hdx better than cdx2 ?

Sorry Jon, some of that went over my head but I think I get your drift here

quote:

Or a device which uses SSD for caching of large hidef audio files, which have been brought in over the network cable from some remote network attached disc pack.

this would achieve the same thing!

All good stuff!

J

quote:

Originally posted by pjl:
Who says that solid state memory is the successor to hard disc? That is an assumption based on todays technology. Tomorrow may bring something very different.

Peter

Sure which also means its right at the beginning in the lab/development/production cycle, and thus even further away :-)

quote:

Originally posted by Julian H:
Sorry Jon, some of that went over my head but I think I get your drift here

quote:

Or a device which uses SSD for caching of large hidef audio files, which have been brought in over the network cable from some remote network attached disc pack.

this would achieve the same thing!

All good stuff!

J

The difference between your vision and mine is that I dont want "my stuff" stored inside one box. I want it on several boxes, preferably geographically different locations too. Certainly several different boxes within the same house. Think of a distributed solution which tunnels over the Internet between say your london flat and your cornwall holiday home.

Actually, if I remember rightly, this was one of the original design ideas of NaimNet -- I dont think they have talked about geographically diverse systems much lately?

Ah yes, heres the wording: "A further special application of NaimNet is the ability to provide a simple connection between any number of suitable Naim Hi-Fi systems, so allowing the flexibility of sharing sources regardless of their locations. "

http://www.naimnet.com/about.php

Jon

I don't see why that is not possible today? I could have access to my networked hard drive anywhere I want already (not that I have used it though).

J

quote:

if it is better, we could have a product with hard drive and a modest size SSD

No Hard Disk at all would be better IMHO.

One idea is to use removable storage that is read only to stop any unwanted changes; you could store one album on each removable read-only disc - then to select an album you'd simply insert the disc of choice. There is no limit on the number of albums you could have using this method .. and if the system were good enough you'd have perfect sound forever.

Just a thought.

ATB Rotf

BTW - non-spinning solid state storage does seem ideal - a bit like the devices you get for Nintendo and the like.

quote:

Originally posted by Alco:

quote:

Plus think of the shelves taken up with CDs, freed up for books! That is real progress!

Hmm,...personally I don't consider the last part of this sentence as progress.
I've never liked reading (or looking at) books. Until recently the only book I had for years whas a telephone book and the Yellow pages (whoops, that makes even 2!) Threw them away. No need for 'em anymore.

Hey Alco,

You'd get on pretty well with Victoria Beckham,
she's happy to admit she never reads a book...

Andrew.

quote:

Plus think of the shelves taken up with CDs, freed up for books! That is real progress!

Unfortunately the future of the dead tree business is almost as uncertain as that of the poor old CD - of course, there will be plentiful and cheap second-hand supplies of both formats for some time to come...

quote:

Originally posted by Julian H:
Jon

I don't see why that is not possible today? I could have access to my networked hard drive anywhere I want already (not that I have used it though).

J

Indeed so -- now you have to package it in such a way that it is very easy to use, install etc. First company likely to do this? Apple, without doubt.

quote:

Originally posted by jon honeyball:
I dont want "my stuff" stored inside one box. I want it on several boxes, preferably geographically different locations too. Certainly several different boxes within the same house. Think of a distributed solution which tunnels over the Internet between say your london flat and your cornwall holiday home.

Why would you want 'several boxes'? Surely having your entire music collection on a single iPod/iPhone size device allows you to manage it seamlessly and take it with you anywhere you go - car, plane, holiday, work etc etc.

I think this is the model for the future - well, it's already here basically.

Redundancy

Back to the question: HDX better than CDX 2?

Well, after long listening tests at my dealer where I compared HDX to CDX 2 I ordererd a HDX, since I prefer the HDX soundwise. It is now right beside my CDX 2 in my listening room and further comparisons prove my first impression. But this is very subjective (maybe like the 200 vs. 250 question?). The HDX is voiced more on the analytical side but its rhythm and flow (PRaT) in the music is amazing. The HDX is very revealing and this can be considered as a lack of warmth by some listeners - as I said before it is really subjective, since everybody is listening differently. But I love the HDXs precise 3D soundstage, its transient attacks are outstanding and same goes for the decay of a tone. And plenty of new details can be heard. But one can still like listening to bad recorded albums.

When it comes to high resolution files the HDX is singing:-)

Adding a XPS 2 takes the HDX even to another level.

To me the HDX is a graet new product and will replace my trusty CDX 2.

You have me confused John. Your posts in the distributed audio section gave me the impression you already had one. We didn't hear the revealing and analytical part. Instead we missed natural decay of tones, ambient information and atmosphere, most obvious with live recordings. Very subjective as you say.

But congrats with your new source! It's a good piece of kit.


What is the rest of your system it will live in?

Richard.

One for a CDX2. One for an HDX.

It's a tie, so far.

@ KTMax: I have got my HDX since about 2 weeks and I already ripped 300 CDs - alot of work! So my comparisons continued at home. Both players are connected via Hi Line to 282 and 200. The decay of a solo piano tone is fantastic with the HDX and same with the soundstage - it is really 3D. I listened to Antiphone Blues as a K2 HD (newest XRCD format, but still redbook standard) and suddenly I found myself sitting right in the small Swedish church were this recording has been made 3 decades ago. The CDX 2 created a good illusion, too, but not as precise. So at the moment I still have got both players in my rack.

quote:

Originally posted by kuma:
One for a CDX2. One for an HDX.

