Problem with Wireless Streaming with Uniti
Posted by: Steeve on 17 August 2009
Hi
Anyone had any experience of wireless streaming with the Uniti?
I am using Foobar2000 as a uPnP server on a modern and pretty well-specified PC laptop through a BT Internet Hub.
The laptop and Uniti are one floor almost directly above the router.
I am trying to stream 16-bit FLAC tracks but on almost every track it will stop halfway through and then start again at the beginning which is rather annoying to say the least.
The wireless connection to my laptop has always seemed very good. I am in rented accommodation and have no control over the internet connection or routers. I am the only person using the network 95% of the time so this is not an issue.
So, is it just an inadequate wireless connection or is it due to something else and are there any possible remedies? I am living down in Swindon during the week but am planning to try it out back at home in Northampton with my Virgin Media (up to!)10Mb cable broadband connection when I get the chance to see if there is any difference but this won't be for a couple of weeks.
Thanks
Steeve
Anyone had any experience of wireless streaming with the Uniti?
I am using Foobar2000 as a uPnP server on a modern and pretty well-specified PC laptop through a BT Internet Hub.
The laptop and Uniti are one floor almost directly above the router.
I am trying to stream 16-bit FLAC tracks but on almost every track it will stop halfway through and then start again at the beginning which is rather annoying to say the least.
The wireless connection to my laptop has always seemed very good. I am in rented accommodation and have no control over the internet connection or routers. I am the only person using the network 95% of the time so this is not an issue.
So, is it just an inadequate wireless connection or is it due to something else and are there any possible remedies? I am living down in Swindon during the week but am planning to try it out back at home in Northampton with my Virgin Media (up to!)10Mb cable broadband connection when I get the chance to see if there is any difference but this won't be for a couple of weeks.
Thanks
Steeve
Posted on: 17 August 2009 by garyi
Your best bet is to download a suitable network tool and actually establish what your throughput is like.
The uniti has an info button which if pressed enough will bring up its buffer.
Play a track and keep an eye on the buffer, if it drops then yes your connection is crap.
First port of call would be the BT router which by the fact its supplied by BT, probably 'free' makes it shit.
The uniti has an info button which if pressed enough will bring up its buffer.
Play a track and keep an eye on the buffer, if it drops then yes your connection is crap.
First port of call would be the BT router which by the fact its supplied by BT, probably 'free' makes it shit.
Posted on: 17 August 2009 by Steeve
Thanks garyi
The Buffer Level is showing 10 bars at the moment. Is that good? I'll keep an eye on it.
The Buffer Level is showing 10 bars at the moment. Is that good? I'll keep an eye on it.
Posted on: 17 August 2009 by garyi
Indeed. Thats good.
What you need to establish is if there is a link between the cut in stream and anything else in the house.
I would also try another UPNP server as well, just in case.
And yes the best bet is of course wired.
What you need to establish is if there is a link between the cut in stream and anything else in the house.
I would also try another UPNP server as well, just in case.
And yes the best bet is of course wired.
Posted on: 17 August 2009 by Steeve
Wired isn't an option.
Yeah, buffer level stays at 10 for quite a while then drops to 2 or 3 bars just before cutting out - sometimes restarting from where it left off and sometimes from the beginning of the track.
Bugger.
Any recommendations for network throughput test software or alternative uPnP?
Yeah, buffer level stays at 10 for quite a while then drops to 2 or 3 bars just before cutting out - sometimes restarting from where it left off and sometimes from the beginning of the track.
Bugger.
Any recommendations for network throughput test software or alternative uPnP?
Posted on: 17 August 2009 by garyi
Yea seems like you have a network issue. BUt think of all options, such as the laptop. Does it show a wireless signal and when it drops does the sginal on the laptop drop at the same time?
If so then this is very likely to be something in the house such as a device switching in or out, or most likely that BT device, they really are poor quality.
As for software etc, sorry I am 100% mac based so have no idea but check out www.versiontracker.com and type in upnp or network and see what you get.
Finally and just to confuse thing, the uniti is showing good buffer for the most part so it seems like you are getting intermittent issues as opposed to just a slow network. I really think the bt device is to blame and could be interfering or being interfered by other networks in the area or by clicking mains or what ever. This could be very difficult to fix without chatting up the landlord.
You have the option of transferring your music to a harddrive and banging it in the front of the uniti...
If so then this is very likely to be something in the house such as a device switching in or out, or most likely that BT device, they really are poor quality.
As for software etc, sorry I am 100% mac based so have no idea but check out www.versiontracker.com and type in upnp or network and see what you get.
