3.1 soon to become 5.1

Max;

Congratulations in advance. I think you will enjoy what your lovely setup has to offer. The addition of the rear speakers is going to add ambience and realism to movies. I remember the first time I ever heard a 5.1 setup and the sensation of being in the middle of the action was mesmerizing. I've tried 2.1, 3.1 and 5.1 setups and I can assure you that the small investment you've made in the N-sats (in relation to the rest of the system) is going to reward u big time. Looking forward to hearing your input once you've test driven everything

Regards...

Flame,
thanks. I seem to move in cycles from stereo to surround, then to stereo again...But this time it's black boxes, it should last more than usual.
Actually, I expect much enjoyment from DVDs of concerts - I have a few, and they're great: Diana Krall, James Taylor, Keith Jarrett, The King's Singers, not to mention the Beatles Anthology...
All to be replayed all over again.
Regards.

Does anybody find moving from 3.1 to 5.1 screws up their listening pleasure of straight CDs? Just about to invest in an N-Sat system and I'm worried about the back sound when I play CDs. Any advice?

quote:

Originally posted by Chris Paling:
Does anybody find moving from 3.1 to 5.1 screws up their listening pleasure of straight CDs? Just about to invest in an N-Sat system and I'm worried about the back sound when I play CDs. Any advice?

I went the other way ... having had a 5.1 set-up for more than seven years (using a Pioneer AV receiver), I've recently purchased a SuperNait in order to improve the hi-fi side but, without the AV2, now find I can get 5.1 only by playing the CD in the DVD player (i.e. still through the AV receiver).

Basically, this is not a problem ... I accepted this limitation as I wanted the Naim amp but I do have a number of CDs which are encoded for Dolby Surround playback and they do (or perhaps: did) sound good.

But for the majority, the 2.1 sound (I have only SMALL speakers thus need the SW in the mix) is the best way to go anyway. Before the SN, using my AV receiver to do everything, I would set this on DIRECT for almost everything; the few Dolby Surround encoded discs being the exception, but I would usually also play classical music on the HALL-1 setting and sometimes jazz on the JAZZ setting, each of which bring in the rear and centre speakers.

So for me the "reduction" to 2.1 simply means I don't have need to choose DIRECT.

For some discs the splitting (or is it duplication?) of the signal to feed the rear speakers, etc. really does foul up the sound. I don't think there is a general rule and many discs may play fine on 5.1 even if they carry no indication that they are so suited. You will lean by experience which sound you prefer.

May I suggest you try out a compilation album on 5.1: if the tracks are from different recording times then the effect, track to track, can be quite noticeable.

One issue of concern I had when looking at the AV2 is that the manual indicates you can't get the SW in play when you have the setting as DIRECT (see table 10.5 p18) ... this has meant I am unlikely to go the AV2 route much as I would like to.

That's useful. Looking forward to Mabertolas review of the Nsats. Does anybody know if the N-Vi has an easy switchable option between 3.1 and 5.1? I can't find one in the manual. Seems that once speakers are set up for 5.1 that's what you get each time you use a CD or DVD. And really stupid question. I need the exact height of the N-SAt centre. It says 160 on the Naim website. I have 157 clearance where I want to locate it. Anybody with a tape measure out there on this rainy day?

quote:

Originally posted by Chris Paling:
... Does anybody know if the N-Vi has an easy switchable option between 3.1 and 5.1? I can't find one in the manual. Seems that once speakers are set up for 5.1 that's what you get each time you use a CD or DVD...

I'm confused by the use of the "3.1" - am I missing something as I thought it was "2.1" - i.e. two front speakers plus SubWoofer.

Re: the n-Vi playing Stereo, rather than 5.1, do sections 7.5.1/2 of the manual not cover this (albeit very limited text) or is this only for DVD playback? If you are forced to have 5.1 playback for all CDs then I think this is an issue which Naim should address/comment upon.

