DHL rip off
Posted by: TomK on 16 September 2006
Has anybody had any dealings with this mob? I bought a couple of toys from US sellers on Ebay over a year ago. They were shipped using DHL who delivered the parcels and as far as I was concerned that was it. However unbeknown to me UK Customs had slapped charges on the parcels and DHL paid the money without informing me of this. Three months later they invoiced me for the charges. By this time it was too late to do much about it as far as Customs was concerned and I told DHL I wasn't paying, and why (i.e. because they shouldn't have paid on my behalf in the first place). However this morning I got a letter from a debt collecting agency demanding payment, threatening court action etc.
What's the score here? I'd have queried the charges if I'd had the chance but didn't get the chance. Can DHL really do this i.e. pay charges without consulting the person receiving the parcel and then demand payment? The amount is trivial i.e. less than 30 quid in total but there's a principle involved here.
What's the score here? I'd have queried the charges if I'd had the chance but didn't get the chance. Can DHL really do this i.e. pay charges without consulting the person receiving the parcel and then demand payment? The amount is trivial i.e. less than 30 quid in total but there's a principle involved here.
Posted on: 17 September 2006 by Jono 13
Check DHL's terms and conditions, did you or the seller arrange shipping as this can affect who is liable for duty charges.
Also check value of goods vs duty needed to be paid.
Jono
Also check value of goods vs duty needed to be paid.
Jono
Posted on: 17 September 2006 by Stephen Tate
hi,
I would ignore the letters, if they want to take you to court over thirty quid then let them. You have done nothing wrong.
regards
I would ignore the letters, if they want to take you to court over thirty quid then let them. You have done nothing wrong.
regards
Posted on: 17 September 2006 by Paul Hutchings
AFAIK that's the whole point of using an express courier such as DHL/Fedex, they customs clear everything so you get it much more quickly but you pay an admin fee for them doing this.
I suspect as Jono says it's all in the T&Cs and you probably agreed to them by signing for the parcel even if you didn't know you had.
Without sounding too dramatic it's £30 vs. grief and your credit record etc.
I suspect as Jono says it's all in the T&Cs and you probably agreed to them by signing for the parcel even if you didn't know you had.
Without sounding too dramatic it's £30 vs. grief and your credit record etc.
Posted on: 17 September 2006 by Mick P
Tom
If you refuse to pay the import duty, you will be persued in the courts and you will be guaranteed to lose and will have pay all costs of I would estimate £500/£600. Also your credit record will be damaged which will not be hepful next time you apply for a mortgage.
The companies are used to dealing with people like you and they do it in the most expediant manner which means you pay the cost.
It is your call.
Regards
Mick
If you refuse to pay the import duty, you will be persued in the courts and you will be guaranteed to lose and will have pay all costs of I would estimate £500/£600. Also your credit record will be damaged which will not be hepful next time you apply for a mortgage.
The companies are used to dealing with people like you and they do it in the most expediant manner which means you pay the cost.
It is your call.
Regards
Mick
Posted on: 17 September 2006 by BigH47
They are bigger than you and retain lawyers full time. So you work it out. Just another pleasure of capitalism.
Profit before people etc etc.
Vorsprung Dork Technique as they say in Germany.
Profit before people etc etc.
Vorsprung Dork Technique as they say in Germany.
Posted on: 17 September 2006 by count.d
You must be mad or awkward, or both. Do you not know the amount of damage a ccj can do to you?
DHL pay the customs duty to speed things up for you! Other carriers pay it for you, but will demand it to be paid before the parcel is handed over.
It also depends on how the vendor labels the package for customs purposes.
DHL pay the customs duty to speed things up for you! Other carriers pay it for you, but will demand it to be paid before the parcel is handed over.
It also depends on how the vendor labels the package for customs purposes.
Posted on: 17 September 2006 by JWM
You think DHL are bad? Try UPS...
Not only a similar (but not exactly the same) sort of deal with the customs, etc. But also really bad at delivery. If they miss you, you have to give them two other days to try within the next 10 days - even if you are holiday and explain this to them - and yes, they'll still come to try to deliver on holiday days when they know there'll be no-one there...
In the end it worked out that they delivered on the fourth pre-agreed day - I had to wait in unnecessarily for four whole days to get the parcel - then the customs, etc.
Apart from UPS' appalling service, most of my anger was due to not knowing this would happen (may be in terms and conditions, but that's tiny small print somewhere not obvious.) So now, having chalked up this one to experience, I am 'forewarned is forearmed', so if I order from USA again, I know just what to expect.
