A Brief History of Recording - a good link.

Posted by: u5227470736789439 on 14 December 2007

Dear Friends,

I found this link looking for a photo of Elgar's gramophone to post on my gramophone thread.

There are about 15 audio extracts to sample, and two factual errors in the article that I can see.

Nikisch recorded Beethoven's Fifth Symphony in 1913 with the Berlin Philharmonic and not the London Symphony Orchestra as stated, though the Webber Oberon extract was recorded by him in that year with the LSO.

AD Blumlein died in an accidental aircrash near Ross-on-Wye [Herefordshire, UK], and was not shot down by enemy fire.

Anyway for anyone interested here it is!

Gramohone recording.

Have fun looking and listening! George
Posted on: 12 February 2014 by Loki

Just had a thought; have you ever listened to / read about Zuccarelli and 'holophonics'? He was the man behind Pink Floyd's 3D acoustic additions to their albums, most notably on The Wall and The Final Cut. It's  technique based on phase difference so is entirely compatible with stereo, but intensifies the sense of space and movement. Although billed as something more than stereo I can't help but feel that it is just a nuanced form, like the macro setting on a telephoto lens.

Posted on: 12 February 2014 by George J

Dear Loki,

 

Even more than stereo, I dislike fiddling with the phase to alter or exaggerate the directional effect!

 

As far as I am concerned stereo is a soft idea that yields no musical enhancement over good mono.

 

I accept stereo as a fact, but I do everything to mimumise its effect of falsely separating strands of music. I put my speakers as close together as possible. My ESLs have about a quarter of inch between them with absolutely no toe in. the almost completely destroys the stereo effect on stereo recordings and gets a fine effect on mono recordings!

 

If stereo were important then there would be great debates about the significance of different layouts for the players, and there simply is no debate to speak of on this.

 

Stereo was a gimmick that AD Blumlein pioneered with a view to it being used for film soundtracks. The main interest in film sound is not music.

 

Stereo being applied to music was an excuse to sell two speakers instead of one, and much more complicated pick-ups and amplifiers ...

 

A commercial drive for a system of no additional musical significance over the mono arrangement.

 

ATB from George 

Posted on: 12 February 2014 by premont
Originally Posted by George J:

 

Even more than stereo, I dislike fiddling with the phase to alter or exaggerate the directional effect!

 

As far as I am concerned stereo is a soft idea that yields no musical enhancement over good mono.

 

I accept stereo as a fact, but I do everything to mimumise its effect of falsely separating strands of music. I put my speakers as close together as possible. My ESLs have about a quarter of inch between them with absolutely no toe in. the almost completely destroys the stereo effect on stereo recordings and gets a fine effect on mono recordings!

 

 

ATB from George 


Dear George

 

I agree with you so far, that I also find the sought "stereo"- effect of spatial differentiation senseless and superfluous, and this is why I also put my two floor speakers close together. But still I think stereo has got the advantage to add a kind of ambience and presence, which is missing in mono recordings. Of course this presupposes a simple one-miking technique to be convincing, but particularly with many organ recordings, this effect may be convincing by adding something of the characteristics of the venue (the churchroom). And the church room is an important thing, which influences the impact of the organ and which every serious organbuilder must take into account, when he constructs a church organ.

 

ATB

Poul

Posted on: 13 February 2014 by bluedog
Originally Posted by Guest:
The best acoustic gramophones were made by EM Ginn, and were refered to as EMG Handmade gramophones:



The size of it is usefully shown by the man stanging next to it. [Google EMG Gramophone, for much more fascinating history]!

ATB from George

About 30 years ago I  heard an acoustic recording of Caruso played on an EMG in a shop in Hendon.  The vocal quality was uncanny and erie; it was like Caruso was in the room.  The accompanying instruments were, unsurprisingly considering the recording method, recessed and compressed. But the overall sound was remarkable.  

 

I was tempted to buy the EMG and start collecting 78's, but even 30 years ago the EMG wuld have cost £750.  I think good examples nowadays go for around £5k-£7k.

Posted on: 13 February 2014 by George J

But still better than any LP 12!

 

ATB from George

Posted on: 15 February 2014 by Loki

I've resisted replying thus far, but after a GnT my resolve has weakened. Go on George, justify that comment. ...and, it better be good!

Posted on: 15 February 2014 by Kevin-W
Originally Posted by Loki:

Just had a thought; have you ever listened to / read about Zuccarelli and 'holophonics'? He was the man behind Pink Floyd's 3D acoustic additions to their albums, most notably on The Wall and The Final Cut. It's  technique based on phase difference so is entirely compatible with stereo, but intensifies the sense of space and movement. Although billed as something more than stereo I can't help but feel that it is just a nuanced form, like the macro setting on a telephoto lens.

Loki, Hugo Zuccarelli's Holophonic technique wasn't used on The Wall, it wasn't invented in '79! However Roger Waters used it on Pros & Cons of Hitch-Hiking. Apart from its use on a Psychic TV album in 1984, it then largely fell out of use as a music recording technique, although it is used in films, theatres and theme parks.

Posted on: 15 February 2014 by George J

... and, it better be good.

 

Good.

 

ATB from George

Posted on: 15 February 2014 by Kevin-W
Originally Posted by George J:

But still better than any LP 12!

 

ATB from George

Oi! You! Outside! Now!

 

Posted on: 15 February 2014 by Loki

Loki, Hugo Zuccarelli's Holophonic technique wasn't used on The Wall, it wasn't invented in '79! 

 

Kevin you are absolutely right. You hace exposed me as a fraud! I made a supposition and Wikipedia has proven me wrong.  Apologies. I do have his 1983 LP though. remarkably good, but nothing more than carefuly recorded stereo in my opinion.