hdx better than cdx2 ?

Gary is your kit all olive?

quote:

Originally posted by Gary S.:
but nevertheless I struggle to understand some of the comments made on here.

How can we all disagree so much?,

Ive been thinking the same. Since I first joined the forum I have encountered this divergence of opinions.

My second or third post was an inquiry into what DACs Naim users had in their kits. It was evident that no one was really doing this nor thought it to be capable as a high quality source.

I said in one post;

"With a properly set-up PC or Mac, and a decent DAC, one could put together a source that could rival some of the best CDPs out there..."

This was of course heresy beyond belief. It even elicited a response from dD that basically said 'You might wish that but it is sadly untrue'... or something to that effect.

I dont think the the perceived "differences" are all that great. It is just new and people tend to resist change. How the hell did Bush get re-elected!!!!!!

My guess is that people who have spent upwards of $10K on a CDP will have a hard time finding a PC/DAC suitable. Others who cannot afford a CDX2 with XPS might not hear a big difference between that and their Lavry or B-ford.

In the end I think they are all pretty good in the very least. It is analogous to the Olympians we just watched. It a race the person finishing last is SO FAR behind the winner. But that last person is the 10th fastest person in the entire world. We are comparing the best of the best. The differences, seemingly large, need to be taken OUT of context.

See the "Perceived System Differences" thread over in the real forum. This is the kind of power the mind has. Bad day? The kit sounds bad. Not wanting a $200 DAC to sound good? DAC not good. The human brain is quite powerful.

I think self-fulfilling prophecy, expectations, and closed minds (on both sides) are to blame for the depth of the chasm between the two digital sources.

The volatility of the issue though is something else though. Not sure where that comes from.

The fact that there is a "Distributed Audio" section now is very telling. Too many posts (I am guilty here), on the technical side of things, pissed everyone off.

I still cannot understand why people dont simply avoid threads they have no interest in.

It is strange why the ultimate in tweekdom, the LP12, doesn't get relegated to its own forum as well. Although it contains different content, the Superline loading thread doesn't seem much different to me than some of the tech threads that were ultimately moved from "Hi-Fi".

ordering my Lavry very soon.

New Bersford at the end of the month courtesy of Stanley. His new model.

-Patrick

quote:

Originally posted by munch:
Gary is your kit all olive?

Yes, but the first demonstration was done in my home at the same time as I was also auditioning a 282/200, so I have heard the DS on both Olive and black gear and the results were consistent.

I should also add that a home demonstration of the Linn DS is not easy due to the requirements to have a server & media tablet to hand. During the first demonstration, the dealer brought his own laptop which was positioned next to the hifi and his own wireless router (for the Nokia meadia tablet). Since then I have installed my own wired network and so the second demonstration was done using my cabling and router etc - the results were the same. The dealer also ripped some of my own CDs and was also able to demonstrate master tape quality copies of some tracks which are very familiar to me, this was breath-taking.

Regards

Gary

I have had the opportunity to demo the Klimax DS three times - and the Akurate DS twice.

IMHO the Klimax DS is considerably better than the Akurate DS.

I directly compared (through a 552) the Klimax DS with a CDS3/XPS2 (I own a CDS3/555PS). They were just about even (as to be expected as the cost is roughly the same - actually the CDS3/XPS2 a tad more) and it boiled down to the Naim vs. Linn presentation.

If someone did not own a digital playback machine then they would be very happy with either player. If I did not own a player I would most likely go for the Klimax DS - it seems more forward thinking - no moving parts (to break) - open source and easily expandable - digital storage vs silver discs will be (is) the way of the future.

I have not yet demoed the HDX. If one were to consider it, based upon its price, then, as per my own criteria, it would need to be compared to the above mentioned solutions - the CDS3 and the Klimax. As such its performance (with XPS2) would have to at least equal that of a CDS3/XPS2 (and not a CDX2) to be considered - IMHO.

Gregg

quote:

Originally posted by glevethan:
IMHO the Klimax DS is considerably better than the Akurate DS.
Gregg

Gregg, no doubt, but at roughly 3x the price, it should be. I will not be demoing it, because I don't want to spend this much on a single source.

