Speakers

Posted by: vimal on 30 August 2001

New Member Current kit CDSII/XPS,52/Supercap,6x135,Naxo3-6/Hi-cap,LP12,Bariks active.Decided to upgrade to more modern speakers,which would improve on the strengths and weaknesses of the Bariks.What to go for NBL,DBL,but by chance I had the opportunity to try out a pair of Neat Ultimatum MF9, these are not released yet, but a version of these were
at the 1999 Bristol show as the Stealth, and were to be released thro Mana.The ones I took home were finished in fiddleback Sycamore and looked stunning,they were to be driven by a pair of 135s.The sound was sensational(leave it to your imagination),I have now had them for about 3 months,and in the process of going active.Naim have already modified Naxo3-6,and it will setup this week-end and I will report on any further improvement if any.If you are interested these Speakers will be on show at Hammersmith and will be hooked up to an all Naim setup consisting of CDSII/XPS,52/Supercap.135s
Posted on: 30 August 2001 by Tony L
quote:
If you are interested these Speakers will be on show at Hammersmith and will be hooked up to an all Naim setup consisting of CDSII/XPS,52/Supercap.135s

Excellent. I really want to hear them, they certainly look interesting from a design perspective, and I really like the little Neats I have heard.

Tony.

Posted on: 30 August 2001 by vimal
Jason
Within the next couple of days there should be details and image on the neat web site.
vimal
Posted on: 30 August 2001 by Top Cat
That company deserves more recognition in my opinion. The petite is the biggest speaker bargain available new today - it's an incredible little speaker.

It's just a shame so few people get a chance to hear them. Site them close to a wall, though, as I found out - too far away and the midrange vanishes smile

John

Posted on: 02 September 2001 by Allan Probin
Hi Vim,

I'm certainly looking forward to coming round and listening to the Ultimatums now you've gone active with 6 * 135's. Your change from active Isobariks to passive Ultimatums was stunning, can't wait to hear the Ultimatums active.

You know, we still have to do the showdown - 6 *135's active vs 500 passive.

I've had a Kan vs SBL weekend here. The Kans managed to put the frighteners up the SBLs for a while, however, the Kans have proved to be an excellent reference tool for setting up SBLs. With a bit of speaker re-positioning the system has moved up a few notches and the SBLs are now showing a clean pair of heels to the Kans. The Kan II stands turn-up next week and we'll start over again.

Allan

Posted on: 02 September 2001 by Allan Probin
It was fairly obvious from the outset that SBLs are a much more refined and mature speaker than Kans, its just that the Kans had a couple of things in their favour - they are blindingly fast and they communicate really well. It's these factors that had me thinking that despite their faults, I really was enjoying listening to Kans more than the SBLs.

I wasn't going to give-up on the SBLs that easily. I wanted to try and make them as fast as the Kans - bit of a tall order. One of the things I did was to use the Kans along the back wall to try and work out positions of maximum and minimum bass reinforcment. Once I'd got that worked out I put the SBLs on the minimum points. I few iterations closer to and further from the wall, along with a couple of swaps to Kans for comparison and I eventually got it sorted.

I've now got SBLs sounding pretty damn close to Kan-speed - and with it came that Kan-like communication. Okay I'll admit it, the Kans still have the tiniest edge but its not enough to make up for the shortcomings.

Putting the SBLs back in is like the effect in an aeroplane of suddenly hearing everying again in natural perspective when your ears have become pressurised without you realising it and then they suddenly decompress.

Now the Kans have got a competitor for speed, I've noticed a rather unpleasant trait. I knew thay had the effect of bringing high-frequncy instruments forward in the mix (for example cymbols) where SBLs leave them much further back, but leading edge transients, (a sharply struck cymbol or drum for example) with the Kans get flung out towards you. The effect is so dramtic that sometimes it makes you blink involuntarily. With the SBLs the transient stays right there with the instrument. One of these effects is exciting, the other is realistic.

Allan

[This message was edited by Allan Probin on SUNDAY 02 September 2001 at 22:49.]

Posted on: 02 September 2001 by ken c
interesting posting. i am glad you persevered. i think i agree with your observations on the differences between the two speakers. i have both (albeit Kan I's).

quotable quote: ...One of these effects is exciting, the other is realistic.

nicely put. however, i have always found that the more realistic the sound i hear from my system, the more exciting it is. but i know exactly what you mean and am not disagreeing with you.

meantime, enjoy

ken

Posted on: 02 September 2001 by Allan Probin
Oh, another thing I tried (don't try this at home kids) was trying to soak-up bass using curtains and mattresses against the walls (just for experimentation you understand). By bringing in more and more dampening I could effectively tune the bass down to any level I wanted. Unfortunately the results sounded truely awful.

So bad were the results, that the bit of dampening I normally have to cut down on flutter echoes (dedicated listening room - only one piece of furniture) in a kind of live-end/dead-end arrangement are now under deep suspicion. I think I might get better results using diffusion in a kind of live-end/live-end arrangement.

BTW Ken, my comparison with Kans is with Kan I's also. I've not had chance yet to hear Kan II's or, I must admit, Kans on proper Kan stands.

Allan

Posted on: 03 September 2001 by Rico
quote:
I was digging out all my '80s 12" singles at the weekend and came accross Two Tribes by Frankie Goes To Hollywood - WOW! - I could feel my blood pressure rising in response to the fireworks comming from the Kans.
You gotta get this piece of vinyl and play it LOUD.

Oh sh@t..... does confessing to liking FGTH make me a Boybander ?

Rob

I too have this 12". Should I admit I have two versions of the Relax 12"? I might even have two versions of Two Tribes as well, although my memory might be playing tricks. I am looking forward to giving it a whirl on the twelve, with Ekos installed, lingo sorted, and Mana shelf firmly fused to the wall. Surely this swathe of 80's FGTH vinyl doesn't make me a boybander too? I never had a RELAX t-shirt #; )

PS - trust you didn't make a mess.

Rico - ok, the Kans are sorted, now whatabout the rainforests?

Posted on: 03 September 2001 by Will_Dias
Rob,

The leading edge of a note is important for other reasons too. I saw an experiment, broadcast a year or 2 ago, where recordings of notes played by various instruments were altered so that the leading edge was removed. It was then almost impossible to identify the instrument playing the hacked note.

Bill.

Posted on: 03 September 2001 by RandallE
You might also want to back out to their products page and check out the Vito model. That looks like a winner as well.

I enjoy your HiFi+ articles, btw.

Neat Ultimatum

Please let me die quietly in my sleep like grandpa.....not like the screaming passengers in his car.

Posted on: 03 September 2001 by Willem van Gemert
What a coincidence! My brother just mailed me today that he bought his first amplifier (Cambridge. I told him to wait for a Nait, but he was in a hurry) and that he was going through our old LP collection: Frankie goes to Hollywood (I think I had most 12 inches!), the Dead Kennedies and others. I would love to hear "Two Tribes" or "Relax" on my system from LP.

"Watch out for contamination!"

Willem

Posted on: 03 September 2001 by Rico
"D-D-D-D-D--D-D-D-D-estruction!"

Rico - all your base are belong to us