LP12 Drive Belt and vibration

Hi Phil:

Are you sure that the vibration you feel through the plinth is coming from the motor? If it is, then there's most likely a fairly serious motor mounting issue or the motor is past its prime.

If the motor is tired, a tighter belt might show up the problem more readily as it's putting more side pressure on the motor spindle. In any case, don't cheap out on the belt, - get the Linn item.

Best Regards,
Mark Dunn

Phil

how much is an LP12 belt in the US?

Rico - SM/Mullet Audio

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When I installed it, I could feel vibration when I put my hand on the plinth. I put the old belt back, and there was still vibration, though it was much less.

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This sounds like a definite problem - there should be no obvious audible or mechanical breakthrough from the motor or any other part of a LP12.

My gut feeling is that your motor is stuffed – easy way to tell would be if it still vibrates without the belt on. If it does take it to a dealer that has a known reputation for being good with LP12s (not all are).

If it passes that test stick the proper belt back (don't be a tight arse, buy a real belt!), flip the platter upside down, turn it on and watch how the belt is riding on the pulley. There is a possibility that the vibration is simply the belt riding too low or high on the pulley and catching on the plastic guide. Depending on your confidence you should either take the deck to a dealer for a full set up and service, or have a stab at doing it yourself. Download and read the LP12 setup guide at my site ( www.pinkfishmedia.co.uk ) and also the Jimmy Hughes one at Origin Live ( www.sondek-turntable.com/index.htm ) before you attempt anything – its not rocket science, but as ever knowledge is power. The thing you don’t want to find is any noise or vibration coming from the main bearing, that’s expensive!

Good luck!

Tony.

Phil:

there's a belt on Ebay. Cheap!

LP12 belt

Arthur Bye

This is like purchasing shell cordovan Allan Edmunds shoes and then looking for a used piece of string when the shoelace breaks.

Buy a new Linn belt.

Judd

It's like replacing a broken button on a John Phillips suit with a bottle cap, suitably drilled with holes.

Buy a new Linn belt.

Judd

It's like holding up the muffler on a Jaguar with a coat hanger.

Buy a new Linn belt.

Judd

A new Linn belt is £17.50 at Jeffries. I'd have thought you'd get several years out of one.

(here, press the 'products' button.)

Paul

$65 is highway robbery!!!!

Linn does it again. $65 for a rubber belt!!!!??????

I can see why he is searching for alternatives. Do you relaize that if his LP12 is just a bit more than a few years old, that represents 10% of it's total value. $65 for a belt!!!

Judd

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Originally posted by Tony Lonorgan:
This sounds like a definite problem - there should be no obvious audible or mechanical breakthrough from the motor or any other part of a LP12.

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It could be that the tighter belt has upset the motor?

Martin

Yes indeed, USD65 is clearly a rip-off. Best you buy one from a friendly UK dealer. Failing that, perhaps a UK-based forum-member might be able to help.

Still, that said - Judd's examples above are valid. Falls in with "you play, you pay". Still - USD65? They're having a laugh. Imagine how many they could pack into a cubic metre - frieght costs would not be significant.

Oh gawd, here we go: How much for a mat?

Perhaps Linn's strategy is to price LP12 ownership to such a level that CD12 ownership seems a logical step, especially given lower "total cost of ownership".

Rico - SM/Mullet Audio

I purchased a used LP12 recently and the seller was kind enough to include one of those substitute Linn belts from ebay in the deal.

I have since taken the LP12 to my dealer for a service, and first thing he told me when I took it back was that he had to replace the belt, because with the one on the turntable (the new one from ebay) it was impossible to achieve the correct speed.

So, there is probably no alternative to the genuine item. It did cost me somewhere around 30 Euro, nowhere near 65 $.

Someone must have a old belt they could send Phil so he could at least try an alternative.

When my LP12 is going it is absolutely silent. You cannot tell whether the motor is running by touching the plinth or by listening. If this is not the case you have some problem.

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Someone must have a old belt they could send Phil so he could at least try an alternative.

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I have a couple of old ones, my LP12 came with three, I just used what looked like the best one, though have a new one on order. You are welcome to one if you want, though I would just land a new one if I were you (I've been out of work for 5 bloody months now, and I can still run to a new belt!).

Tony.

Hi Phil,
does your LP12 have a Lingo or a Valhalla fitted.
If it's a Valhalla it is most likely to be the main capacitors which smooths the power to the motor's phase .
They can leak after a few years making the motor oscillate causing vibration through the belt.
I can't guarantee this is the problem so I would recommend you to speak to your local Linn dealer and get an accurate diagnosis.

Regards
Jason Gould
Naim UK Sales.

