Help me - I don't get it

Life's too short AND there's an incredible amount of good music out there.
Personally I've just gone for it this year and bought an amazing amount of new and old stuff, really liking most of it; because I've stopped thinking about whether I ought to like it. Maybe the Millenium thing had to do with all those lists - 100 greatest albums of the century etc (sorry ROTF) which probably put more people off than turned them on. As Nigel said, forget it if it doesn't work.

Bands like the Dead probably only make sense in a context which is hard to grasp 40 years on. Nothing wrong with trying, but maybe Wilco make more sense in 2007...

Hi ROTF (and all);

Actually, I got Anthem Of The Sun recently (HDCD); that's perhaps what stimulated my "I don't get it" post. Mars Hotel and Europe '72 I owned back in my college days on vinyl, maybe I'll try those again.

Rupert, now that you mention it, Wilco are one of those I don't get. As before, not for lack of trying!

quote:

Originally posted by Nigel Cavendish:
If you don't get, forget it.

Life's too short.

Couldn't agree more. I think threads about what you don't like are a waste personally, no offence intended.

There is a load of stuff out there to be discovered and enjoyed for the first time. Even back catalogue that passes us by first time around.

Steve

quote:

Which bits have you tried Chris?

Several bits gary but I couldn't name them now, and I certainly don't own them to check! Her voice is a huge stumbling block for me! My former brother-in-law played on one of her albums (he played glass harmonica, would you believe!) and said she was a real perfectionist.

Each to their own.

Hi Steve

It's not really about what I don't like, but more about music that I feel I could like, but don't quite get.

There is some music (one person in particular) that I am totally sure I'd never like and really wouldn't want to listen to, but he's in a small minority.

On the other hand an artist like Miles Davis is too well respected, not be considered worthy and yet I still don't get it. What's so great about Miles? I feel I'm missing out.

Of course, I could play safe - just as I know that I'm going to deplore anything by the person I alluded to above - there are other artists that I can safely buy without having heard the album - I know I'm going to like the new John Fogerty album (assuming it's not Blue Ridge Rangers II) and I know I'm going to like the next Mary Chapin Carpenter album (she's never released a duff record) and, of course, I'm going to think the next HMHB album is the album of the century (assuming they get up and make another album).

But Mr Davis ... there has to be a key for me to unlock the magic of his music or am I really a hopeless case?

ATB Rotf

Hi ROTF,

I think Mr Davis doesn't do it for you, that's fine. If you've tried his music a few times I agree with Nigel, forget it.

I know that some music is more accessible, that's different because there is usually a track or a passage that keeps you interested and you gradually acquire more as you repeat it. But if it does nothing at all after a few plays - why bother?

I tried my first MCC album, The Calling (thanks JN). I can say that at first I liked a track or two, then the rest fell into place. Any others of hers that I should try?

Steve

quote:

Originally posted by Steve S1:

quote:

Originally posted by Nigel Cavendish:
If you don't get, forget it.

Life's too short.

Couldn't agree more. I think threads about what you don't like are a waste personally, no offence intended.

There is a load of stuff out there to be discovered and enjoyed for the first time. Even back catalogue that passes us by first time around.

Steve

Steve,

I agree wholeheartedly - they're the dreariest threads around, and usually the most popular unfortunately.

But what Jeff started out by saying was that this was a thread for people who wanted help "getting" stuff, which I thought was a really good idea.

quote:

Originally posted by Chris Kelly:
Her voice is a huge stumbling block for me!

Fair enough. Play me anything by Anthony And The Johnsons and I'll be running screaming from the room.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve S1:
Hi ROTF,
I tried my first MCC album, The Calling (thanks JN). I can say that at first I liked a track or two, then the rest fell into place. Any others of hers that I should try?

Steve

Hi Steve

Come On Come On is my top MCC recommendation - I love this album except for one rather duff duet, which I generally skip. That still leaves 11 gems and He Thinks He'll Keep Her is a wonderful, powerful song. The title track is a gripping finale on the album. Mary really stretches herself on this record and succeeds.

Her second album is another superb record with my favourite MCC track This Shirt being the centrepiece. State of the Heart has no duff tracks - it's Mary at her most folkie although there are country-rock leanings. She blends the styles so well - Never Had It So Good, Quittin' Time, Something of a Dreamer and How Do are highlights on this fine recording.

Stones In The Road is very easy to listen to and enjoy, it's Mary at her most commercial.

