Firewire vs Hiface!

THis is from the blurb for the new dac 202
'Level control main output: 4 coarse settings via relays (analog domain), fine setting via rotary encoder (digital domain). Level control can be defeated for the main output.'

quote:

I would certainly use a source as preamp, every preamp only adds more distortion, I can't wait to trythe new Weiss 202 which has analogue and digital attenuation and a remote.

DHT, it's a bit tough claim on preamps. I know this is an old issue ans there are so many pro's and con's against variable outputs but I can't really ignore a number of trials which were so clearly audible in my past experience. I tried several sources with variable outputs (McIntosch MCD 201, MCD 301, MDA1000 and Transporter -- to name just a few of the recent trials) straight to poweramp and then pass-through the preamp. The preamp-ed sound was so vastly better (more consolidated and faster sound) that I just can't live with variable outputs after that. I have to note that Naim preamps produce greater effect in these experiments than McIntosch preamps. If noise contamination was present and the openness sacrificed in the through-preamp chain -- I have certainly not noticed that.
This fact has a very simple physical explanation -- one of the most important function of any preamp is to match the varying impedance of source output and varying impedance of poweramp input.
Of course, if manufactures will fit a superb preamp into a source unit many people will be happy to benefit from such integration. I just did not happen to come across one so far (I will not be surprised if there are many of them).

quote:

Originally posted by DHT:
THis is from the blurb for the new dac 202
'Level control main output: 4 coarse settings via relays (analog domain), fine setting via rotary encoder (digital domain). Level control can be defeated for the main output.'

4 analog positions and digital variable volume control. That's good idea if your doing 32 bit float with high def. I most like the defeatable part as that's how I would use it and we'll definitely give it try. Ken needs the best interface he can find for mixing playback.

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Originally posted by munch:
It might be a old format but i love vinyl played on my LP12.
This digital lark is changing so fast day by day,Plugins sockets riping softwhere.
Kit is going to end up looking like a Lego kit.
I would say just get a good DAC and something to feed it with.
Enjoy your music.
Dont read anything, Mags/forums for the next two years.
Then have a good read and spend some money.
Stu

From recent personal developments I would suggest "source first" is equally valid in the digital domain as it is in the vinyl domain. I have Sonos and an optimised "PC solution". It is clear that that building a digital source solution from the ground up is a much better digital source. There is much greater freedom for optimization and future proofing as technology and tools mature. However, this is a very techie undertaking and not for the faint hearted

Over Christmas I has the pleasure of listening to a Climax DS at home. It sounded awesome and clearly demonstrated what a well sorted digital source can deliver. CD's says are numbered!!

Graham

quote:

Originally posted by munch:
Graham,
My cds are numbered 1 to 1604 plus the load on the dinning table and the box full out of the loft that have not been put in the book since christmas
Stu

So search by Artist/Album would be good then

quote:

Originally posted by munch:
I would say just get a good DAC and something to feed it with.
Enjoy your music.
Stu

Agreed, but if for any reason you are stuck using a PC which has only USB out as your source, you need a device like the HiFace Spdif adaptor to let you get the music into your Lavry or Naim DAC in the best way.

quote:

This digital lark is changing so fast day by day,Plugins sockets riping softwhere.
Kit is going to end up looking like a Lego kit.

A bit like those old fashioned turntables, Mats up the right way, Superline or Ulrika, Power supplies, Hi-Line, Airplugs and loading debates

quote:

Agreed, but if for any reason you are stuck using a PC which has only USB out as your source, you need a device like the HiFace Spdif adaptor to let you get the music into your Lavry or Naim DAC in the best way.

So that includes many of us then.

I am sitting here listening to tunes coming from the usb output from a ripnas and via the HiFace into my dac.

No complaints here and the best £100 solution I have ever come across.

But would the Bel Canto converter be even better?

So much choice now and so little time

Paul

Allen -

I was in e-mail contact with the M2Tech folks last week. They are working on a new Mac driver. Its taken a while because the issue isn't seen on all Mac's - so its been difficult to do a root cause.

Allen,

Will you still have the INT202 around when your Naim DAC arrives? Very interested to hear about the relative merits of the INT202 v.s. HiFace when used here.

Cheers

Richard

quote:

Originally posted by AllenB:
Richard

Maybe, hope so, but Naim still aren't giving any firm dates to dealers for the DAC delivery, well at least not mine.

Even with my backstop DAC setup, the n-Vi, the HiFace is miles better than the dig out of the MacMini, so I am expecting the difference between the HiFace and the INT202 to be small.

When it eventually does arrive (the DAC that is) I had intended to run just with the HiFace for now, but the INT202 has got to be worth a test run. Who knows I might actually be able to get Amarra to work now

Allen

Hi Allen, what DAC are you using when comparing MAC optical with the HiFace?

I'm finding it very interesting the claims DAC makers are saying about jitter reduction, interface or otherwise. The DAD AX24 admits it's a purest design needing a very low jitter source, whilst using a very sensative PLL. However, many DAC's do not reduce jitter in the slightest even though they claim, apart from Benchmark Media DAC1 which sounds identical regardless of interface.

Really, what the hell is going on?

Having now had a chance to play...the HiFace is great value. Using the DAC2 - I prefer Firewire, closely followed by the HiFace then lagging a fair bit is the Optical.

Joe

I wonder how close a good BNC cabled HiFace will be on the Naim DAC. Don't feel too bad Allen. US dealers are still waiting for DACs too.

Joe,

Given a choice which would you prefer, Amarra (or Pure Vinyl) with HiFace, or iTunes only with Firewire? Just trying to gain a measure of 'close'.

Best Wishes

Richard

quote:

Originally posted by Joe Bibb:
Having now had a chance to play...the HiFace is great value. Using the DAC2 - I prefer Firewire, closely followed by the HiFace then lagging a fair bit is the Optical.

Joe

Richard,

I'm not at home to try that but the difference is not as large as iTunes v Pure Vinyl or Amarra. I'll be interested to see what Allen thinks because my Firewire is part of the DAC2 of course. The reason I have bought a HiFace is to use other computers and compare other DACs that don't have FireWire or USB inputs.

I shall compare Weiss with Firewire and Naim with HiFace pretty soon. The HiFace is a cracking product for the cost. This is one of those nice comparisons to do though. I find the Weiss is superb so if the Naim DAC is better still, that will be quite something.

Joe

Don't forget to try the DAC via the dac2's dig out. You can get a Firewire interface for less than the INT. Not sure if it will be as viable but the price sure will be more so.

AllenB, do you have a linear outboard supply for the INT202?

The differences may not correlate directly to the Nain DAC. Better will be better but the difference could be smaller due to clock management or greater due to better overall resolution.

You can fit it back with some super glue. Just dont use any on the serrations or the holes they go into. Put on the outside of the plastic barrel. You could also have just about any tech pull the rca board mount and chassis mount a BNC.

Allen,

How are you powering the INT202?

Allen,

Agreed - last thing I want is another power supply. Do you know if with the INT202 solution the computer is still part of the earth loop.