I assumed those sections were only for DVD playback but I'll speak the the dealer tomorrow. There's a "mode" swicth which might be an easy way of pre-programming between the 2 but it's beyong me and I don;t want to screw up the existing settings. I'm a bit unclear about 3.1 but I'll prob be running 2 n-sats, a sub and a centre - perhaps that's 4.1.

A very quick reply before getting into a detailed covering of my first weeks' impressions.
When you setup a 5.1 system, you have a number of options even for CD replay only: first, most important in the eyes of the many, you connect your DVD5 via analogue out (AN1) to the analogue input of the AV2, and you select >direct<: this way, your DVD5 is converting and the AVw2 sends the result (pure stereo CD replay) to the final stages, just under volume control. Second, you use the >digital< output and input with a caxial cable, and you have the AV2 converting - but still select >stereo<, and nothing more or else than the sole 2 stereo channels of the CD being replayed are heard.
Last, you can choose - in a very limited range of options - to spread artificially the stereo CD tracks over the 6 channels, selecting >NeoDts<, but it's nothing more than an option. You can have the room full of speakers and yet listen to only the front ones, L and R.
Shortly my impressions of a full 5.1 system - mine: DVD5, Analogue and digital connections, AV2, 200, 175, n-center, SBLs, n-Sats.

Cheers.

Really, very important though not obvious, it seems: nothing in a 5.1 system prevents you from listening to pure stereo. The full setting is available ONLY with movies, music DVDs (with 5,1 Dolby Digital) or if you force surround to stereo sources.
Stereo replay remains stereo replay, and I anticipate that the DVD5/AV2 - though somewhat slow to understand and setup - is VERY well thought and set, volumes and balances being very satisfieing just out of the box.

Detailed report follows!

quote:

Originally posted by maxbertola:
Really, very important though not obvious, it seems: nothing in a 5.1 system prevents you from listening to pure stereo. The full setting is available ONLY with movies, music DVDs (with 5,1 Dolby Digital) or if you force surround to stereo sources.
Stereo replay remains stereo replay, and I anticipate that the DVD5/AV2 - though somewhat slow to understand and setup - is VERY well thought and set, volumes and balances being very satisfieing just out of the box.

Detailed report follows!

I'm afraid there is some confusion here ... probably mine ... but to clarify: maxbertola, you're discussing the DVD5~AV2 setup whilst Chris is discussing the n-Vi.

Are the sound options the same? I would not be surprised if there are more options with the AV2 route. I don't know as I own neither the AV2 or n-Vi. But I do own and have used for 7+ years an AV Receiver and this has numerous settings which can be employed with any source.

Of course, you only get 5.1 proper sound with a suitable source and that is the problem. If you force a 2 channel CD through 5.1 then it can sound a little off (it depends).

So the point I was making was: does the n-Vi allow you to select the 2 channel (perhaps 2.1 if you need the SW as I do) option - as Chris is asking - or are you forced to accept 5.1 for CD replay?

Indeed. That's my question. I'll find out tomorrow and report back on the N-vi.

I'm sorry for my misunderstanding. On the other hand, being the n-Vi - I believe: I hope I'm not making any more confusion - just a one-box DVD player+Processor+multichannel amplifier, I would be very much surprised if it hadn't the same options as any separate receiver. I really can't see why Naim should put in commerce a box that forced CD stereo replay into fake 5.1 sound.
But, you can surely verify this more accurately in this forum.

Cheers.

Ok, I re-read the previous mail carefully and now I have a feeling I mixed it all up. Never mind my replies, I must be in need of some vacation.

Chaps, I pretty much 100% confident that the n-Vi will give you the same possible decode options as a DVD5/AV2 combo, or indeed the majority of any other AVRs....Have a look on page 20 of the manual, and the tables tell you the surround options available as per source type and decode option selected...The norm with stereo (and with a sub available) would be 2.1, or selecting Dolby PLII or DTS Neo you would get 5.1.

3.1 (including the centre only and not surrounds) is more of an unusual situation (although there is Dolby material out there recorded as such)..the simply way I can think of to achieve this is to instruct the n-Vi (or any AVR) that there are no surround speakers present in the preference set-up, by simply selecting None.