Really you can't go wrong with MCC - she doesn't make poor albums. One her most interesting albums is Time Is the Great Gift; Sex Is the Great Equaliser; Love Is the Great Mystery - often abbreviated to Time*Sex*Love. Shooting Straight in the Dark was her break through album, though I prefer the records she made either side of it as mentioned above: State of the Heart and Come On Come On.

The Calling is probably her best work since Come On Come On and a great place to start.

I don't go to many concerts these days but there are four artists I do go to see when they come to my part of the country HMHB, Kate Rusby, Christy Moore and Mary Chapin Carpenter.

HTH Rotf

quote:

Originally posted by Gary Shaw:
Of course, if the voice grates on you, that's a bit of a problem ;-)

That's what Tom Waits fans refer to as "surface noise". Get past that, and (at least for Tom's work) there's a world of reward.

(liked the Sugarcubes, can't stand Bjork, not ashamed to admit she frightens me)

ROTF - regarding Miles - I assume you've tried "Kind of Blue"? If you have, and didn't like it, I doubt there's much chanc eyou'll get Miles. The only other album I'd suggest is "In a Silent Way" lovely, subtle fusion, with ear=bending guitar from John McLaughlin, gesturing towards ambient in parts.

Another favourite Miles CD is Filles de Kilimanjaro, but I doubt that would make a convert of you!

quote:

That's what Tom Waits fans refer to as "surface noise". Get past that, and (at least for Tom's work) there's a world of reward.

(liked the Sugarcubes, can't stand Bjork, not ashamed to admit she frightens me)

Funny you should say that jayd, as I've always struggled with Tom Waits - don't see the appeal - but love Bjork. Suggest we settle this with physical violence

quote:

Originally posted by ROTF:
On the other hand an artist like Miles Davis is too well respected, not be considered worthy and yet I still don't get it. What's so great about Miles? I feel I'm missing out.

But Mr Davis ... there has to be a key for me to unlock the magic of his music or am I really a hopeless case?

I think Davis is one of the greatest artist of all time, but there's no reason why everyone else should.

Out of interest, though, what have you tried. He had so many different periods and styles that I would have thought there's something, somewhere for most people.

Kind of Blue is probably my favourite disc, but I imagine you've tried that - I know other people who don't really care for it. His orchestral collaborations with Gil Evans are wonderful (partly for Evans' genius for orchestration) - Porgy and Bess and Sketches of Spain are my favourites. The band he had from 1965-68 with Herbie Hancock, Wayne Shorter, Ron Carter and Tony Williams was very fine (indeed, a jazz loving friend of mine maintains, and he has a point, that Miles's great skill was in picking side men) - perhaps the highlights disc from their Plugged Nickle sessions would be a good place to explore.

I don't know what you've tried from the fusion period, but In a Silent Way which is extremely beautiful and Jack Johnson are both worth a listen. The Cellar Door sessions (another set of live recordings) are also excellent, though it's not a cheap box, and so not a good place to try, but I think there may be a highlights disc of that too.

His later period in the 80s is, some would argue, a shadow of his former work, but I'm very fond of some of it: the cover of Time After Time from You're Under Arrest (though as a whole the album doesn't quite work). I'm also very fond of his final effort Doo-bop (were he was trying to join hip-hop with jazz).

But, as I say, there's no reason why you should like any of it, or feel that you're missing out if you don't. We all have different tastes (it would be awfully dull here if we didn't).


regards, Tam

Not fond of Bjork's voice, but she has something which allows me to overcome her actual sound! Better than the current crop of Pop music in any case!

ATB from Fredrik

PS: At one stage I just could not get "Play Dead" out of my head...

Mile's "Bitches Brew" is goin' down a little better tonight at lower volume under the headphones. Complex music sometimes works better for me at lower volumes, I can appreciate the continuity of the rhythms easier and there is "less" going on that is distracting me and giving me the sense I am hearing "noise". Anyway, enjoying it as I type.

One possibe entry to at least some of Miles' music is to try his compositional side, featured very nicely on a "tribute" album under Joe Henderson's name called "so near, so far (musings on Miles)" with JH on sax, John Scofield on guitar, Al Foster on drums and Dave Holland on bass - a little different "sound" as well without a trumpet part.

Bjork is next, I hope I am ready ....

Jeff A

With Miles Davis I have to concur with Tam I'd start with Kind Of Blue and that goes for The masterful John Coltrane and my personal favorite Sketches of Spain and avoid all the fusion stuff though you could build up to it at a later date.


