HI FI+ Alan Sircom off his trolley

Syd,

Not every hifi lover is a music lover, I guess.

Regards.

Phil

You want it all?

Silly money of course (but so is a NAP 250 to most people).

The only system I have ever heard that did EVERYTHING in spades was a Krell/Wilson System 6 with outrageously expensive speaker cables.

It's the system I'd have, if I could afford it.

Dear J.N.

YOU CANT BE SERIOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The wilson is a triumph of execution over content.

I have heard various incarnations of the WATT PUPPY and have never understood the reasons why people buy this combination.

If i had the resources to buy a speaker of that value it would not be a Wilson.

I much prefer big Magneplanars Tannoys JBLs.

At least they make theyre own drive units.

The Wilson imho is like many commercial speakers a collection of other peoples drive units put together to make a finished product.

It is not the result of research into drive unit design and technology and following a belief or philosophy.

I jest when i say that you could build a Wilson, but you could get very close.

Wilson secure commercial drive units and very carefully match them to the design specs.
The manufacturer of the drive units will charge up to a 100% premium for this.

A focal Tweeter of standard quality is approx £40.00 retail so double that price and then knock off sum for trade price and then some more for volume discount.

I have built a Watt Puppy lookalike using FOCAL drive units. I add not built to wilson supreme quality of construction but still less than £400.00 all in !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sound quality pretty good.

At retail prices you have

2 x 8" @ £80.00 each
1 x 6" @ £70.00 each
1 x tweeter @ £45.00 each
MDF 25mm @ £60.00
Cable @ £30.00
X Over @ £60.00
finish what ever you fancy

this is per speaker so double the above for your Watt Puppy clone pair.

I am currently working on a revised version of the above using much better quality drive units this will just about increase the price of the drive units by a factor of 2.

If i chose the latest version of the Focal tweeter this would give a tweeter cost of approx £400.00 per tweeter. But it is one of the finest tweeters in the world.

So you can have fun building yor own speakers and save a fortune .

regards David

Michael !

quote:

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and are not available to anyone else, including the driver manufacturers.

---

Don't be so naive

And by the way, the most dissapointing designs which I was heard in life are made of Focal drivers. For example, JM Lab mini Utopia is total crap, no matter driven by Krell or Sonic Frontiers.

Ozren

-The difference between Theory and Practice is much greater in Practice than
it is in Theory.-

RichardN !

quote:

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The reason most manufacturers of top dollar gear get the drivers custom made is so that they can't be cloned.

---

Really? I was thinking that they make custom drivers because that current models are not so good for what they want to do.

Is this what you called custom? I think that I was seen it before
1
or
2

Ozren

- The difference between Theory and Practice is much greater in Practice than
it is in Theory. -

Michael !

You better read this:
hi fi business

Also, I know a person who can get Puppy drivers for your friend for a reasonable sum.

And what if you are living in Greece for example and your Puppy driver was burned, so you want to changed it, do you really believe that they still wouldn't send you one piece for change? There is always a way, but hi fi industry is very cruel. Hi Fi dealers have very big profit, the same is only in medical industry.

Ozren

Ozren,

The dealers don't make that big a profit, as he says in the article you quoted. His numbers are not far off what happens in the UK.

Oh - and if you want massive margins, look at the Opticians industry. That's highway robbery by comparison.

Regards,
Frank.
All opinions are my own and do not reflect the opinion of any organisations I work for, except where this is stated explicitly.

[This message was edited by Frank Abela on FRIDAY 28 February 2003 at 18:45.]

[This message was edited by Frank Abela on FRIDAY 28 February 2003 at 18:47.]

[This message was edited by Frank Abela on FRIDAY 28 February 2003 at 18:47.]

Bloody hell!

quote:

---

YOU CANT BE SERIOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

---

John Mac Enroe (?) has infiltrated our ranks.

David and I know that our ears are wired differently.

You're paying Mr Wilson for years of development and an immaculately presented, quality product.

Naim are making a good wedge on a 552/500, but they're not here for the fun of it.

Flippin' capitalism eh?

My original comments stand. I've heard nothing better.

Dear All,

In order to have a proprietary drive unit to custom spec is easy.

Give spec to manufacturer.

eg voice coil spec, magnet spec, spider spec, roll surround spec etc.

Then order 500 pieces.

There you have it a bespoke drive unit.

A friend who has a speaker business uses nice drive units. He was approached by a taiwan oem manufacturer who said .

I sell you good copy of x drive unit for x dollars. Delivery 1000 pieces 3 weeks.

Sample matched the original manufacturers spec.

Fortunately this friend is an honest kind of guy and continued to use the original manufacturer.

The money in drive units is in the r and d of the design. Not in respeccing an oem drive unit.

I like focal drive units and when used well can sound fabulous. That is why D Wilson is rather partial to them.

J.N. how are the quads and valve mosfet hybrid amp? You are slowly coming round to my way of thinking. !!!!!!!

Seriously this is a fun hobby.

my next project will only use a focal tweeter the other drive units will not be focal.

Why because i think the germans and scandinavians are doing good things.

regards David

David

Thanks for exposing me.

I hereby crave the forgiveness of followers of the true path.

I have sinned by enjoying the sound of a Unison Research 'Unico' hybrid amp and Quad ESL 57's.

The treble panel of one of the Quads has died, unfortunately which has spurred me on, to get them properly fettled.

Classique Sounds of Leicester seems to be the place (in the UK) unless anyone knows better?

Dear J.N.
What about the guys in germany who purchased all the tooling from QUAD.

I believe that the leicester company have dealing swith the german company.

Sorry to hear about the quad going phut.

A friend in cambridge is currently refettling his quads and has said if he likes the results he will go for a stacked pair.

One of the best loudspeakers i have ever heard was a pair of stacked quads.

In fact i have even heard a pair of the flat panel stacked quads that the Radio People Ltd of Hong Kong made in the 60's and 70's. They were fabulous too.

There is something so right about the old quads which is interesting as they are all over the shop when you measure the performance.

But set themup properly in a nice room and hey presto MUSIC.

I had a couple of pairs over the years and loved them dearly. But unemployment equalled sell them. Some thing i still regret.

I would not have a pair today as they are not as good as what i have now.

But lovely all the same.

regards David

quote:

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Originally posted by J.N.:
The only system I have ever heard that did EVERYTHING in spades was a Krell/Wilson System 6 with outrageously expensive speaker cables.

---

John,

what we heard was System 5 or 5.1, I think. Cables about £5K.

When we've heard Wilson at shows since, it's always been System 6, and never come within 10% of that first performance for me.

cheers, Martin

E-mail:- MartinPayne at Dial.Pipex.com