James
Not only a similar (but not exactly the same) sort of deal with the customs, etc. But also really bad at delivery. If they miss you, you have to give them two other days to try within the next 10 days - even if you are holiday and explain this to them - and yes, they'll still come to try to deliver on holiday days when they know there'll be no-one there...
In the end it worked out that they delivered on the fourth pre-agreed day - I had to wait in unnecessarily for four whole days to get the parcel - then the customs, etc.
Apart from UPS' appalling service, most of my anger was due to not knowing this would happen (may be in terms and conditions, but that's tiny small print somewhere not obvious.) So now, having chalked up this one to experience, I am 'forewarned is forearmed', so if I order from USA again, I know just what to expect.
James
Posted on: 17 September 2006 by Mick P
Chaps
This problem has nothing to do with the carrier. This is the UK Customs & Excise who make these rules. If you have a complaint, lobby them and don't pester the carrier who is doing what he is told to do.
Regards
Mick
This problem has nothing to do with the carrier. This is the UK Customs & Excise who make these rules. If you have a complaint, lobby them and don't pester the carrier who is doing what he is told to do.
Regards
Mick
Posted on: 17 September 2006 by TomK
Yes I agree I've really no choice but to pay even though I'm not liable. I had no control over the choice of carrier. This was decided by the person I bought the toys from and I've no idea whether there was an opt out available at that end. The documentation I saw referred to "porcelain dolls" which was not what was actually in the parcel and this should have been obvious to anybody who actually bothered checking. The value of my stuff was about 30 dollars so there really shouldn't have been anything to pay. When the parcel was delivered there was absolutely no indication there had been charges and the fact that they didn't invoice me until about 3 months later meant there was nothing I could do to appeal.
I'm really pissed off, doubly so as there's absolutely nothing I can do about it except make sure I never use them myself and try to persuade anybody posting anything to me to do the same.
In with anger, out with love...
I'm really pissed off, doubly so as there's absolutely nothing I can do about it except make sure I never use them myself and try to persuade anybody posting anything to me to do the same.
In with anger, out with love...
Posted on: 17 September 2006 by Willy
quote:Originally posted by TomK:
The documentation I saw referred to "porcelain dolls" which was not what was actually in the parcel and this should have been obvious to anybody who actually bothered checking. The value of my stuff was about 30 dollars so there really shouldn't have been anything to pay. ...
Sounds like the fault is with the person who shipped the toys. If the customs declaration had been correctly filled in then there would have been no charges.
Willy.
Posted on: 18 September 2006 by Mick P
Chaps
Import duties start at £18.00 inc pp.
At $30, the goods are borderline.
It is up to the sender what value is indicated on the package and there seems to be the problem.
The best bet is to pay up and get over it.
Regards
Mick
Import duties start at £18.00 inc pp.
At $30, the goods are borderline.
It is up to the sender what value is indicated on the package and there seems to be the problem.
The best bet is to pay up and get over it.
Regards
Mick
Posted on: 18 September 2006 by Jeroen P
quote:I would ignore the letters, if they want to take you to court over thirty quid then let them. You have done nothing wrong.
That is great advice from Stephen. However, before you decide to take it, I would suggest you check with him if he is prepared to pay any charges that may result from this stupid, uninformed suggestion. Indeed you have done nothing wrong but then neither has DHL.
Mick Parry's advice would be the most sensible option. Pay up and get over it. As others have said, DHL are only doing what they are paid to do and the charges relate to the declared cost of the content of the parcel. So your issue is with the retailer if they have declared the value of the shipment incorrectly.
Posted on: 18 September 2006 by Rockingdoc
I don't understand the problem. If you owe money, you should pay it. If you owe money to the Excise, pay it as fast as you can because they have scary powers. DHL have acted correctly, and did inform you of your obligations regarding costs because it is in all of their documentation. It is hardly their fault if you didn't read it.
Posted on: 18 September 2006 by Derek Wright
Agree with above pay up
However on one occcasion I received some software from Lotus in the US, it was a freeby from a Technical Conference that they did not get ready in time so they shipped it later.
I received an invoice from the courier for an amount that made a mockery of receiving a freeby, so I rang the courier and explained the situation and I believe that they billed the sender. Any way I never heard any more about it.
If I have a complaint about the customs issue it is the way that they tax you on the cost of shipping and packing as well as on the goods (if they are liable for tax/duty)
However on one occcasion I received some software from Lotus in the US, it was a freeby from a Technical Conference that they did not get ready in time so they shipped it later.
