Naim DAC

quote:

Originally posted by Flame:
Is the digital out the only way the new CDX2 will differ from the current one?

Sorry to disagree with Patrick F, but Doug said yesterday that they had also made other changes also and reworked some of the circuitry.

quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy Marchant:
Doug Graham emphasised the unit's universality. I'm sure your question was asked last night, but I didn't understand the answer. My strong impression is that you can't plug the Mac, say, directly into the DAC, but you can create a network containing both components. This will enable you to 'stream' (Doug's word) content into the DAC from any compatible source.

Sounds like it is uPnP compatible but without being able to directly control what is playing like the Uniti. Thats disappointing as the software for uPnP are pretty poor and means you couldnt use it as a upgrade for a Sky box, DVD player etc

yes i do remember that now.

Actually, I disagree with the opinion regarding the CDPs. Many people want the external DAC option, but don't want to give up their CDPs and use a streaming device for music they already own.

The commbination allows:

1. Use of your current CD collection and any further purchases.

2. Upgrade of the CDX2 with the external DAC.

3. Use of the external DAC with another device for any download purchases.

This just makes things more versatile for those with CD collections who want to use them in their current form and will deal with DA going forward as more things either 16 bit wav (flac, etc...) or 24 bit become available.

Can someone just remind me how much the DAC will cost please? And whether it'll run from regular power or if a *cap is mandatory?

Steve.

quote:

Originally posted by AllenB:
Maybe it's the cynic in me , but it doesn't say much for the DAC / output circuits in the CDP if it's so easily upgraded by adding the DAC. Is anyone seriously going to pay over £2k for a CDP to act as a transport? Dare I say it, the same could be said of the HDX, but at least you are getting the ripper, etc albeit at a big premium.

Let me speak for the cuddly bear in you:

Naim are still selling a considerable number of CD players, at all levels, to customers whose present choice it is to improve their CD replay and who may or may not have any present interest in ripping their CDs.

At a later date these customers may well find that they have several digital devices - all of which could benefit from connection to an external (Naim) DAC. They look into buying one and, joy of joys, discover that they can also use this to improve their already splendid CDX2.

I think only a very strange person would seriously think of connecting a CDX2 to their DAC as the DAC's only digital input.

Dare I say - it's an extra.

And - I think you'll find that the CD player's internal DAC was not "so easily upgraded". It has taken a long time (and some) to produce a DAC that might be able to achieve this.

So will there be a CDS3 with a digital output that could connect to the DAC?

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bull:
Can someone just remind me how much the DAC will cost please? And whether it'll run from regular power or if a *cap is mandatory?

£1950 was the price stated yesterday, if I remember rightly.
It has its own internal psu, but, as reported in this thread, performance is improved by adding an XPS or 555PS.

Will there be a model over the 2000£?

More sensibly, will there be a model at half the price?

ATB from george

How can Naim charge 1950£ for a DAC? Well, Naim sure takes a real deal of money just for the brand..

Not out of me they won't.

For the first in time in years i am not comfortable to buy naim gear without listening.

New speakers approach that invalidates previous approach (close to back wall), DACs when naim always said that it was not good solution to have external DACs, etc, etc

I will just enjoy what i have.

(well maybe the 552 i can buy blind )

quote:

Originally posted by GFFJ:
More sensibly, will there be a model at half the price?

ATB from george

Now that will be an impulse buy!

John

quote:

How can Naim charge 1950£ for a DAC?

Personally I'm glad they are trying to keep the price down; I've no wish pay more.

I am with Howard on this.

If they produced a machine priced as a CD5i then it would be compelling.

Otherwise there is not enough difference between digital to analogue converters to justify me paying three times the price that I did pay for my Lavry DA 10 for the sake of what Naim do so well.

I did not think the HDX represented a satisfactory level of VFM for me - well to be painfully straight forward it was simply too expensive full stop.

Now two grand, well it might be afforded one day, but it is going to have to be revolutionary-good to make such a cost seem viable VFM for me and I imagine not a few others.

As Eriksen said in Monserat's "Cruel Sea,"

"It's getting to be a different sort of War you know. We cannot afford to just be nice any more. I will be as nice a pie when its all over, but right now we have another sweep to get on with ..."

VFM is going to be crucial for a while now I think. Or else many will look and wish, and no more ...

ATB from George

quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy Marchant:
£1950 was the price stated yesterday, if I remember rightly.

Actually it was £1999, I remember since the way Doug said it was "Nineteen, Ninety Nine" and some wag behind me say "cor! twenty quid, a bargain"

quote:

Originally posted by AllenB:
That tends to imply one singular model, i.e. no high end model, and in a blooming 5 series case as well?