Finally and just to confuse thing, the uniti is showing good buffer for the most part so it seems like you are getting intermittent issues as opposed to just a slow network. I really think the bt device is to blame and could be interfering or being interfered by other networks in the area or by clicking mains or what ever. This could be very difficult to fix without chatting up the landlord.
You have the option of transferring your music to a harddrive and banging it in the front of the uniti...
Posted on: 17 August 2009 by Steeve
Needed a break and watched a DVD instead for a while!
Your last point..you mean like on a USB memory stick? Can you use an external HDD in the same way via the front socket?
Your last point..you mean like on a USB memory stick? Can you use an external HDD in the same way via the front socket?
Posted on: 17 August 2009 by garyi
Cannot say I have tried it yet but I don't see why not, how is the uniti going to know different? just make sure its formatted as fat32.
Posted on: 17 August 2009 by fixedwheel
Steeve
I don't know if you can set the naimuniti to use both interfaces at the same time, but you should have no trouble doing that with the laptop.
Then set fixed IP addresses on the lan connection of the laptop and the naimuniti and use a cheap network switch to hard wire the two together.
If you just want to stream from the laptop that will do the job. Internet radio would depend on the naimuniti being able to use both lan and wifi at the same time.
Worth a try, if only to point the finger.
John
I don't know if you can set the naimuniti to use both interfaces at the same time, but you should have no trouble doing that with the laptop.
Then set fixed IP addresses on the lan connection of the laptop and the naimuniti and use a cheap network switch to hard wire the two together.
If you just want to stream from the laptop that will do the job. Internet radio would depend on the naimuniti being able to use both lan and wifi at the same time.
Worth a try, if only to point the finger.
John
Posted on: 17 August 2009 by Keith L
Steeve,
Do you have access to your router settings? If so try a different wireless channel number. You should have a choice of automatic and a range from 1 to 13. Maybe a neighbour is using a similar wireless channel and causing your drop outs.
Keith
Do you have access to your router settings? If so try a different wireless channel number. You should have a choice of automatic and a range from 1 to 13. Maybe a neighbour is using a similar wireless channel and causing your drop outs.
Keith
Posted on: 17 August 2009 by Steeve
Keith,
Can you give a bit more information about how I would do this?
Many thanks
Steeve
Can you give a bit more information about how I would do this?
Many thanks
Steeve
Posted on: 18 August 2009 by Keith L
You access most routers through a browser, entering an address like 192.168.1.0. Find out your router's "home page" address and password to alter settings.
However, reading through your posts again, it seems unlikely this is the cause of your drop outs. Channel interference is usually random and doesn't occur exactly half way though a track. It sounds more like buffer under/over run because your streaming throughput is too slow.
However, reading through your posts again, it seems unlikely this is the cause of your drop outs. Channel interference is usually random and doesn't occur exactly half way though a track. It sounds more like buffer under/over run because your streaming throughput is too slow.
Posted on: 18 August 2009 by fixedwheel
Also Steeve's original comment of
Means that it would be easier to eliminate the public network from the equation, if only for testing.
John
quote:I am in rented accommodation and have no control over the internet connection or routers.
Means that it would be easier to eliminate the public network from the equation, if only for testing.
John
Posted on: 18 August 2009 by Steeve
Thanks for the replies. Keith, when I said "halfway" I was using the term colloquially not mathematically literally!
I have a good relationship with my landlord/lady so it's not impossible that I could ask for any necessary passwords to look at settings - at the moment I just know the key - although I would prefer to avoid this if possible especially as I'm not sure what i'm doing. It's one thing to mess with one's own kit but different if it's someone else's!
I won't have any opportunity now to do any tinkering until Thursday evening, but any further comments are very welcome and will be picked up then.
iRadio is fine by the way, but I guess this is because the bit rate (usually only 128kbps AAC/WMA/MP3)is so much less?
Cheers for now
Steeve
I have a good relationship with my landlord/lady so it's not impossible that I could ask for any necessary passwords to look at settings - at the moment I just know the key - although I would prefer to avoid this if possible especially as I'm not sure what i'm doing. It's one thing to mess with one's own kit but different if it's someone else's!
I won't have any opportunity now to do any tinkering until Thursday evening, but any further comments are very welcome and will be picked up then.
iRadio is fine by the way, but I guess this is because the bit rate (usually only 128kbps AAC/WMA/MP3)is so much less?
Cheers for now
Steeve
Posted on: 19 August 2009 by Basically Sound
Steeve,
Have been investigating similar concerns on behalf of a customer.
It would seem that the busier the wireless network, then the more at risk of dropout the wireless connections are, especially as the file format increase in bit/sample rates.