To your original point Chris, about whether suddenly 'missing' the surround feeling affects the enjoyment of a more simple 'stereo' set up (or even 3.1) I do think there is a slight element of that...I have a number of 5.1 DVD-A re-mastered versions of albums which I love (just great hearing different small sounds coming from different directions), and along with a liking of DVD live material in 5.1, I would always notice when the surround speakers fell silent when going back to stereo etc....and I admit, I would often put one of the pseudo surround modes on if I was playing stereo material from my AppleTV into a Marantz AVR....However, saying that, I believe a well set up stereo system can and should be as or more engaging a sound than an average surround set-up.....

Finally, do you already have the n-Vi or are you thinking about it...?

Steve

SC,
this is more or less the reply I'd have given were it not for the slight confusion made..
This is my second surround system, and I have a certain experience with decoding options and settings; I probably have not fully understood the questions.

Can you tell me how I recognize if my DVD5 has the extra card for DVD-Audio? I simply feed one into the drawer and read the display, or what?

Thanks,
Massimo

Hi Guys,

I think that answers al lof my questions (sorry to hi-jack this post). In reply to Steve I have an N-vi and this morning I'm going to listen to a set of NSats at the dealer's. I'm currently using B + W Cdm 7 SEs and although they sound ok I think there's something missing. They have to be cranked up loud to get them to sound really good - and they've always been a bit tiring to listen to over long periods. I have high hopes for the NSats but will prob sell 2 of the 4 as I don't intend to have full surround.
Chris P

Chris, once you play a cd on the n-vi and have set it up for 2-1 ie stereo + sub it should stay in the memory, it not just select what sound out-put you require with the mode switch on the remote,

Great. many thanks. Just picked up my N-sat set up so be interested to see Maxbertola's review. Only connected the N-sats to the N-vi and not the sub yet but they're fantastically immediate speakers. Certainly need the sub for the bass though. Only using one of the N-sat pair so one pair will be sold (unopened, black lacquer, siver grills).

Great stuff Chris - Enjoy ! Get that sub connected up (I presume you got the n-Sub ?), the Sats will start sounding more like speakers then...!

Did you get the n-Stands for the Sats ?!

Yup - got the n-sub. It looks like a beast and really can't wait to plug it into the system. Awaiting set up and calibration by the dealer. Also got the n-stands. Everything looks great but not entirely convinced by the silver grilles. I think I'll try and get hold of a set of black ones for the sats and centre.

Get in there and enjoy Chris, no need to wait for the dealer...It's your ears ! Great thing about the n-Sub is the ability to store a number of presets...

Funny, personally I've always thought the silver grills looked better than the black cloth, but then again, I seem to be the only person in Naim land that thought the speakers should have been available in white...!

Good job you got the stands in time !

Have fun...and let us all know how it goes once you have everything set up...

Steve

I'm working on it Stu...!

Well, got the sub set up and the two fronts with a new set of cables. They sound v good but it will take time to balance the sub in the room. One question about the n-vi I don't know if you technical chaps can help me with. My son plugs his Ipod into the front via the small jack but for some reason the front input only plays through the small n-sats and not the sub. The n-sub logo remains in outline on the diagram which shows the amp can see it but is not sending anything to it. Any ideas how I can get the Ipod output to the sub too? Next step, setting up the surrounds.

Chris, i had that once with my n-vi, showed up on the front but no sound from the sub, think it was to do with the bass-mix setting in the setup menu

Thanks John. I'll check bass-mix setting. Trying to tune the sub to the room. Do you find with the sub you're always re-setting freq and gain depending on the music you're playing? I'm finding that older CDs (Springsteen etc) are quite thin and need much more gain with the freq set at 170 whereas newer stuff needs less with freq at around 250. Then, if you play clean acoustic female vocal stuff the bass just soaks all over everything and you have to notch it back. Need about 6 pre-sets ...