DAC and USB stick compatibility
Posted by: gav111n on 17 March 2010
Hello All,
I have been a naim owner for many years, forum ‘lurker’ for quite a while but 1st time poster.
I have recently bought a nDAC to run with a macbook pro as my source. This replaces my CD3.5/HC. I am very happy with the sound of the system out of the box but intend to squeeze the best out of the MBP by the various options that have been discussed here.
Last night I had a go at using a USB stick with ripped WAV files. When I inserted the 4GB Kingston stick into the nDAC the dock light came on, the memory stick did its flashing thing and then nothing. The function buttons on the nDAC would no work. Each button just momentarily flickered when I pressed it with no operation. If I pressed the dock button the light would not go out to undock the stick. So I just had to pull it out ‘live’. If I put the stick into the MBP, I can see the WAV files and play them with no problem. Back to the nDAC and I get the same problem.
The only other memory stick I could find at home was a cheapo unbranded one given to my wife at an exhibition. This works fine with the nDAC.
Has anyone else found the nDAC to have compatibility issues with USB sticks or might there be a fault with my unit? Or stick?
Gavin.
I have been a naim owner for many years, forum ‘lurker’ for quite a while but 1st time poster.
I have recently bought a nDAC to run with a macbook pro as my source. This replaces my CD3.5/HC. I am very happy with the sound of the system out of the box but intend to squeeze the best out of the MBP by the various options that have been discussed here.
Last night I had a go at using a USB stick with ripped WAV files. When I inserted the 4GB Kingston stick into the nDAC the dock light came on, the memory stick did its flashing thing and then nothing. The function buttons on the nDAC would no work. Each button just momentarily flickered when I pressed it with no operation. If I pressed the dock button the light would not go out to undock the stick. So I just had to pull it out ‘live’. If I put the stick into the MBP, I can see the WAV files and play them with no problem. Back to the nDAC and I get the same problem.
The only other memory stick I could find at home was a cheapo unbranded one given to my wife at an exhibition. This works fine with the nDAC.
Has anyone else found the nDAC to have compatibility issues with USB sticks or might there be a fault with my unit? Or stick?
Gavin.
Posted on: 17 March 2010 by gone
How is the USB stick formatted? HFS or FAT?
Posted on: 17 March 2010 by nitrous
Hi Gav, I'm using a Kingston stick (2GB) to listen to the new Peter Gabriel album, wihtout problems. But, sometimes I put the stick in the front and it fails to read/play so I just pull it out and it has usually plays the second time.
I have also used a brand new HP stick, no problems.
It could be that your stick has a 'build-up' of files from past use. Try and wipe it and reload. What I have found with camera cards is that 'shadows' of files seem to build up and cause problems.
If using a Mac, make sure you empty the trash when you delete from the memory stick whilst the stick is still in the computer otherwise the files will not be deleted off the stick, although you won't 'see' them they are still there.
Hope this helps, nico
I have also used a brand new HP stick, no problems.
It could be that your stick has a 'build-up' of files from past use. Try and wipe it and reload. What I have found with camera cards is that 'shadows' of files seem to build up and cause problems.
If using a Mac, make sure you empty the trash when you delete from the memory stick whilst the stick is still in the computer otherwise the files will not be deleted off the stick, although you won't 'see' them they are still there.
Hope this helps, nico
Posted on: 17 March 2010 by MacMan
I have put some ripped WAV files on a ScanDisk stick. When I put it in the nDac it begin to play, but at the end of the second file a horrible hum come and then the DAC stop reading.
this file has been download on then naim site (free one)
Somebody else have got this problem?
this file has been download on then naim site (free one)
Somebody else have got this problem?
Posted on: 17 March 2010 by gav111n
Hi Nero,
I did not know there was a variety of formats for USB sticks. It is just as delivered (as with any stick I have owned) and has been used successfully with XP and mac os x snow leopard.
How can I tell which format it is? Your question implies that the nDAC is picky about how the USB stick as been formatted?
Thanks,
Gavin
I did not know there was a variety of formats for USB sticks. It is just as delivered (as with any stick I have owned) and has been used successfully with XP and mac os x snow leopard.
How can I tell which format it is? Your question implies that the nDAC is picky about how the USB stick as been formatted?
Thanks,
Gavin
Posted on: 17 March 2010 by Thorsten_L
I have this problem of the "hissing" when there was a 24/96-hires file first and then comes a standard redbook file.
When all are in the same "format", all is fine.
I found the USB in the back more "flexible" in terms of compatibility.
When all are in the same "format", all is fine.
I found the USB in the back more "flexible" in terms of compatibility.
