Brandenberg concertos, and perhaps the partitas, probably on piano as a starter;
CLASSICAL-Mozart-maybe a piano concerto (No.21 would be good); a couple of symphonies (No.40-41), and his clarinet concerto and /or the magnificant sinfonia concertante K.364.
Beethoven-Symphonies 3, 5 and 6, Archduke piano trio, and piano sonatas Pathetique, Moonlight, Waldstein, and Appassionata.
ROMANTIC--Mendelssohn Italian symphony and piano trios. Brahms symphonies 1-4, piano concerto No.2. Schumann Piano Quintet. Chopin Ballades, nocturnes, and preludes. Verdi Requiem. Rachmaninoff Piano Concertos 2,3. Tchaikovsky Symphony 6. Bruckner Symphony 7. Mahler Symphony 4.
MODERN-Shostakovich Symphony 5. Prokofieff Piano concerto 3. Bartok Concerto for Orchestra.

These are all recognized as great masterpieces in various genres and if you take the time (and it involves a large time investment to learn these works) to listen you will surely be rewarded and hooked for life....

Brahms

quote:

Originally posted by rich2513:
one of my all time favourites is here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Debde_E8m-8


I find the problem with classical is how one gets more music exactly 'like that', shoudl i look for more works by Elgar from the same time period ?

The last thing you want to do starting out with classical is to look for more music "exactly like that".

It is much better to expose yourself to as much as possible. More music like the Elgar here will quickly become boring, in the absence of anything else.

quote:

Originally posted by rich2513:
one of my all time favourites is here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Debde_E8m-8


I find the problem with classical is how one gets more music exactly 'like that', should i look for more works by Elgar from the same time period ?

Elgar was one of a number of British composers through the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries. I got to know that period of work starting with Elgar, but there are some very well known composers and compositions you can explore. They share a particular richness to their string arrangement, and there is a melodic influence of English folk music, which is even shared by some English rock music.

These are all very obvious and popular, but a good start.

Elgar: The Enigma Variations, Cello Concerto (The EMI Classics recording with Jaqueline Du Pre is very good, possible the definitive recording, but I have seen other recommendations on the forum too).


Gustav Holst: The Planets Suite (you will already know a fair bit of the music from this even if you do not know it as part of the suite). I can not recommend a particular recording, mine is not the 'best' I have heard although conducted by Simon Rattle, good performance, but if anything too dynamic, so that even on a good system sat alone, I still have to play with the volume in order to hear it, or not be blasted out of the room.

Ralph Vaughan Williams: 'Fantasia on a theme by Thomas Tallis', 'The Lark Ascending' (which has a good recording by Nigel Kennedy together with Elgar's Viola Concerto). Vaughan Williams is very easy to start listening to orchestral music as he influenced a lot of film music and so the style is 'listenable'.

And if you want to dive in, this box set is fantastic:


I would also say it is worth trying Vaughan Willimas 5th symphony, his 3rd is very sad but accessible too. I really love his 4th, but I would say to leave that until you are convinced by his writing, he said of an early performance 'I don't know if I like it, but it is what I meant.' Brilliant stuff, but definitely for later.

William Walton came very slightly later than the above composers, and wrote a fair bit of film music. There is a slight influence of jazz, syncopation and a love of the brass section that has moved on from the gentle richness of Elgar. His 1st symphony is a particular favourite of mine, especially the recording by The London Philharmonic conducted by Leonard Slatkin (virgin Classics), where they blast through it at a very rapid pace.


You can't go wrong with Beethoven's 6th and 7th symphonies either.

I quite agree with what has been written before, but if you are at the start of discovering classical music, throwing you net too wide can be off putting, especially if you are coming from rock music. You might hear some pieces that are dischordant in way that you are not prepared for, as I did with Vaughan Willimas 4th symphony, and they can put you off. You may get to like some of them later, but if a form of msuic is new to you, it may be better to find a foundation from which you can build rather than experience everything all at once. I found, and am still finding the same with jazz (start with 'Kind of Blue' leave 'Bitches Brew' for a couple of years).

