buying/selling second hand...

Two days ago I sold my 92/90 this guy came from further away, he paid in cash without trying that really boring haggle thing. Nice.

I suppose I didn't even look at the money to check if it was ikky, but at the end of the day my gut instinct was that he was a trustworthy guy, plus he inquired about the kit via his work adress so I could have spamed him to death if it was dodgy.

when I sold my credos again for cash, again the guy seemed trustworthy, I guess this is all you really have to go on.

One thing I won't do and I specify this to potential buyers, is piss around with cheques, as far as I am concerned these things are legacy and should be done away with, there is nothing to justify a 3 day clearing, (Except fat interest for the banks) and there is also no excuse for a potential buyer not to get cash with all these cash machines around now.

And regarding sending the kit, I recently wired my mate 40 quid that I owed him, straight out my account into his via phone. The banks have updated recently and cash transactions show up immediately even on weekends. So no need for cheque there either.

garyi, way to go -- many thanks.

enjoy

ken

I think the major issue is trust. I bought and sold a couple of items in the past 12 months via ebay, internet ads and the classifieds weekly edition. Ebay has the feedback system, and you can employ an escrow system so the escrower collects the good and the money, items are released step by step.
Usually the seller ships/posts the item after receiving the monies in his account.
Pain in the a** are usually US counterparts where wireless money transfers are not that common - had to use Western Union Money Order, but their fees compared to the ones for an internationl money transfer are quite modest.
But: whether the stuff you bought will be delivered is something you can never be sure of - here it is the chat on the phone, the emails you read or the ebay feedback you see which has to make you to believe.
My experiences btw are very positive, about 9 months ago I bought my hicap via internet ad (link)and after chatting for 5 minutes the guy I talked to told me, he would ship the hicap immediately as I had to trust him, too if I sent the money first.
So he did and the hicap arrived 2 days later - payment was initiated by then but I had the cap long time before money was collected by him.
To summarize: I do prefer a system with feedback like ebay for bigger transactions, otherwise it is the impression you get of that bloke on the phone and how good you are in "reading" people.
Does not help much, but that is my experience.
Regards
Guido

it worked for me when selling some stuff

Derek

Look carefully at the seller's feedback - the guy on Audiogon pointed me to his Ebay feedback given the dearth of Audiogon feedback.

In over 40 transactions on Ebay, I've never been burned (knock on wood). At this point, I have very little reservations regarding buying used Naim gear in this manner.

Erik

PayPal is the way I get around the check or money order issue, and I always make one phone call to talk to the seller, and offer that option if I'm the one selling.

Nothing beats a good dealer, IMHO, when shopping for this stuff secondhand. They go through each item (or should, anyway), and make sure it's solid before selling it, and the prices I've seen aren't much different than what you find on Audiogon or eBay. Plus they'll usually buy it back at a decent price when you're ready to upgrade. Bottom line: you get what you pay for.

M

With Naim owners you tend be dealing with an honest and knowledgeable group and solid equipment, so the risk is lower than usual.

I've sent checks on trust for up to $200. Some folks in Canada prepaid for a 62/hicap, but I gave them a GREAT price.

Phil

If im buying then the same applies - I usually take cash with me.

Be mindful about shipping - this costs. In my book, if soemeone wants something Im selling then they come and get it or they pay shipping. Of course if its something youre finding difficult to shift, you can haggle either way.

Ive just had an unpleasant experience where I bought some Naim kit from a very nice guy. Hed come a long way to get the stuff to me (he was keen to get the cash and I couldnt get to him due to work committments). It turned out hed left something behind. I gave him the cash anyway, with the promise that hed post the stuff on. I want to emphasise that he behaved honourably etc but for complex reasons (which I wont go into here) the stuff didnt get to me until over 3 months later, and left a sour taste in my mouth for obvious reasons. In the future, I might be a little more thick skinned.

When I buy from the states from private sellers (guitars, not hi-fi!) its all by electronic bank transfer. I have to trust people in that scenario or just not get the goods.

Steve

Well.....not always. I bought an 82 from a dealer and a pair of 135s from another dealer and these were fine. The 135s were in fact a private sale by the dealer. Neither item was demonstrated.

OTOH I bought a 101 tuner and an AV1 from two other dealers. They both were 'dead on arrival'. Neither item was demonstrated. Both went back to Naim. The AV1 dealer funded that repair and fortunately, Naim repaired the 101 free, but might have 'spoken' to the dealer about it.

Privately I've bought 12/160; 32.5; Hicap; and Wilson speakers. The speakers were paid by cheque which was cleared before the seller allowed me to collect. Before parting with the cheque I got a written agreement stating what the goods were, including Serial No and condition etc. For the Naim kit, I offered to take each seller to a cash point or open bank. In each case they trusted me with a cheque instead.

Same when buying/selling cars - we go jointly to the building society/bank and draw a cheque directly in favour of the seller but only hand it over back at the car. HPI check done before-hand of course!

Hope this helps or amuses!

Cheers

Don

It helps make up my mind on whether its worth buying or not.

i wonder how many dealers would consider it as part of their customer service (i.e.buying loyalty) to provide a middle-man service, i.e. give the equipment a "once-over" and perform the "clearing" function. i.e. goods not released till payment "clears" and money not handed over till goods arrive and in good working condition. this method would cut the risk subtantially, even for items costing many thousands of pounds.

a dealer might want to charge a small premium for this service -- but i think provided its small enough -- i would pay, especially if we are talking cdsii, dbl, or nap500 type transactions.

but i guess for people who are sufficiently comfortable, the direct method appears to work quite well, although what i am picking up is that this "trust" thing is only for small xactions.

many thanks guys for your thoughts and contributions.

enjoy

ken