Posted on: 17 March 2010 by Thorsten_L
FAT32 makes no problems at all.
Posted on: 17 March 2010 by gone
quote:Originally posted by gav111n:
Hi Nero,
I did not know there was a variety of formats for USB sticks. It is just as delivered (as with any stick I have owned) and has been used successfully with XP and mac os x snow leopard.
How can I tell which format it is? Your question implies that the nDAC is picky about how the USB stick as been formatted?
Thanks,
Gavin
If it was just as you bought it, then it should work, as most USB sticks are FAT/FAT32 out of the box. I have used Kingston 1 and 2GB sticks without any problem, but always with the files in the root of the stick.
Posted on: 17 March 2010 by AMA
I found out that DAC only reads FAT/FAT32.
It does not read NTFS and exFAT.
My 64GB Transcend JetFlash got useless.
It does not read NTFS and exFAT.
My 64GB Transcend JetFlash got useless.
Posted on: 17 March 2010 by gav111n
Thanks for everyones thoughts.
I have tried another Kingston stick. A 1GB this time and I have the same problem. I can't use it.
If I format either stick as FAT32 or a mac format on the MBP and copy wav files (to the root with no other files present), the nDAC just lights up a few random buttons and does not operate until I remove the stick.
If I format either stick as FAT or FAT32 on my PC then it is a bit hit and miss whether the nDAC will read it. If the nDAC is able to see the music files and then I add more files from the MBP then the nDAC definitely won't operate.
So of 3 memory sticks, I can only really use one. I don't want to experiment with the 'good one' in case that falls over.
It's strange, because all sticks work fine with both the MBP and PC. They also work fine to deliver music to my £50 radio with a USB socket!
It's not the end of the world. I did not buy the nDAC to use memory sticks all of time but it feels like it's going to be a bit of an art to get this to work.
I'll post again if I have a breakthrough.
Gavin.
I have tried another Kingston stick. A 1GB this time and I have the same problem. I can't use it.
If I format either stick as FAT32 or a mac format on the MBP and copy wav files (to the root with no other files present), the nDAC just lights up a few random buttons and does not operate until I remove the stick.
If I format either stick as FAT or FAT32 on my PC then it is a bit hit and miss whether the nDAC will read it. If the nDAC is able to see the music files and then I add more files from the MBP then the nDAC definitely won't operate.
So of 3 memory sticks, I can only really use one. I don't want to experiment with the 'good one' in case that falls over.
It's strange, because all sticks work fine with both the MBP and PC. They also work fine to deliver music to my £50 radio with a USB socket!
It's not the end of the world. I did not buy the nDAC to use memory sticks all of time but it feels like it's going to be a bit of an art to get this to work.
I'll post again if I have a breakthrough.
Gavin.
Posted on: 17 March 2010 by JYOW
of the three USB sticks I tried, I had problem with one slightly older 2GB generic brand stick. The other two (32GB Kingston and 8GB Sandisk) worked fine.
Sometimes I do have to unplug and reinsert and push some buttons to get it working, but generally they worked if I put only WAV files in the sticks in the root folder or with only one single folder.
Sometimes I do have to unplug and reinsert and push some buttons to get it working, but generally they worked if I put only WAV files in the sticks in the root folder or with only one single folder.
Posted on: 17 March 2010 by Thorsten_L
I have to delete my findings:
I formatted my stick with the two different formats (Hires + redbook) and all is fine.
So it was a glitch on the USB-stick.
I formatted my stick with the two different formats (Hires + redbook) and all is fine.
So it was a glitch on the USB-stick.
Posted on: 18 March 2010 by Thorsten_L
With these I really had not one "fall-out".
Posted on: 18 March 2010 by J The Kop
I am new to Digital Audio. Is WAV format sound any different from Apple Lossless format? Most of my songs are in Apple Lossless and get it wireless via Airport Express to Naim DAC.
J.
J.
Posted on: 19 March 2010 by Aleg
quote:Originally posted by J The Kop:
I am new to Digital Audio. Is WAV format sound any different from Apple Lossless format? Most of my songs are in Apple Lossless and get it wireless via Airport Express to Naim DAC.
J.
It's another way of organising the bits in the file and adding the headers with meta-information.
Apple Lossless (ALAC) is a compressed format. WAV is the native audio format for Windows and is uncompressed. Another very common format you will encounter is FLAC which is also compressed and lossless, but geared towards Windows and difficult to play well on Apple.
All are lossless and can be easily converted from one to another using dbPoweramp Music Converter on PC or XLD on Mac.
The Naim DAC only supports WAV-playing from the USB-connection. All other formats have to played by a mediaplayer/streamer and presented to the DAC over the S/PDIF COAX or TOSLINK Optical connections.
