Will the McCartneys precipitate any change in Ireland?

I wouldn’t claim to be any closer to Ireland than you Dean, but I have watched as the events have devastated Sinn Féin. The Northern Bank robbery (which I suppose we have to realistically attribute to the PIRA), and Robert McCartney’s murder by PIRA members, so close to the politically important St.Patrick’s Day, have left Sinn Féin, and Adams in particular, reeling.

I think the bank raid will have had minimal negative impact on the nationalist community, but provided a stick for politicians in both the north, and significantly the south, to beat Adams with/call for his resignation/penalise financially/etc. McCartney’s murder is different. This was an attack on a member of the nationalist community, a bar room brawl that could in no way be justified in a military or political context. I don’t know what action if any would have been taken if the McCartney sisters hadn’t shown a considerable degree of guts and not taken their brother’s death lying down. The fact is, the PIRA and Sinn Féin are coming under unprecedented pressure from within, from their own community and from their own members, many of whom quite rightly are repelled by what they view as criminal behaviour by elements who dishonour (in their frame of reference), what they have fought for.

Adams’ rejection by Washington’s political elite is without doubt, as Fritz said, a massive slap in the face for Sinn Féin, but is temporary rather than permanent - these guys aren’t fools and know full well the work and risks Adams has taken to move the PIRA away from violence. It is a clear statement from the US though, that enough is enough, and this kind of activity will not be supported. I’ve read an opinion (which I agree with), that paradoxically, this could help Adams to influence the PIRA towards disbanding, because he can say “OK, we tried it your way, look what’s happened. Let’s do it my way.”

Adams must be seething. All the work he’s done, everything that’s been achieved, 10 year ceasefire, coming tantalisingly close to disbanding the IRA a few months ago and now these thugs, these gangsters, these c*nts are coming close to destroying it all ! I hope the guy can get things back on track, but it’s going to be difficult.

It’s also worth a quick look at the reaction of the political parties in both the north AND south. The bank raid in particular must have been a big embarrassment to the police and the establishment in the north, so people want to get even. Adams, IIRC, has told witnesses to McCartney’s murder to come forward, for the guilty to give themselves up, and several peolple have been expelled from Sinn Féin and PIRA. But apparently, witnesses have been turned away by the police because “we haven’t finished building our case” !!!!!!!!!!!! Maybe there’s some truth in that, but if hypothetically, you wanted to prolong the pain for Sinn Féin, to maintain the pressure, perhaps you might pursue such a strategy.

Several politicians in the south have also taken the opportunity to lash out at Sinn Féin, just when they are increasing their political presence. Cynical ? Moi ????

Whatever. It’s a good thing. Sinn Féin/PIRA have their backs against the wall now, and need to make some BIG gestures . We have to be looking for complete, unconditional dis-armment (and bollox to Paisley), and a clear statement to stand-down PIRA. It would be fantastic if the bravery of the McCartney sisters resulted in some historic event that could, in some way, make the guy’s death worth something.

I’m optimistic.

Brian

If the people of NI that wanted rid of segregation marched upon the offices of the political party offices en-mass, it would send out a message of revolution and total rejection of the thugs that run things like an Eastenders episode. But there are not enough of them, because every family has some members with such inbred hatred and bitterness that they will just not move on. That causes in-family arguments and it's easier to forget it. Go to NI and talk to normal people not mixed up in it, and realise that finally, they actually do have deep seated opinions that they feel strongly about, and it dawns on you that this will never end. Ultimately, they will not forgive and forget.
NI has become two adjacent warring ghettos. There are those that are involved in fighting the war, and those that are related to those people. Until they understand that there is a whole world outside of their village, they will continue in their sorry little parochial excuses for lives. I really was optomistic for a while, but I can't be bothered with them anymore. May God forgive me.

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,1441975,00.html

No suprise there Jon, eh ?


Fritz Von Get that anti Irish pot boiling in UK again

There couldn't be any truth in the statement that mainland Britain faces a 'substantial threat' of an Irish republican bombing campaign, then?

Regards
Steve M

Hi 7Up, that's obviously the way things are supposed to be thought, and if in the unfortunate event of an incident happening and being 'proven' that the Irish situation was in some way responsible for a UK 'mainland' attack, the British justice system may get some credibility back.
To now neither the Bank Raid or killing of Mr MacCartney have been proven, and I suspect never will be either. There may well be 'widely reported' arrests across UK etc soon, (police are on their toes) and the suspects will possibly be all released soon afterwards wotjhout any charge whatso'ever or follow ups, barring those individuals being fucked for life, a high price, and future instilled hatred for generations to come, exactly what everybody is 'apparently' trying to de-escalate and eradicate, innit mate ?

Fritz Von Circles and circles and circles

After watching one of the sisters being interviewd yesterday on BBC's Hard Talk programm, she detailed the chain of events of the evening of her brother's death (only because the hardly mentioned friend of his lived to tell the tale (Throat cut with bottle in front of 70 people in pub) it put a whole different perspectiver on how truly evil an attack it was (sheer ego on the purpetrators side seemingly ?)


Fritz Von Will anybody testify to the ombudsman ?` Good Friday Agreements come to mind:

Yes, I remember one of the sisters remarking that all of the possible 60-70 witnesses to the murder were "in the toilet" at the time. Are these witnesses terrified of the consequences of testifying or actually loyal to the "cause"? I personally can't imagine loyalty like that being consistently spread over so many witnesses so I assume it's terror that's keeping them quiet.

Deane

Got it in one our Deanne, innit.



Fritz Von Freedom from fear

The McCartney family brought their campaign to the European Parliament yesterday. Well received by the Euro-MPs, they continued to push for some sort of justice for the death of their brother, but believing that their only chance now lies with a civil action. Clearly, they have no intention of letting this quietly drop, but will the media start to tire of the story ?

Meanwhile, back in Gotham City…….

In a fairly Big Leap, Gerry Adams calls on the IRA to „embrace the political alterative“ to military action. It can’t be underestimated how significant this statement is, effectively putting pressure on the IRA membership, or at least providing some of the IRA members with an excuse, to open discussions over dis-armament and disbandment of the IRA itself.

I think it’s fair to give credit to the McCartney sisters for pushing the republican movement in this direction and I think history will view Robert McCartney’s death as a pivotal moment in N.I.history. It would be a fitting footnote if the guy’s killers were sentenced, but that looks increasingly unlikely.

So we all wait with baited breath to see how IRA responds. I think it’s clear to interested observers, that the continued existence of the IRA is now a hindrance to the nationalist movement and the growth of Sinn Féin as a political entity both north and south of the border. Adams obviously believes this, more so after the kicking he’s received over the last few weeks.

Interesting times….

Brian

Interesting post Brian, I believe that the IRA have already dismissed the suggestion. But who is speaking for who in that organisation.
And as they are well cashed up they are speaking from a position of strength as they see it. Or am I totally wrong ?