Gee, the last time I had contact with Linn they sent me a belt for free ! Just lucky, I guess.

$65 - the words "rip" and "off" spring to mind.

Apparently the belt also has a right way/wrong way inside/out, if you get my meaning. Any comments on that from anyone ?

Team

Sounds good to me.

Thanks all for the comments. The last price I had for a new belt - this is Chicago, and the main dealer closed a while ago - was $75. That's a lot more than UKP 17.50, and I'm glad I'm not the only one who senses rip off.

Surely Linn doesn't make its own belts. Does anyone know Linn's source?

Further investigation indicates that my initial 'test' was during start-up. After the speed stabilizes, I can feel only a very, very slight sensation when I place a finger between the power button and the platter - but there is a difference between power on and off. Of course, wit the 'replacement' belt of unknown origin, the spurious vibration continues during normal play.

I have another LP12 in my care at present. This was adjusted last summer. I swear there is some difference between power on and off when I place a finger between the button and the platter.

My tentative conclusion is that the vibration is not unexpected, since there's a lot of mass rotating.

Any UK LP12 dealers on the forum who'd like to export an LP12 belt? If so, e-mail me privately. Thanks.

Phil

Phil and all:

At this point in time, after my recent LP12 bearing fiasco (sic), no-one likes to see a good drubbing of Linn more than I.

However, the going rate for a new LP12 belt is around $27 here in the US. If a dealer is charging $65 then he's made a "mistake".

Best Regards,
Mark Dunn

Hi,

I have a used one (look quite OK!!). Let me know your address and I'll send it by US Post Office directly from sunny Puerto Rico!!!

I'm almost sure that the vibration is caused by a faulty capacitor (3 big ones on the Valhalla board, either 33uf 250v or 47uf 250v). Just replace them with a higher voltage rating (350v?). I just did that on my Valhalla and its working like a charm!!!

REMEMBER TO UNPLUG THE LP!@ FROM MAINS BEFORE PERFORMING ANY SERVICING, VOLTAGE MAY BE AS HIGH AS 300V!!!

Victor

Victor V. Diaz-Diaz

Oops!!!

REMEMBER TO UNPLUG THE LP12 FROM MAINS BEFORE PERFORMING ANY SERVICING, VOLTAGE MAY BE AS HIGH AS 300V!!!

Victor V. Diaz-Diaz

quote:

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Further investigation indicates that my initial 'test' was during start-up. After the speed stabilizes, I can feel only a very, very slight sensation when I place a finger between the power button and the platter - but there is a difference between power on and off. Of course, wit the 'replacement' belt of unknown origin, the spurious vibration continues during normal play.

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Sounds to me as though your 'replacement belt of unknown origin' continues to rub the belt guide/grounding bracket long past its initial dip down (aka clutch phase), rather than riding back up to the correct running diameter of the motor drive pulley (if in fact it isn't just continuously riding high due to tightness).

Try placing the decks outer platter on upside down (with felt mat and a crap record resting on top) and watch the belt action during startup. Even a worn original belt will generally ride back up correctly after its initial clutch dip. An non spec belt and/or improperly aligned motor/suspension will cause the belt not to run the correct path round the pulley leading to such symptoms as rubbing noise, belt de-railment, excessive motor wear and improper running speed.

I would agree that, with the LP12 especially, there is no substitute for original replacement parts especially wrt the belt.

BTW, one should feel slight vibration in the stainless top plate of an LP12 during normal running as this plate is, by design, intended to sink motor vibration away from the critical record/stylus interface and into the plinth/support.

A Lingo'd Sondek will sink much less motor vibration into the top plate than a Valhalla or Basik powered deck as the motor is 'driven' more quietly at a lower 'optimum' voltage level with more accurate transitioning between AC phases.

Craig

PS. Don't mess with the Valhalla board! It can kill you!!

[This message was edited by Craig Best on MONDAY 08 July 2002 at 22:25.]

Craig,

I believe that what you describe - the sinking of motor vibration - is exactly what I'm noticing.

I'd never checked it before, because I had no reason to. The new 'replacement' belt seem stiffer than the correct one, so I checked it pretty carefully. Rest assured that it has not seen much use on my table - about a minute.

When I got the Cirkus 6 years ago, I got 2 belts. I used the first one for 2-3 years and replaced it with the spare while keeping the old one. Slow starup and speed variation came to bother me, so I went looking for a new belt, when the $65 price scared me off. I'm using the old belt, and it's much better!

Obviously I just have to store the 'bad' belt for 3 years, and it'll be good as new! Or find a new belt at the right price....

Regards.

Phil

I have an old belt that might at least give you a chance to test your LP12,, and as I'm down town Chicago I'm not too far away from you.

Let me know if you are interested.

Le Chef