Hope this guides you a bit.
-
aleg
Posted on: 19 March 2010 by J The Kop
Thx Aleg, I will try USB stick with WAV, if it would sound better than ALAC .
J.
J.
Posted on: 19 March 2010 by Thorsten_L
Honestly, I am simply AMAZED how good a cheap USB-stick can sound into the nDAC...wonderful...
I tested many CDs via redbook-blank and USB-stick...both are fantastic in their own way...
I tested many CDs via redbook-blank and USB-stick...both are fantastic in their own way...
Posted on: 19 March 2010 by gav111n
Hi Thorsten_Lux,
Forgive my ignorance, but what does redbook-blank mean and how are you testing that way of presenting the data to the DAC?
Gavin.
Forgive my ignorance, but what does redbook-blank mean and how are you testing that way of presenting the data to the DAC?
Gavin.
Posted on: 20 March 2010 by Thorsten_L
I meant standard 16/44.1-CDs vs USB-stick.
Posted on: 21 April 2010 by STJimmy
quote:Originally posted by gav111n:
Hello All,
I have been a naim owner for many years, forum ‘lurker’ for quite a while but 1st time poster.
I have recently bought a nDAC to run with a macbook pro as my source. This replaces my CD3.5/HC. I am very happy with the sound of the system out of the box but intend to squeeze the best out of the MBP by the various options that have been discussed here.
Last night I had a go at using a USB stick with ripped WAV files. When I inserted the 4GB Kingston stick into the nDAC the dock light came on, the memory stick did its flashing thing and then nothing. The function buttons on the nDAC would no work. Each button just momentarily flickered when I pressed it with no operation. If I pressed the dock button the light would not go out to undock the stick. So I just had to pull it out ‘live’. If I put the stick into the MBP, I can see the WAV files and play them with no problem. Back to the nDAC and I get the same problem.
The only other memory stick I could find at home was a cheapo unbranded one given to my wife at an exhibition. This works fine with the nDAC.
Has anyone else found the nDAC to have compatibility issues with USB sticks or might there be a fault with my unit? Or stick?
Gavin.
Hi, Gavin,
I have exactly the same problem as your. I used a toshiba USB stick. Have you solve out your problem?
JW
Posted on: 21 April 2010 by pcstockton
quote:Originally posted by Aleg:
The Naim DAC only supports WAV-playing from the USB-connection. All other formats have to played by a mediaplayer/streamer and presented to the DAC over the S/PDIF COAX or TOSLINK Optical connections.
An iPhone will play MP3s from the USB input. It is my understanding that the USB from the iPhone is sending unadulterated digital, so the Naim DAC must be able to play those as well.
Trying with a memory stick right now.
Oh, and I have had no problems at all with other things on the stick. Both of mine work just fine with tons of other stuff on them.
Files were still placed in the root directory though.
-patrick
Posted on: 21 April 2010 by pcstockton
No MP3 from USB Stick. But it does play from the iPhone on USB. Just checked both.
Maybe the USB from iPhone is not actually getting the raw data.
If the iPhone is converting it first it would explain why the WAV only USB input plays MP3s. Also it explains why I am unable to get lossless streaming using the iPhone connected to the USB.
No matter to me, I dont listen to MP3s (except on my iPhone), and I dont plan on using the USB for anything.
Lastly, one reason why the USB input "sounds better" to some people is because it plays noticeably louder than spdif.
I just played the same track on Foobar (without RP gain or anything), and from the memory stick. Both sounded identical once the usb stick volume was reduced.
-patrick
Maybe the USB from iPhone is not actually getting the raw data.
If the iPhone is converting it first it would explain why the WAV only USB input plays MP3s. Also it explains why I am unable to get lossless streaming using the iPhone connected to the USB.
No matter to me, I dont listen to MP3s (except on my iPhone), and I dont plan on using the USB for anything.
Lastly, one reason why the USB input "sounds better" to some people is because it plays noticeably louder than spdif.
I just played the same track on Foobar (without RP gain or anything), and from the memory stick. Both sounded identical once the usb stick volume was reduced.
-patrick
Posted on: 21 April 2010 by ferenc
quote:Originally posted by STJimmy:quote:Originally posted by gav111n:
Hello All,
I have been a naim owner for many years, forum ‘lurker’ for quite a while but 1st time poster.
I have recently bought a nDAC to run with a macbook pro as my source. This replaces my CD3.5/HC. I am very happy with the sound of the system out of the box but intend to squeeze the best out of the MBP by the various options that have been discussed here.