On a positive note, currently listening to Uniti streaming WAV 16bit 44.1 from laptop via Belkin N+ router - all wireless connections - no glitches in over half an hour's listening.
Tony @ Basically Sound & Vision
Have been investigating similar concerns on behalf of a customer.
It would seem that the busier the wireless network, then the more at risk of dropout the wireless connections are, especially as the file format increase in bit/sample rates.
On a positive note, currently listening to Uniti streaming WAV 16bit 44.1 from laptop via Belkin N+ router - all wireless connections - no glitches in over half an hour's listening.
Tony @ Basically Sound & Vision
Posted on: 19 August 2009 by pcstockton
Wireless streaming is bereft with issues it appears. Why not hard wire it? Cant you run ethernet as far as you want?
Posted on: 20 August 2009 by Steeve
Hi Tony
When you say "the wireless network" do you mean the specific network in the house or in the bigger outside world?
PC
Hard-wiring is not practical in my rented accommodation. My room is on the first floor which would mean a wire going from the kitchen, through the hallway, up a flight of stairs, across another landing and into my room! Drilling holes in floors and/or ceilings is not an option!
I was in Bristol all day yesterday so haven't had a chance to play recently.
Steeve
When you say "the wireless network" do you mean the specific network in the house or in the bigger outside world?
PC
Hard-wiring is not practical in my rented accommodation. My room is on the first floor which would mean a wire going from the kitchen, through the hallway, up a flight of stairs, across another landing and into my room! Drilling holes in floors and/or ceilings is not an option!
I was in Bristol all day yesterday so haven't had a chance to play recently.
Steeve
Posted on: 20 August 2009 by Basically Sound
Steeve,
In some respects, both, but my comment related to the local wireless network in the house. If this is being shared by all the flats, then the available bandwidth is restricted and something has to give. Not normally a problem with computers (slower updates, transfers, etc.), but in the land of audio, you hear it.
Have been successful with laptop streaming WMA @ 192k via a BT HomeHub2 to Uniti all linked wirelessly, but any higher quality rip and it got a bit patchy. Made one link wired and all was perfect including WAV.
Would be happy to chat about this if you want more detailed info - contact details available via Naim dealer finder.
Cheers,
Tony
In some respects, both, but my comment related to the local wireless network in the house. If this is being shared by all the flats, then the available bandwidth is restricted and something has to give. Not normally a problem with computers (slower updates, transfers, etc.), but in the land of audio, you hear it.
Have been successful with laptop streaming WMA @ 192k via a BT HomeHub2 to Uniti all linked wirelessly, but any higher quality rip and it got a bit patchy. Made one link wired and all was perfect including WAV.
Would be happy to chat about this if you want more detailed info - contact details available via Naim dealer finder.
Cheers,
Tony
Posted on: 20 August 2009 by Eloise
It will depend on your hardware, but you MAY be able to add a second wireless access point in your own room, then use wired connection from NaimUnity and your Laptop to the 2nd access point and the accesspoint will wirelessly talk to the first for internet access.
I know the Linksys Wireless-G Access Points can be configured for this ... I'm not allowed to post a link ... but a search on Linksys' customer help pages for answer ID 4200 should help you.
Eloise
I know the Linksys Wireless-G Access Points can be configured for this ... I'm not allowed to post a link ... but a search on Linksys' customer help pages for answer ID 4200 should help you.
Eloise
Posted on: 20 August 2009 by Steeve
Eloise
That sounds intruiging although I'm unsure how that helps if the wireless link from the BT Home Hub is still in the equation. I couldn't find the item you mentioned on the Linksys site. Could you maybe email me some info to stevewhite4@hotmail.com?
Many thanks
Steeve
Tony,
Thanks for the offer though it would seem that the BT Internet Hub is looking increasingly like the problem even though it is only ever shared with a maximum of one other user and then only occasionally. Not sure how feasible it would be for me to replace this with another router off my own back.
Steeve
That sounds intruiging although I'm unsure how that helps if the wireless link from the BT Home Hub is still in the equation. I couldn't find the item you mentioned on the Linksys site. Could you maybe email me some info to stevewhite4@hotmail.com?
Many thanks
Steeve
Tony,
Thanks for the offer though it would seem that the BT Internet Hub is looking increasingly like the problem even though it is only ever shared with a maximum of one other user and then only occasionally. Not sure how feasible it would be for me to replace this with another router off my own back.
Steeve
Posted on: 20 August 2009 by Eloise
quote:it would seem that the BT Internet Hub is looking increasingly like the problem even though it is only ever shared with a maximum of one other user and then only occasionally. Not sure how feasible it would be for me to replace this with another router off my own back.