It's a tie, so far.

...not if you look at the upgrade paths

quote:

Who says that solid state memory is the successor to hard disc? That is an assumption based on todays technology. Tomorrow may bring something very different.

Don't hold your breath for the arrival of some new storage medium to replace HDD and Flash. The HDD makers have the technology worked out to take their storage capacity up by an order of magnitude substituting Terabytes of storage for what we now quote in Gigabytes. Flash in this context is NOT a contender due to extortionate relative cost. The Flash market IS booming but we are talking mainly about 30 or 60 Gb and 100 - 200 Gb is deluxe storage for secure data. The HDD guys are actually getting together with the Flash guys. Storage on computers is shifting to a decent amount of flash for 'instant access' to programs coupled with LARGE HDD's to store all the files.

It is dangerous to hang the choice of HDX on an expected pervasive availability of Hi Res files. Especially when download impetus is all about MP3.

We are also in the hands of the recording / mastering engineesr who seem to be able to f**k it up regardless of format. I have explored the Hires formats (DVD-A & SACD) ever since they came out. There are a few jewels but there is an awfull lot of crap Hi Res out there.

Geoff

Hi Geoff,

Good post. The hi res formats are an interesting distraction but not much more and we are, as ever, in the hands of the mastering engineers.

Steve

Last friday at the Naim Summer Sounds event at Concerto Audio in Amsterdam I listened to the HDX and a CDX2 and I think the HDX is about a million times better than the CDX2. Having owned the CDX2 for about 9 months. I still don't regret that I sold it.

The CDX2's presentation is more forward than the HDX with XPS2. The voices presented by the CDX2 were colored overshadowing detail. With the HDX the voices were just right. Also the CDX2 put more emphasis on the midband whereas the HDX had a more even presentation. I do understand why people prefer the CDX2 when I first bought it I was very happy with it too, but its presentation of the music is just tiring and not satisfying in the long run.

Regards
Bas

@ bwolke: I am glad to read that I am not the only one on planet flat earth who prefers the HDX. I would not go so far to say that the HDX is a million times better than the CDX 2, but quite a bit. And mine just starts to burn in I always liked the CDX 2 but now the HDX is better and I am happy that it is better with CD, is able to play back 24bit files (the few I listened to just sound great) and offers all this with great convenience. I can not understand why so many people here do not appreciate this.

Hi bwolke and John R.

I also prefer the HDX and ordered one. I compared the CDX2 with the HDX among others. My findings can be found elsewhere on this forum under "Flatcapped(2x) or hi-capped Supernait with Stageline?". I'm glad to hear positive reactions about the HDX, because although the sound between the CDX2 and the HDX is very different, IMO the HDX has many more things to offer soundwise and in the way it does more than just playing CD's. I must say that I agree with the findings of both of you. I just installed a storage router and an external harddrive. Almost ready to plug in and play the HDX. Just waiting for it... .

Patrick

HDX vs. CDX2.

Two to one.

quote:

Don't hold your breath for the arrival of some new storage medium to replace HDD and Flash. The HDD makers have the technology worked out to take their storage capacity up by an order of magnitude substituting Terabytes of storage for what we now quote in Gigabytes. Flash in this context is NOT a contender due to extortionate relative cost.

Geoff I think that'll change - we are already moving storage away from horrible disks (HD) to quieter, faster, more reliable flash drives. Sure the discs are still in the cupboard to re-load if disaster strikes (DVDs).

I think this is how music will develop - the 1TB flash is just around the corner. Long term it'll be cheaper - no moving parts and silent.

ATB Rotf

quote:

the 1TB flash is just around the corner.

Err....It would be nice but it ain't gonna happen. Not really.

Right now a 100 GigaByte Flash Drive costs at least 1000 $
And a 1 TeraByte HHD costs 100$

So to get 1 TeraByte of Flash you would have to fork out 10,000$ compared to 100$ for the same size HDD.

The 'prices come down with demand' argument will not work for this large a gap.

Assuming eventually the price of 1 TB of Flash came down to 1,000 $ by that time you will be able to get 1 PetaByte of HDD for 100 $ so the large price gap will still be there.

I worked in the Semiconductor industry until very recently and though they would love it to be so the industry knows it is not going to be able to shrink prices by much as each advance in memory density requires an enormous financial investment.

regards
Geoff

quote:

Originally posted by bwolke:
Last friday at the Naim Summer Sounds event at Concerto Audio in Amsterdam I listened to the HDX and a CDX2 and I think the HDX is about a million times better than the CDX2. Having owned the CDX2 for about 9 months. I still don't regret that I sold it.

Maybe that is 'just a little' over the top Bas? Are you familiar with the acoustic 'qualities' of the tiny demo room at Concerto that puts the speakers virtually in your ears? I am. It does exactly what you described. Say hi to Alex from me when you speak to him. I know him for years, he's a nice guy (bought my Fraim from him too). I've been fiddling with the very HDX you've heard to get it on the web for the show. Was the kit still sitting on that wobbly white piece of furniture?

But it's great the HDX convinced you like it did. Like I said, it's fine piece of kit. It's sonic qualities are just not my cup of tea. Nor from my dealer who obviously would have liked to put down the much more expensive HDX on my order.

Richard.

quote:

Originally posted by John R.:
I can not understand why so many people here do not appreciate this.

Because they've all got CDX2s?
Seriously, how do you play back your 24/96 files? Ethernet, wireless or USB?