The great advantage of the streamed music it that you can then use other devices to stream music to other parts of the house. In our case we are considering Sonos systems for the kitchen and dining room and the kids will be able to stream using their X-boxes, furthermore, we can rip our DVDs etc and stream them to the TV - all very exciting stuff

Gary

quote:

Originally posted by Gary S.:

quote:

Originally posted by munch:
Gary is your kit all olive?

Yes, but the first demonstration was done in my home at the same time as I was also auditioning a 282/200, so I have heard the DS on both Olive and black gear and the results were consistent.

I should also add that a home demonstration of the Linn DS is not easy due to the requirements to have a server & media tablet to hand. During the first demonstration, the dealer brought his own laptop which was positioned next to the hifi and his own wireless router (for the Nokia meadia tablet). Since then I have installed my own wired network and so the second demonstration was done using my cabling and router etc - the results were the same. The dealer also ripped some of my own CDs and was also able to demonstrate master tape quality copies of some tracks which are very familiar to me, this was breath-taking.

Regards

Gary

If you demo the HDX make sure you do that at home with your system also.
Munch

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quote:

Originally posted by Paul Stephenson:
ok its going to be one of those round about answers sorry, in my case I have a full LP12 rig,a 555 with x2 555ps and the hdx with a 555ps, well I would wouldnt I?

Slumming it, eh? Come on, Paul, give that HDX the second 555PS it deserves.

Gregg, you are very fortunate to have the ability to demo both Naim and Linn in the same setting. Unfortunately that is not possible in Chicago. Are you in the city or are you going to Dave Wilson's up in My. Kisco? This is where I first was introduced to Naim.

Even getting a Linn Demo has been frustrating as one of the dealers here had a difficult time setting up the system and the other also sells Wadia and he tries to push this over the Linn DAC as he feels is is a much better performer and VFM. People I know who've tried the Wadia did not like the presentation.

I'd be curious to know your impressions of the HDX and comparisons to the Linn system.

When are you going to "try" the Lavry? I've got one coming early next week as I've posted and hope to do an extensive comparison next weekend.

Hi Gary

I am about 15 minutes from Accent On Music and did these demos there. One of the demos I had was actually presented by Ivor T when he came over to do a road show about 4 months ago. I have not yet heard the HDX however I believe that Accent will be receiving one this coming week. In regards to "when are you going to try the Lavry" - well I already have the cables in house however I am awaiting for two pairs of speakers to arrive for demo by the end of the month. As such that will be taking priority for now - HOWEVER I do not know for how much longer I will be able to hold out on pulling the trigger for the Lavry - too many good reports on this forum not to give it a try. For my needs if the Lavry performs than it will be exactly the right solution for me - the HDX does not appeal to me due to various criteria - and the Linn user interface is not appealing. If the Lavry performs than it will offer exactly what I want. PLEASE let me know what you find out with it after you have had a listen.

Regards
Gregg

Gregg, absolutely I'm very curious myself as digital playback is the way I want to go. Interesting that there is again even among Linn boxes a difference of opinion. I appears that you did not fall in love with the Akurate DS and that's $6K or was it because it cannot achieve what you already have at home with your Naim CDP with ripped 16 bit?

What's Dave's impression? I did hear that the UI is a bit of a disaster.

The user interface is crucial, and no less so, though not more so, than the musical/sonic function of any replay.

With LP the issue was one of decent sized print and artwork on the sleeve that made up for the relative difficulty of accessing any track except the first one on the side.

With CD it was the easy access to the tracks, but not at all the packaging.

In the digital/server/hard drive world the User Interface hase to have the ease od track access of CD and the library search simplicity of iTunes, IMHO.

Given that a Macbook and Lavry have both the good musical performance and a very easy to use User Interface, I find it compelling.

With the HDX, I would have to append a bigger screen which is both untidy and adds cost to something that is already beyond my possible budget. I am not worried however.

And with a MAC Laptop, I can fold the screen down so that it is no more offensive to my eyes than any other slim black box!

ATB from George

quote:

Originally posted by Markus S:

quote:

Originally posted by Paul Stephenson:
ok its going to be one of those round about answers sorry, in my case I have a full LP12 rig,a 555 with x2 555ps and the hdx with a 555ps, well I would wouldnt I?

Slumming it, eh? Come on, Paul, give that HDX the second 555PS it deserves.