One good thing about exploring orchestral music, you can often pick up very good recordings much more cheaply than rock releases, although don't always go for the cheapest. In answer to your question about labels, EMI classics and Deutsche Graphon are well respected, but not always the version to get, and although cheap, some Naxos recordings are great, but above all the advice about performers, and conductors is good to follow, or of a piece tempts you, just post on the forum/this thread and I amsure people will give suggestions to a particular release.

quote:

Originally posted by JamieL_v2:
but if you are at the start of discovering classical music, throwing you net too wide can be off putting, especially if you are coming from rock music. You might hear some pieces that are dischordant in way that you are not prepared for, as I did with Vaughan Willimas 4th symphony, and they can put you off. You may get to like some of them later, but if a form of msuic is new to you, it may be better to find a foundation from which you can build rather than experience everything all at once. I found, and am still finding the same with jazz (start with 'Kind of Blue' leave 'Bitches Brew' for a couple of years).

I agree with this. Find a few pieces that are similar to that lovely Elgar piece you like and work slowly from there. Over exposure too quickly can be a lot to take in and mean you do not enjoy it as much.

You might find amazon useful as well - check out an Elgar disc and see what else people who bought that are buying. Try the music out on something like Spotify and grow from there. You will find you have a number of successes and your knowledge will quickly grow.

ok thanks guys, i'll look at everything mentioned

I have to stress though, I am pretty good at researching but what I cannot discover for myself is the QUALITY of recordings. Can anyone shed any light on this. This was my reason for posting. Is there anything I should look out for or is it pot luck ?

So for example, I am looking at Vaughan Williams and I can get different CD's most of them with the tracks mentioned (The Lark Ascending, Fantasia on greensleves etc..) but i can get a compliation on the "Classics for Pleasure" label, a box set on "Double Decca", a CD on the "Chandos" label, or something on the "Argo" label. All about the same price and all look useful to me. Is it just pot luck ? Should I avoid compilations and pick an album where all the tracks have been performed by the one orchestra from the same recoring ?

thanks, Rich

quote:

Originally posted by rich2513:
thanks for the suggestions guys, i will follow them all up

and yes, i will explore as much as time will permit

but initally I want to try and get some CD's without making the mistake of buying bad quality ones !

are there any labels or series to avoid in terms of the quality of teh recordings ?

Rich,

my advice is to listen to BBC radio 3 as much as you can, especially when in the car, and if you like something just look it up later on the BBC Radio 3 web-site for reference.

Another thing you could consider is a box-set of various classical, such as the Deutsche Harmonia Mundi 50th Anniversary Box which looks very good value for 50cd's for £47-ish, or the Chandos 30th Anniversary Box Set at only £32, both on Amazon: reviews are 5 star on quality.

Compilations are an abomination, avoid them at all costs.

Don't get stuck in an English composer rut, that's not where most of the really good classical music is.

Don't try everything at once, but don't be myopic either. Working on three or four pieces at the same time won't tax you.

Take nain-nymph's advice and let the BBC help you find things you want.

As for recordings, you'll find them where you find them (the great ones that you love). Reviews can be helpful here.

The Beethoven and Bach I recommended earlier are stunning performances recorded with an astounding clarity and beauty.

Try to listen for the tension and release in the music. This will happen at many different levels.

Again the BBC, look for a programme called "building a library", it's part of the "CD review" programme on a Saturday morning. Its in abeyance at the moment for the Proms but the rest of the year a reviewer will go through current recordings of a chosen piece and recommend one of them, mainly on artistic grounds but account is taken of the recording quality. The programme itself is on iplayer for a week after broadcast and there is an archive of recommendations. Back mid September.

I hope rich2513 lets us know how he's coming along.

quote:

Originally posted by rich2513:
I have to stress though, I am pretty good at researching but what I cannot discover for myself is the QUALITY of recordings. Can anyone shed any light on this. This was my reason for posting. Is there anything I should look out for or is it pot luck ?

Check reviews. Also, do you have a local library that lends CDs? I found this to be enormously helpful when starting out with classical music.

Hello, rich. I've found a wealth of knowledge here http://www.classicstoday.com/, here http://www.classical.net/ and here http://www.classical.net/. From time to time, I'll go to Amazon and see if anyone has reviewed something I'm interested in. Sometimes, a reviewer will have real depth of knowledge/experience above and beyond enthusiasm.

Have fun.

I recommend a cd of Biber & Muffat, by John Holloway on ECM new series. It's violin, harpsichord and organ, and is wonderful. Great recording too.

Nigel

thanks for all the tips chaps

making a start, its a bit hit and miss though

some of the elgar i bought was a bit flat to my ears, lacking in emotional fervour

the previews at amazon are lifeasvers