So they're still persisting with this are they...? Hmmmm....So you put your little thin cased DAC next to your full sized CDX2 (with bolted on SPDIF) or HDX for that matter...Should look good on a Fraim

SO, I guess the Naim only debates start: Which is better, a CDX2 with external DAC or a HDX with and without said DAC....

I'm really not sure about how this DAC is being put forward...If the dig out on the CDX2 is only going to be available on new machines, I find it hard to believe they are going to fly off the shelves...Anybody with an ounce of sense is just going to get the DAC and sort out their own source to the DAC (most likely computer) or indeed if the money is available then the HDX if you want the best of both worlds (although I find it slightly disconcerting one suddenly needs an additional DAC to make the £4.5k HDX sound 'right')....

It seems to me the DAC is being offered to the marketplace (because they just can't not) rather sheepishly and still bent round to CDP's and all things Naim (although I have no problem with the latter, in essence)....Why not show it off to it's full extent? As already pointed out, why no computer source? Come on, we all know how this DAC is mostly going to be used...Why not show it ? Ignoring the fact that computers exist I would understand if a Naim streamer was in existence or being developed, but not a murmur....

Taking a DAC around the country and linking up to a £3.5k CDP and £4.5k HD/Ripper is essentially preaching to the converted...Show it off with an iMac or more, and you might have more of the masses twittering....No?

Steve

Have we confirmed that this DAC is not going to be a network streamer as well?

A network streamer would do away with SP/DIF and all the issues associated with external connectivity to a DAC. Something similar to the Slim Transporter would be the best of both worlds.

quote:

Originally posted by SC:
Taking a DAC around the country and linking up to a £3.5k CDP and £4.5k HD/Ripper is essentially preaching to the converted...Show it off with an iMac or more, and you might have more of the masses twittering....No?

Steve

maybe they are concerned about how it sounds why not give naim the benefit of the doubt(at least until you hear it)
their track record is fairly decent

Bob

Bob

Bob - I'm more than sure it sounds f*^$**! amazing - I would expect it to, hence being a Naim fan....

However, this wasn't the point being made...

quote:

Originally posted by Flame:
Is the digital out the only way the new CDX2 will differ from the current one?

Patrick F's answer,

yes.


So can it be retro fitted to older cdx2's then?

If not,why not?

Although I think the cdx2's dac is a very fine one and the machine gains so much with a power supply upgrade why do we even need a dac with a cdx2?

I would like a great dac for digital replay via cds,iPlayer and Spotify, the later two via pc, heck I might even want to the listen to music downloads!

If naim can now make cd players with a didital out without compromise to there musical ability,would be possible to make one with a digital input?

A Unity REF source component say with a tradition pre/power,three boxes of joy? or am I barking up the wrong tree.

ps sorry four or five boxes,forgot the obligatory power supply upgrades.

quote:

Originally posted by JYOW:
Have we confirmed that this DAC is not going to be a network streamer as well?

Cymbiosis posted a picture of the rear of the DAC from the Munich High End 2009.

I hope it is OK that I borrow your picture mr Cymbiosis
Rear of DAC picture

It doesn't show any ethernet connections, just Toslinks and RCA's and Din.

So if no major changes have been made in the mean time, I would say it is a safe guess to say it does not have a streamer onboard.

But to avoid all this guessing, hoping, wishing and generalising, it would be nice to have the specs when a new product is announced.
I can understand that all the Naim people have been extremely busy, but it would avoid a lot of confusion.

Concerning the price, £2000 is a lot but if it has true audiophile quality (and would expect so if it can better the CD2X) it should be worth it. The quality of components and component matching appears to improve on CD2X so might be approaching CDS3 (or CD555? ).

I know at least there DAC's out there that come at even higher prices.

-
Aleg

quote:

I know at least there DAC's out there that come at even higher prices.

There are many DACs in the £2,000 range and beyond. Off the top of my head I can think of the excellent Ensemble DAC, Weiss Minerva or Medea, 47Labs, Lessloss, Lavry Gold, Esoteric, EMMLabs, Audionote, DCS, Wavelength, Chord... It goes on.

But I am mostly interested in hearing the Naim solution.

quote:

Originally posted by Gary S.:

quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy Marchant:
£1950 was the price stated yesterday, if I remember rightly.

Actually it was £1999, I remember since the way Doug said it was "Nineteen, Ninety Nine" and some wag behind me say "cor! twenty quid, a bargain"

Damn, it's gone up already. I knew people inferring it was a bargain would do us no good.