What's wrong with subs?

Posted by: Rockingdoc on 05 January 2004

Being a fanatical purist type (why I else would I be here), I've previously avoided sub-woofer's like the plague.
Anyhoo, for our New Year's Eve house party, I decided to beef up the sound to suit the teenagers dance music and borrowed a sub. Nothing sophisticated, just a nice 15" driver in a ported 100 litre cab, 200 watt amp and a crude bypass filter.
It sounded great for the party, pictures were shaken from the walls, and everyone said nice things about the system.
The problem now is that my system sounds anaemic and bass light. We do have a big room, and I think I want a sub.
Can anyone advise of likely difficulties, will I get fed up with a sub? What should I buy, always REL?


The problem
Posted on: 09 January 2004 by Dev B
quote:
Originally posted by count.d:
quote:
I haver heard Shahinians and wasn't really that impressed, they don't really do PRaT and have a ponderous bass.


Thanks Dev, I was begining to think I'd bought the wrong speakers.


Nothing personal Count d, please don't take this the wrong way, but Shahinan's are about the opposite in presentation to something like a SBL. I would imagine you would find a SBL lean sounding, but I found the Shahians ponderous.

The most important thing is that YOU like them!

regards

Dev
Posted on: 09 January 2004 by Nime
James,
I love the way you said: "One can imagine".
Assuming we are still talking about sub bass: What has a massive dustbin lid flapping in a wardrobe sized sealed box, on the end of a PA system amp, have to do with transients? Big Grin

Nime

Everyone has the right to be wrong.
Posted on: 09 January 2004 by Johns Naim
Thanks for that James, I know very little about loudspeaker theory, but surmised a sealed box would have the tightest sound. (Guesswork plus a decade or two of reading HiFi rags on my part) Wink

Details of the design of these speakers can be found here

There are some technical descriptions etc, and apparently the design work extends the Thiele & Small model etc, to a new plane of refinement etc. Apparently Homlinson of THX fame had a hand in things as well, quite interesting white papers, which can be found on the site, under professional, technical etc.

But yeah, I HOPE Naim will do something soon.

I feel a subwoofer coming on.... Big Grin

Best

John... Smile

Populist thinking exalts the simplistic and the ordinary
Posted on: 09 January 2004 by Dev B
Just a thought, how about the Sunfire true subwoofer, who has heard that?
Posted on: 09 January 2004 by Nime
Sealed boxes? What a shame Whise use a coupled cavity filter in their boxes. That means they must have terribly sl-o-o-o-o-w transients doesn't it chaps? Or didn't you get as far as the technical stuff? Smile

Nime

Everyone has the right to be wrong.
Posted on: 09 January 2004 by Bosh
Dev

Hi - please check your PTs
Posted on: 10 January 2004 by Nime
Billy who? Smile

Nime

Everyone has the right to be wrong.
Posted on: 11 January 2004 by Dev B
quote:
Originally posted by Bosh:
Dev

Hi - please check your PTs


thks, i've replied!
Posted on: 11 January 2004 by Alex S.
Never slow to experiment I plugged in an MJ Acoustics Ref 1 sub yesterday (its very REL looking but cheaper and by reputation a bit tighter and faster) and messed about with it. Setup with this sub is fairly straight forward but placement is another matter. Finally, near a corner, it sounds great - integrated, punchy, scaleiferous, dynamic etc. Now I probably need another one in the other corner, although not for stereo reasons; having argued that bass is directional, at least psychologically, I've now decided it isn't (below 50HZ) so long as the setup is right.

Alex

PS Dev, saying Obelisks are ponderous and pr&t-less is like saying SBLs are bass-lite shout boxes; both are dependent on the setup, mains and electronics. Get it right and both can sound superb.
Posted on: 13 January 2004 by Nime
"You'll note that the SBL 8-incher is in fact a mid-bass unit, and not a purpose built woofer. On the surface, they might look the same but the fundamental design will be different. I suspect the REL uses a purpose built woofer, and not some jack-of-both-trade driver".

James

And REL do use some <very> tasty (expensive) purpose built drivers. Including specially designed Volt units unique to REL for the Stadium 111 & upwards.

Nime

Everyone has the right to be wrong.