I received an invoice from the courier for an amount that made a mockery of receiving a freeby, so I rang the courier and explained the situation and I believe that they billed the sender. Any way I never heard any more about it.
If I have a complaint about the customs issue it is the way that they tax you on the cost of shipping and packing as well as on the goods (if they are liable for tax/duty)
Posted on: 18 September 2006 by Stephen Tate
quote:Originally posted by TomK:
However unbeknown to me UK Customs had slapped charges on the parcels and DHL paid the money without informing me of this. Three months later they invoiced me for the charges. By this time it was too late to do much about it as far as Customs was concerned and I told DHL I wasn't paying, and why (i.e. because they shouldn't have paid on my behalf in the first place). However this morning I got a letter from a debt collecting agency demanding payment, threatening court action etc.
What's the score here? I'd have queried the charges if I'd had the chance but didn't get the chance. Can DHL really do this i.e. pay charges without consulting the person receiving the parcel and then demand payment? The amount is trivial i.e. less than 30 quid in total but there's a principle involved here.
Pay it as others have said is probably the easiest way.
Personally i would'nt, the way they all these parties have behaved is completely unacceptable.
Only hearing about it three months later is an absolute joke!
They would not get a bean off me.
Thats food taken from the childrens mouths.
p.s cant you offer to pay them a pound a week or fortnight? (try and get them to collect aswell)
regards
Posted on: 18 September 2006 by Paul Hutchings
quote:Originally posted by Stephen Tate:
Personally i would'nt, the way they all these parties have behaved is completely unacceptable.
I don't understand why though?
I agree if the person sending the parcel has marked a high/erroneous value on the customs declaration that is unfortunate but I don't see what is unacceptable about what boils down to DHL wanting to be paid for the service they provide?
Incidentally it's one reason I tend to avoid US stores that ship via UPS/DHL/Fedec etc. I'd sooner wait a little longer and use USPS and take my chances whether customs bother or not and they have bothered only once.
Posted on: 18 September 2006 by Stephen Tate
Paul ,
Three months later though (quarter of a year)
are they really that incompetent? how do they get any customers?
Being billed for something you knew nothing about before hand?...
regards
Three months later though (quarter of a year)
are they really that incompetent? how do they get any customers?Being billed for something you knew nothing about before hand?...
regards
Posted on: 18 September 2006 by TomK
quote:Originally posted by Rockingdoc:
I don't understand the problem. If you owe money, you should pay it. If you owe money to the Excise, pay it as fast as you can because they have scary powers. DHL have acted correctly, and did inform you of your obligations regarding costs because it is in all of their documentation. It is hardly their fault if you didn't read it.
Sorry but I'm not a flamin idiot. I don't owe anybody money but I'm going to pay because it's by far the lesser of 2 evils. There was no small print not to read. They did not inform me of my obligations because I didn't ship the flippin thing. The documentation with the parcel, when I received it, made no reference whatsoever to customs charges. I checked. Honest. I'm not a fucking moron.
Posted on: 18 September 2006 by Mick P
Tom
You said ... "What's the score here? I'd have queried the charges if I'd had the chance but didn't get the chance. Can DHL really do this i.e. pay charges without consulting the person receiving the parcel and then demand payment? The amount is trivial i.e. less than 30 quid in total but there's a principle involved here.
You need to know the law.
The moment DHL received the package, it became your legal property. Also if the sender did not indicate it was below the UK tax threshold, they are obligued by UK law to charge the duty.
You cannot refused to accept the goods because they are yours to begin with.
You could have stipulated COD which would have got you off the hook but you didn't.
DHL have to await instructions from C&E if the value is not indicated and this can take time. Therefore they delivered it as required by law and invoiced you at the later date as required by law. Please note I keep using the term "by law"
DHL have done nothing wrong and you legally owe them the money. If you have a complaint, go to C&E and they will refer you to the sender. Basically if you did complain, you would look a bit of an idiot over such a trivial amount.
$30 could go either way for tax and is it really worth coming on here spluttering like some old woman over a few quid.
Time to forget it.
Regards
Mick
You said ... "What's the score here? I'd have queried the charges if I'd had the chance but didn't get the chance. Can DHL really do this i.e. pay charges without consulting the person receiving the parcel and then demand payment? The amount is trivial i.e. less than 30 quid in total but there's a principle involved here.
You need to know the law.
The moment DHL received the package, it became your legal property. Also if the sender did not indicate it was below the UK tax threshold, they are obligued by UK law to charge the duty.
You cannot refused to accept the goods because they are yours to begin with.