Last night I had a go at using a USB stick with ripped WAV files. When I inserted the 4GB Kingston stick into the nDAC the dock light came on, the memory stick did its flashing thing and then nothing. The function buttons on the nDAC would no work. Each button just momentarily flickered when I pressed it with no operation. If I pressed the dock button the light would not go out to undock the stick. So I just had to pull it out ‘live’. If I put the stick into the MBP, I can see the WAV files and play them with no problem. Back to the nDAC and I get the same problem.
The only other memory stick I could find at home was a cheapo unbranded one given to my wife at an exhibition. This works fine with the nDAC.
Has anyone else found the nDAC to have compatibility issues with USB sticks or might there be a fault with my unit? Or stick?
Gavin.
Hi, Gavin,
I have exactly the same problem as your. I used a toshiba USB stick. Have you solve out your problem?
JW
Actually if you reformat the non-working USB stick you can make it work. I tried at least 20 different sticks and found only two (no name, got them free of charge as a marketing material from different companies) 1 GB memory which did not work for the first time. One of them was reformatted on my Mac as FAT32, did not work, so I reformatted on a Windows notebook, same FAT32 then it worked. The other one did work after the first reformat. No other problem since. Works perfectly well and I think in case of the Naim DAC, the USB stick is the perfect transport mechanism. I got a new Transcend USB2 card reader recently, I will try this week-end if using a card reader and other type of cards like SDHC and CF work at all or make any difference. I think (got a feeling) it will not work, but try it anyway.
Posted on: 22 April 2010 by gav111n
Hi JW,
No, I did not solve my USB stick problem. I can not consistently use either of the Kingston sticks.
My experience is not the same as ferenc. If you look back at my previous comments, I did reformat the sticks to various formats on both a pc (Win XP) and MBP without much success. Anything I did with the Mac would render the sticks unreadable by the nDAC. I could sometimes get them to work by reformatting on the pc, but if I added or deleted music then the nDAC would often not ‘see’ the stick again.
I have had no problem with the unbranded free USB stick.
I have not pursued this much further because I play music from my MBP via a HiFace with DC1(BNC-BNC) and have found this combination to be an improvement over the sound from the USB stick. I know this seems to swim against the tide of most posts here but that’s what I find.
In addition, I have found the opposite to PCStockton’s point. In my arrangement, the USB stick is considerably quieter than MBP>HiFace>DC1(BNC-BNC). If I increase the volume of the USB stick, I still prefer MBP>HiFace combination. Perhaps I am a bit of an ‘outlier’, for example, I am struggling to get excited about the sound from PureMusic player over iTunes!
Gavin.
No, I did not solve my USB stick problem. I can not consistently use either of the Kingston sticks.
My experience is not the same as ferenc. If you look back at my previous comments, I did reformat the sticks to various formats on both a pc (Win XP) and MBP without much success. Anything I did with the Mac would render the sticks unreadable by the nDAC. I could sometimes get them to work by reformatting on the pc, but if I added or deleted music then the nDAC would often not ‘see’ the stick again.
I have had no problem with the unbranded free USB stick.
I have not pursued this much further because I play music from my MBP via a HiFace with DC1(BNC-BNC) and have found this combination to be an improvement over the sound from the USB stick. I know this seems to swim against the tide of most posts here but that’s what I find.
In addition, I have found the opposite to PCStockton’s point. In my arrangement, the USB stick is considerably quieter than MBP>HiFace>DC1(BNC-BNC). If I increase the volume of the USB stick, I still prefer MBP>HiFace combination. Perhaps I am a bit of an ‘outlier’, for example, I am struggling to get excited about the sound from PureMusic player over iTunes!
Gavin.
Posted on: 23 April 2010 by js
When you try the reformat, de-select 'quick reformat'. Helps om some setups in general as it's better whiped as opposed to defiled.
Cards through a reader should work if FAT32 but may be dependent on the reader.
PC, the Iphone does the decoding to wav(ish) for it's own or the Ndac in this instance.
Cards through a reader should work if FAT32 but may be dependent on the reader.
PC, the Iphone does the decoding to wav(ish) for it's own or the Ndac in this instance.
Posted on: 30 April 2010 by Michael Ackermann
quote:
... One of them was reformatted on my Mac as FAT32, did not work, so I reformatted on a Windows notebook, same FAT32 then it worked. ...
OSX users who use Disk Utility to reformat USB sticks should note that it is not only necessary to choose "FAT32" as the file system type, but also necessary to choose "master boot record" as the "partition table" type. I believe the default within Disk Utility is "GUID" partition table, which the Uniti (and I assume the DAC as well) does not like.
The option to change the partition table is located on the partition tab, under the "Options" button.