Who'd you rather? NDX vs Akurate DS
Posted by: Obsessed1 on 04 November 2010
I'm looking to add a better streamer to the big rig in the living room (currently using Sonos and Lavry DAC). As per title, is there any reason I should be looking at NDX over Akurate DS, or vice versa?
Obviously, it would be nice to try both at home and decide, but this will not be possible with my local dealers. So, sound quality aside (which will be subjective - and few NDX currently available), what about features?
Other important bits: Music will be streamed from an N-Serve (1TB) hooked into the network in the den via a gigabit switch into an Airport Extreme. I will NOT be able to hard wire either NDX or Akurate into the network.
Obviously, it would be nice to try both at home and decide, but this will not be possible with my local dealers. So, sound quality aside (which will be subjective - and few NDX currently available), what about features?
Other important bits: Music will be streamed from an N-Serve (1TB) hooked into the network in the den via a gigabit switch into an Airport Extreme. I will NOT be able to hard wire either NDX or Akurate into the network.
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by gone
In the short term, it's probably going to be difficult to answer that one, as the availability of NDX on demo is limited, and I really think you should listen to both before deciding. There are several on this forum using ADS with a 552 preamp with good results.
The ADS has recently been updated (and is, I believe, a bit more expensive as a result) but accounts so far suggest a further improvement in SQ. I hope to get my ears round one in a couple of weeks.
The ADS has recently been updated (and is, I believe, a bit more expensive as a result) but accounts so far suggest a further improvement in SQ. I hope to get my ears round one in a couple of weeks.
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by Eloise
In terms of features, the NDX will allow you to control a Naim preamp (volume, etc) from the nStream app. The NDX also features digital inputs which may be of use depending on your setup. The (at least first generation) ADS doesn't have these.
Eloise
Eloise
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by jlarsson
If you have the system in a typical livingroom then the NDX has digital inputs so its DAC can be re-used for other digital sources. Like an AppleTV2 which also will enable wireless airplay from mac/ipad/iphone. And the NDX can be upgraded by adding boxes - no need to start all-over.
Last time I looked & listened the Linn product was a very closed box. And ugly :-)
Last time I looked & listened the Linn product was a very closed box. And ugly :-)
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by David Dever
quote:I will NOT be able to hard wire either NDX or Akurate into the network.
Sort this out first before you start making decisions based on sound quality–seriously, you won't be able to connect the Akurate DS as it has no built-in Wi-Fi. Wired connection sounds better regardless of manufacturer, sorry.
Get the basics right, first, and the rest will follow.
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by David Dever
quote:The NDX also features digital inputs which may be of use depending on your setup. The (at least first generation) ADS doesn't have these.
The mkII version of the Akurate DS is also free of digital inputs, but it does have a 75Ω BNC digital output.
The connectivity on the NDX includes USB file playback as well as iPod digital streaming–the Linn DS range lacks these features.
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by AMA
quote:the NDX will allow you to control a Naim preamp (volume, etc) from the nStream app.
Eloise, does Naim Serve allow the same?
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by AMA
quote:Wired connection sounds better regardless of manufacturer, sorry.
David, many of us do seriously take on your comments.
Are you sure about this one?
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by T38.45
...so we're talking about Linn mkII Akurate vs NDX but no one here listen to both systems? cool, nnnnnerds *g*
ralf
ralf
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by Tog
quote:Originally posted by AMA:quote:Wired connection sounds better regardless of manufacturer, sorry.
David, many of us do seriously take on your comments.
Are you sure about this one?
What he said -
Tog
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by AMA
quote:Originally posted by Tog:quote:Originally posted by AMA:quote:Wired connection sounds better regardless of manufacturer, sorry.
David, many of us do seriously take on your comments.
Are you sure about this one?
What he said -
Tog
There is a number of people around who explicitly claim they don't pick up the difference between wired and wireless connection. Shall we call them deaf?
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by AMA
quote:...so we're talking about Linn mkII Akurate vs NDX but no one here listen to both systems? cool, nnnnnerds *g*
ralf
Not at all -- we're conducting a fruitful discussion about David's impression on NDX
Actually if you read OP attentively he is not about SQ.
He is after the features which are all known for the both gears.
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by likesmusic
So the wireless bit of the NDX doesn't sound as good as the wired bit? Oh dear me. More progress!
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by David Dever
quote:Originally posted by AMA:quote:Wired connection sounds better regardless of manufacturer, sorry.
David, many of us do seriously take on your comments.
Are you sure about this one?
You should take them with a grain of salt, really–but it's hard to stream wirelessly to a device that doesn't have wireless connectivity (Akurate DS mk II)!
It's obvious to most that wired connection is preferred to wireless for a wide variety of reasons, let alone network bandwidth -> buffer size -> sound quality. If you don't hear a difference, don't worry about it–you've probably got a good enough wireless network as regards bandwidth.
It's the "on-the-edge" situations where this should be pretty clear cut.
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by Obsessed1
Good to know that the Linn does not support wireless. This is exactly why I asked the question.