I don't think he can.
Only one Burndy input off an HDX, IIRC.

Posted by GFFJ:

quote:

With LP the issue was one of decent sized print and artwork on the sleeve that made up for the relative difficulty of accessing any track except the first one on the side.

With CD it was the easy access to the tracks, but not at all the packaging.

In the digital/server/hard drive world the User Interface hase to have the ease od track access of CD and the library search simplicity of iTunes, IMHO.

Well stated George. Odd that some have commented about the comfort of liner notes on LP's or CD's. Once a web browser is at hand, you can imagine having access to far more information about the album, artists, composer, recording sessions, etc. No longer the restriction of size and printing cost. Best of all, no more reading glasses at hand.

Charlie

Georges comments regarding the user interface being crucial are right on. For me that is perhaps the main impetus to begin to experiment with computer playback. Maybe it is because I am a Mac junkie however I still maintain that at present the most elegant, easy to use interface out there right now is iTunes. Obviously the approximately 120 million people who have already purchased iPods agree - and the untold numerous numbers of people who have downloaded iTunes for both their Windows and Mac programs are also of the same opinion. And things have just gotten easier with the new Apple Remote application and an iPod Touch/iPhone.

Gary

I did not fall in love with the Akurate DS because: I have a CDS3/555PS ; and I heard a Klimax DS right after it . I did not compare the Akurate to a CDX2/CDS3 (I compared the Klimax to the CDS3) however I think that it would fare quite well - its just not a Klimax DS.

As for Davids opinion I do not want to speak for him - lets just say that people are spending most of their time in the room which has the Akurate player (the Klimax has already been sold) - it really is so convenient to use . The user interface needs improvement however lets see what the Lavry can bring to the party - no need to worry about its user interface - iTunes!

Gregg

Gregg,

I may have to give Dave a call or plan a trip to visit my family and stop by for a demo. I did call him months ago, but that was before everything was released and I know that he was impressed by the Klimax and Akurate. He had not had the gear long enough to evaluate and compare to the Naim line-up at the time, as these were still mostly company demos as you mentioned. I do think that a direct demo comparing the HDX vs. Linn DACs vs. Naim CDPs is important so you can get a real feel for where this is going (Lavry aside). I just cannot believe that Linn developed such a poor UI. While itunes is an easy UI and I agree the new itouch remote -->Mac is really nice. My favorite UI is still Sonos.

quote:

Originally posted by gary1:
Gregg,

I may have to give Dave a call or plan a trip to visit my family and stop by for a demo. I did call him months ago, but that was before everything was released and I know that he was impressed by the Klimax and Akurate. He had not had the gear long enough to evaluate and compare to the Naim line-up at the time, as these were still mostly company demos as you mentioned. I do think that a direct demo comparing the HDX vs. Linn DACs vs. Naim CDPs is important so you can get a real feel for where this is going (Lavry aside). I just cannot believe that Linn developed such a poor UI. While itunes is an easy UI and I agree the new itouch remote -->Mac is really nice. My favorite UI is still Sonos.

The best UI is Sooloos, hands down. Once you use it, you will realize just how lacking the others are. Having heavily demoed a Sooloos, I think the sound is pretty mediocre, but that user interface is just over the top.

quote:

Originally posted by Erik:
Luckily, we live in a free world. I have had the Cd555 for a couple of years in my humble system and so have a friend. I heard the NS01 in his system and was thrilled of the "rightness". The HDX with a PS555 added made me forget about CD-players and realize that HD based players is the future. I have sold my trippel5 and my only concern is if I should wait for a "HDS" or buy the HDX.

/Erik

Was there a perceivable difference between the NS01 and the HDX. I know they are technically the same thing, but WITHOUT the front touch panel (more digital noise). That would be interesting.

cj, not the same thing, the hdx audio board is very different and can also be upgraded with a psu. There is a big sound difference between the two.

quote:

Originally posted by Paul Stephenson:
cj, not the same thing, the hdx audio board is very different and can also be upgraded with a psu. There is a big sound difference between the two.

Really! Hmm, so your saying the HDX is better, even without the PSU? Will the HDX work with Netstreams the same way the NS01 would?

Absolutely–up to six streams onto the network.