5.0 or 7.0 setup?

Same question.

Have 2 IBLs to L&R about 6 inches behind the sofa. What would say 2 nsats (or IBLs) mounted 2m behind but 2m above bring to the party ?
Not using an AV2 but my denon 3910 to decode (Better that the Yamaha DSP E800) but I lived with an AV2 for a while and that is the best fo far for 5.1 but would it be worth it to add another 2 channels (For me, get a second hand 135 for centre and use the spare 140 for the extra 2 channels)

Pete,

Since you know you like the Niam presentation, I would stick with the Naim speakers if possible. It's a pity you have to place them so high, but I think you'll get a better result with them a) because you know you like the presentation and b) because they're very good speakers which typically have a better performance in my experience than those KEF / B&Ws you would be considering.

All that said, I feel you would probably want to add a sub sooner rather than later. Contrary to most speakers out there, the Naim speakers most definitely do not over-emphasise the bass. n-Sats aren't particularly big so although they're very clean, they don't go as deep or give as big a bass as other speaker systems. So the sub may become more important to you in the short term.

Stuart, I feel your problem is different enough to warrant its own thread...

Frank,

Thanks for your words of wisdom.
Of course this is a compromise, but given the lack of an unlimited bank balance, I need to make a proper informed decision on the way forward with the help of as many experts I can find.

In my room, doorway openings and a large external doorway prevent the surround speakers being in the optimum height and possible position. I take it that the wall bracket can accomodate the nSat pointing down and slightly forward.

Extra rear speakers (for 7.x) could be placed around ear height. The room if 4.5mwide and 9m long, with the listening position @5m from wall.


Anyway, this will be a while away, as after the nSats are purchased I will be looking at replacing my venerable NAC72.

Ta very muchly
Pete

quote:

Stuart, I feel your problem is different enough to warrant its own thread...

well I don't think they do - (unless your talking the other problems - I thought we had that out in the wine bar <joke>.

My primary question is what does the move from 5.1 to 7.1 bring - should I try. (Then again I could pester my dealer (but not ready to spend the £££ yet so that would not be fare – they already lent me an AV2 (in the past) for a week)

7.1 vs 5.1...

Firstly, no point in having 7.1 if you're sat up against, or very close to, your rear wall.
It won't work. Full Stop.

If your back wall is at leat a third as far away from you as the distance from your seating point to the front wall, and at very least 6 ft, it's probably worth a go.

You want an evenly set up room for it to work... so no corner-mounted screens.

The room's left hand side should be a mirror of the right in terms of speaker layout.

What you'll get out of the 2 extra speakers on a 6.1 encoded EX/ES disc is the two working in mono to image a single centre speaker behind you.
On DD soundtracks this WILL be matrixed from the stereo fed to your current surround pair. DTS supports both matrixed and discrete centre-rear channel info, depending on what was bunged on the disc.

Either way, a centre-rear channel will only be found on a limited number of discs.

For the most part your 2 extra speakers will remain inactive

Unless.....

You can choose settings on nearly all 7.1 amps/processors to feed signal to the rear speakers from a 5.1 soundtrack.
What you now get is identical signal fed to both the Left Surround and Left Back.... likewise for the right.

You now have each "corner pair" working to create a mono image coming from further back than if you were only using your 5.1 setup.

Here's the catch....
You wouldn't pick two different makes and models of speakers to create a stereo pair, would you?

If you want 7.1 to work properly then all four of your rear/surround speakers need to be identical.

The cost/performance equation is pretty simple....
If two pairs of speakers is too much cost, or not aesthetically ideal, don't do it.
If the room layout can't be optimised, don't do it.

Afraid, PJT, it doesn't look too likely to be worth the cost, and your 1m distance to the rear of the room means that irrespective of cost it almost certainly won't work...

Sorry!

Mike,

Thanks for your post, but the rear speakers (trad 5.1 layout) will be 1m behind the listening position, at ceiling height, which is why I asked if this sub-optimal position would be better than the 7.1 using ceiling mount speakers.

I have decided to go for the n-Sats, and 5.0 until a 282 is sitting in my rack

BTW, I have almost 3m behind the sofa should I feel inclined to go to 7.1 later on. The room is 9m long (4.5m wide) with the sofa 4m from main speakers, and 5 m from TV/centre spkr.



Pete

Cool.

Your 5.1 layout will be geographically very similar to my own then.
If you do later opt for 7.1 then based on what I've experienced I'd have to suggest n-sats again, and as close as possible to ceiling height again.

Have fun!

PJT

The standard Naim wall brackets do not allow for angling down. They're designed to suspend the speaker in the same way as the n-STANDs. Therefore, the speaker would be firing straight ahead and if you put it near the ceiling it will fire along the ceiling...

Hence my suggestion that you place the speaker between 4 and 6 feet off the ground.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike1380:
Cool.

Your 5.1 layout will be geographically very similar to my own then.
If you do later opt for 7.1 then based on what I've experienced I'd have to suggest n-sats again, and as close as possible to ceiling height again.

Have fun!

One last question - should the surrounds be ideally at 90 - 110 degrees? Where did your speakers end up?

90-110 degrees....

Hmm

Yes... if they're dipoles, bipoles or facing each other.

If none of the above then maybe closer to 120-130 degrees from your listening position.


Mine are actually sat atop an enormous cupboard that stretches the whole back wall of the room.

There's precious little room between the top of this and the ceiling, meaning that my surrounds had to be less than 13 inches tall... but with a depth of over 2 feet to the cupboard, my surrounds have always been closeley bordered by the ceiling, cupboard, and adjacent sidewall.

I did used to use bipoles and sat them halfway back... the reflections from the 3 surfaces gave a tremendously spacious rear soundstage, but robbed too much detail.

My current surrounds now sit as far forwards as they can and are actually toe'd out a little (maybe 10 degrees).
The resulting reflections still give me a great surround effect, but unmuddied now as I'm using conventional standmounts.

Had 5.1 in various guises for about 11 years, and my room will not support 7.1, but it's markedly at it's best now
Hope this helps.

Mike

...and keep in mind the "Single Speaker Demonstration": the more speakers you got, the more interferences you'll get...

...except that when listening in 2-channel the surround amplification is holding the drive units of the other speakers "in station" - like leaving a car parked in gear!