Remember that even though you are going point to point from Laptop to the NaimUnity, there is actually two sets of network traffic involved - one from Laptop to the router, the second from the router to the NaimUnity. With Wired connection these can occur simultaneously down separate wires, whereas with Wireless there has to be a packet sent from Laptop to Router, then packet sent from Router to NaimUnity, etc.
I've also emailed you the link to the LinkSys article I found, not sure if it's exactly going to work but should do.
The other option is to buy a small switch and connect wired from NaimUnity and Laptop into the switch, and then use Internet Connection Sharing on the laptop to allow the Unity to connect to the internet for Radio, etc.
Eloise
Posted on: 20 August 2009 by pcstockton
Eloise,
I may have mispoke. I dont understand UPnP as much as others. I believe the correct terminology is to use Foobar as a UPnP server. It would then be seen by the Uniti as such. Then you can use the foobar iPhone controller to, well, control Foobar.
No need for plugplayer then.
-patrick
I may have mispoke. I dont understand UPnP as much as others. I believe the correct terminology is to use Foobar as a UPnP server. It would then be seen by the Uniti as such. Then you can use the foobar iPhone controller to, well, control Foobar.
No need for plugplayer then.
-patrick
Posted on: 20 August 2009 by garyi
Had you considered chatting the landlord up to plug one of those ethernet plug jobbies by the router and one in your lounge?
No wires, no holes, no fuss.
No wires, no holes, no fuss.
Posted on: 20 August 2009 by Steeve
Eloise
aah...ok..I understand what you're saying now - I think! I can see the logic in it anyhow and sounds like it might work. I use a LinkSys G Router of some description back in Northampton so I could bring it down here to try out anyhow; just need to blag a second ethernet cable. The link looked a little daunting with just a brief glance but I'm sure it'll make more sense when I find my brain and read it properly.
Eloise, Patrick
I'm using Foobar uPnP server. Haven't tried any others but open to alternative recommendations if you think it might make a difference.
Garyi
The ethernet mains idea? I hadn't thought about that. Not a bad idea at all! Thanks
Well, I'm in Salisbury tomorrow and Saturday for the Naim do, but will pick up some stuff next time I'm back home to try out so won't be able to report back for a while.
Thanks to everyone for all the ideas. Sounds like it's not a complete disaster after all!
P.S. When it does play it sounds very good indeed even just on some 14 year old Linn Tukans. Need a break from all this technology for a while though so listening to Sharon van Etten on CD who sounds wonderful...:-)
aah...ok..I understand what you're saying now - I think! I can see the logic in it anyhow and sounds like it might work. I use a LinkSys G Router of some description back in Northampton so I could bring it down here to try out anyhow; just need to blag a second ethernet cable. The link looked a little daunting with just a brief glance but I'm sure it'll make more sense when I find my brain and read it properly.
Eloise, Patrick
I'm using Foobar uPnP server. Haven't tried any others but open to alternative recommendations if you think it might make a difference.
Garyi
The ethernet mains idea? I hadn't thought about that. Not a bad idea at all! Thanks
Well, I'm in Salisbury tomorrow and Saturday for the Naim do, but will pick up some stuff next time I'm back home to try out so won't be able to report back for a while.
Thanks to everyone for all the ideas. Sounds like it's not a complete disaster after all!
P.S. When it does play it sounds very good indeed even just on some 14 year old Linn Tukans. Need a break from all this technology for a while though so listening to Sharon van Etten on CD who sounds wonderful...:-)
Posted on: 20 August 2009 by pcstockton
Steeve,
Foobar is an awesomely powerful, fast, flexible, customizable, iPhone controllable, media player/renderer/server.
If you get along with it, I wouldn't even consider anything else. But that is only like my opinion man.
-patrick
Foobar is an awesomely powerful, fast, flexible, customizable, iPhone controllable, media player/renderer/server.
If you get along with it, I wouldn't even consider anything else. But that is only like my opinion man.
-patrick
Posted on: 21 August 2009 by Eloise
Gary... The powerline jobbie sounds a great idea. Plugged into a small hub / switch at the NaimUnity end and wire the laptop and NaimUnity to that (think you can get powerline things with hubs built in).
Patrick... Thanks for info about FooBar. Really I was curious if FooBar can actually act as a UPnP controller? As well as it acting as a server? I'm actually beginnig to like sound / look of FooBar and if I can get a PC will have an experiment.
Eloise
Patrick... Thanks for info about FooBar. Really I was curious if FooBar can actually act as a UPnP controller? As well as it acting as a server? I'm actually beginnig to like sound / look of FooBar and if I can get a PC will have an experiment.
Eloise