Though the point of much of Davis and Coltrane was that they were investigating where music comes from internally and trying to express feelings instantly, to be in the moment to go where the mood/feeling takes you with your instrument it was Spiritual with Coltrane and I would say advance technique with Davis a sonic snapshot of the Musician at that place in time never to be repeated again and me as a listener I have to go with them, don't fight it, go with the flow MAN .



Dean...

quote:

Funny you should say that jayd, as I've always struggled with Tom Waits - don't see the appeal - but love Bjork. Suggest we settle this with physical violence

between tom and bjork?? or perhaps a joint album ....

quote:

Originally posted by droodzilla:
Suggest we settle this with physical violence

Bring it on, me boyo.

Although, fidelio's suggestion of letting Tom and Bjork duke it out has merit, not least of which is that we could put it on Pay-Per-View and make a fortune.

quote:

Originally posted by Gary Shaw:
if you like the Bjork I'll beat myself over the head with a stick of celery...and celebrate your eclecticness!

Well, ........
I am quite enjoying "Vespertine", ...... is it really that much of a stretch from Kate Bush and Tori Amos ? I have many of Tori, and only "Aerial" of Kate (though I have heard most all of her recordings) and to my recollection this is the first Bjork.

Don't know that I will be a big fan, but I like this very much and will at least try several others - and true to my original wish, you have given me an "entry".

I can see the possibilty of "Vespertine", at least,being in my music collection.

Thanks
Jeff A

quote:

Originally posted by jayd:
That's what Tom Waits fans refer to as "surface noise". Get past that, and (at least for Tom's work) there's a world of reward.

Jayd,
can you provide names of one or two to start off with, saw him recently on Conan and was intrigued, feels like the current release might be a bit much to start on. have always been put off by the musical press references to his "difficult" music and seemingly treating him as a deity.

it's my first, so be gentle

Jeff A

Madonna.

When you look beyond the personality cult I just cannot see any musical merit.

quote:

Originally posted by Jeff Anderson:
I can see the possibilty of "Vespertine", at least,being in my music collection.

OH-oh. Just looked in the fridge - we have a cucumber, but no celery so it's a trip to the supermarket...

But that's great Jeff, and it will grow as well.

Bitches Brew is one of those albums that, if I'm in the wrong mood I won't be able to finish a side, if the mood's right I can't get enough.

I think Aerial is Kate's best alongside Hounds Of Love. A Sky Of Honey is a match for The Ninth Wave.

quote:

Originally posted by Bruce Woodhouse:
Madonna.

When you look beyond the personality cult I just cannot see any musical merit.

Bruce


Madonna early 80's stuff was very cutsie pop orientated but I feel this was clever and later she started to express herself more intimately by writing about her upbringing and her sexual awakening which was quite radical for the time and it was all wrapped up with great production and was accessible to teenage girls no one woman had done that before. Young women are not supposed to be strong and opinionated and of course sexually aggressive. The 90's output she is in control of everything and has became an astute confident business woman and is taking her output to the extreme with the overtly sexual Justify My Love and Erotica period, the SEX book and trendy and cool with Vogue. Though lately you feel she hasn't matured and has run out of ideas lyrically in her mid 40's. She tried to get political with the American Life album which did not work very well, the musics good enough though. Her talent is working with great producers to keep her music of the time, Nile Rodgers, Shepp Pettibone, William Orbit and expressing for the first time that young women can be clever, beautiful and have control of their lives. Without Madonna you would not have a lot of the women singer songwriters like PJ Harvey, Alanis Morrisette, Tori Amos, Kd Lang and the like and popstars Beyonce, Lil Kim, even the Spice Girls now whether thats a good thing is up for debate but women in music could be more than pretty things singing Love songs. Top lady to me anyway as you can see I have a thing for Madonna.



Dean.

quote:

Originally posted by munch:
I have all Kates albums.
Her last one was IMO not very good.
A nice album ,but no where near as good as her others.Red Shoes was a lot better and that took 5 years.Prince and Lenny Henry are on that albun. It is so much better than Aerial.
IMO.
Munch

Ha, just goes to show how many different reactions you get.

I didn't like Red Shoes (bar the opening track) but loved Aerial. However, despite many highlights on several good albums I don't think she's ever beaten The Kick Inside as an album. Shame about the recording.

Steve

quote:

Top lady to me anyway as you can see I have a thing for Madonna.

Good for you. I think that I was trying to say that if you strip away the attitude/sexual politics etc etc etc I don't personally see much musical talent. Don't find her attractive either actually!

Her inability to act is surely beyond debate?

Bruce