You could have stipulated COD which would have got you off the hook but you didn't.
DHL have to await instructions from C&E if the value is not indicated and this can take time. Therefore they delivered it as required by law and invoiced you at the later date as required by law. Please note I keep using the term "by law"
DHL have done nothing wrong and you legally owe them the money. If you have a complaint, go to C&E and they will refer you to the sender. Basically if you did complain, you would look a bit of an idiot over such a trivial amount.
$30 could go either way for tax and is it really worth coming on here spluttering like some old woman over a few quid.
Time to forget it.
Regards
Mick
Posted on: 19 September 2006 by TomK
quote:Originally posted by Mick Parry:
Tom
Time to forget it.
Regards
Mick
I have forgotten it and it was paid yesterday.
Posted on: 19 September 2006 by count.d
quote:Sorry but I'm not a flamin idiot. I don't owe anybody money but I'm going to pay because it's by far the lesser of 2 evils. There was no small print not to read. They did not inform me of my obligations because I didn't ship the flippin thing. The documentation with the parcel, when I received it, made no reference whatsoever to customs charges. I checked. Honest. I'm not a fucking moron.
quote:quote:
Originally posted by Mick Parry:
Tom
Time to forget it.
Regards
Mick
I have forgotten it and it was paid yesterday.
In Moderation for one week.
Adam Meredith
Posted on: 22 September 2006 by TomK
quote:Originally posted by count.d:
Well you obviously are a flaming idiot and a f****ng moron as you you deny. I have had literally hundreds of shipments from The States and on the few occasions I've been charged too much customs due to the seller's fault, I've kept my head, written a one minute letter to the customs & excise and got all my due money back without a single problem...every time! Some people are their own worst enemy, it seems.
Jeez I'd hoped this had died off but there's always one isn't there. I'll try to make this easy for you. I too have received many shipments from the US, some I've paid duty on, most I didn't. The difference with the others though was that each time I knew there and then what was payable, and paid it. End of story. This time DHL delivered something and didn't tell me there was duty payable. No small print, nothing hidden in the parcel that I didn't read. Nothing. I wasn't surprised because no duty should have been payable. They finally told me three months later when they invoiced me by which time all my paperwork had long since been disposed of so I had no evidence to support my case. That's my complaint. Because of their crappy working practices I wasn't able to write the one minute letter to customs as I had nothing to back it up. Is that simple enough for you? Now please, no more. It's paid, I've learnt a lesson and it's done.
Posted on: 22 September 2006 by count.d
It had died off, my post was three days ago. If you want to continue digging your embarrassing hole, keep diggin.
I don't wish to help you as I think you're an arrogant git and have always been so. Let's just say if you bought from Ebay, you'd have all the information needed to get a full refund. It really is easy for most happy people.
Thanks for making it easy for me. I don't want to make it easy for you.
You and that bob mcunluckie bloke should get together on a night out. What a night of fun that would be!
I don't wish to help you as I think you're an arrogant git and have always been so. Let's just say if you bought from Ebay, you'd have all the information needed to get a full refund. It really is easy for most happy people.
Thanks for making it easy for me. I don't want to make it easy for you.
You and that bob mcunluckie bloke should get together on a night out. What a night of fun that would be!
Posted on: 22 September 2006 by TomK
quote:Originally posted by count.d:
It had died off, my post was three days ago. If you want to continue digging your embarrassing hole, keep diggin.
I don't wish to help you as I think you're an arrogant git and have always been so. Let's just say if you bought from Ebay, you'd have all the information needed to get a full refund. It really is easy for most happy people.
Thanks for making it easy for me. I don't want to make it easy for you.
You and that bob mcunluckie bloke should get together on a night out. What a night of fun that would be!
*********
Cheers.
In Moderation
Adam Meredith
Posted on: 23 September 2006 by Mick P
Tom
Your initial posting which started this thread was quite frankly, plain stupid.
Count'd gave you a forthright reply and then 3 or 4 days later you come back saying he had replied and not let the thread die off. You are the one keeping it alive for no apparent reason.
Also your use of four lettered language is not appreciated on this forum.
You have projected an image of being mean, inarticulate and frankly not very bright.
Regards
Mick
Your initial posting which started this thread was quite frankly, plain stupid.
Count'd gave you a forthright reply and then 3 or 4 days later you come back saying he had replied and not let the thread die off. You are the one keeping it alive for no apparent reason.
Also your use of four lettered language is not appreciated on this forum.
You have projected an image of being mean, inarticulate and frankly not very bright.
Regards
Mick