Now, could I solve the wireless problem in my case by using an apple Airport Express? If this would actually work, would there be any benefit to using the airport with the NDX instead of relying on the NDX wireless capabilities?
Thanks for the other replies. One other benefit of the NDX seems to me to be the USB connection to an ipod (great for parties - bring your ipod and we can plug it in and listen to your fav tunes).
Now, could I solve the wireless problem in my case by using an apple Airport Express? If this would actually work, would there be any benefit to using the airport with the NDX instead of relying on the NDX wireless capabilities?
Thanks for the other replies. One other benefit of the NDX seems to me to be the USB connection to an ipod (great for parties - bring your ipod and we can plug it in and listen to your fav tunes).
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by David Dever
quote:Now, could I solve the wireless problem in my case by using an apple Airport Express?
On the edge, methinks–but every wireless environment is different and (I must stress) any efforts on your part to make a wireless network work properly are wholly independent of the player's ability to stream wirelessly in the first place–in other words, don't blame the NDX if your wireless network is sub-par.
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by Eloise
Ideally you want to use a wired networking between the NAS and the NDX (or ADS). However this doesn't mean you have to run wired connection back to your router...
If you can find somewhere you can locate your NAS and run cable to the location of the NDX then put a wireless bridge / 4 port hub with the NAS. That way you get te best of both: wired NAS to NDX plus Wireless back to your Internet router / other computers on network.
Eloise
If you can find somewhere you can locate your NAS and run cable to the location of the NDX then put a wireless bridge / 4 port hub with the NAS. That way you get te best of both: wired NAS to NDX plus Wireless back to your Internet router / other computers on network.
Eloise
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by gone
quote:Originally posted by Obsessed1:
Good to know that the Linn does not support wireless. This is exactly why I asked the question.
Now, could I solve the wireless problem in my case by using an apple Airport Express? If this would actually work, would there be any benefit to using the airport with the NDX instead of relying on the NDX wireless capabilities?
Thanks for the other replies. One other benefit of the NDX seems to me to be the USB connection to an ipod (great for parties - bring your ipod and we can plug it in and listen to your fav tunes).
An ADS will work fine with an Airport Express. All this FUD about wireless networking is unnecessary. There is no difference between wired and wireless if it's all working properly. I don't know about the NDX but the Linn solutions seem to handle dropouts in a very civilised manner, if there is a chance it happens. I can stream video and photos to an iPad while listening to music wirelessly with no problems.
YMMV but let's not cloud the SQ issue unnecessarily
Cheers
John
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by pcstockton
quote:I will NOT be able to hard wire either NDX or Akurate into the network.
That makes the decision VERY easy. ADS does not have WIFI capability.
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by pcstockton
quote:An ADS will work fine with an Airport Express. All this FUD about wireless networking is unnecessary. There is no difference between wired and wireless if it's all working properly.
What a joke. You suggest the OP use an unreliable, jitter-tacular, cheap, wireless "router" with an $18,000 streamer?
I cannot get reliable performance with an Airport even when used with exclusively with iTunes on a iMac. Drop outs galore.
-Patrick
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by Guido Fawkes
Not sure why that is - I don't suffer from drop outs and use an Airport Extreme like you for WiFi. Mine only serves one device at a time usually: mostly my MacBook Pro.quote:I cannot get reliable performance with an Airport even when used with exclusively with iTunes on a iMac. Drop outs galore.
I heard the original ADS - hence stuck with MacBook/hiFace.
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by pcstockton
quote:The mkII version of the Akurate DS is also free of digital inputs, but it does have a 75Ω BNC digital output.
Interesting.... That is a decisive move away from the whole "single box" thing they have going on.
Attention ADS owners! I would love to see if the Naim DAC can improve on the ADS internal.
-Patrick
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by Tog
All the better to sell you more boxes with pretentious Celtic sounding names.
KlaTog
KlaTog
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by likesmusic
quote:Originally posted by Tog:
All the better to sell you more boxes with pretentious Celtic sounding names.
KlaTog
errr ... but not power supplies to power a £2k DAC that draws negligbile current, not to mention wickedly expensive mains leads for the
same two boxes, or even shelves .. with pretentiously rhyming naims.
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by AMA
quote:It's obvious to most that wired connection is preferred to wireless for a wide variety of reasons, let alone network bandwidth -> buffer size -> sound quality. If you don't hear a difference, don't worry about it–you've probably got a good enough wireless network as regards bandwidth.
Hi, David -- that's what's happening with my home wi-fi connection through Logitech Transporter.
I did the check and found that wi-fi vs wired is indistinguishable for my ears.
My only suggestion is to create individual wi-fi network for audio to avoid re-buffering.
BTW TP has an excellent wi-fi receiver with two 90 degrees anthenas.
While years pass over I'm still amazed how good is this gear comparing to what's coming on to the market today.
Posted on: 05 November 2010 by Aleg
quote:Originally posted by likesmusic:
... but not power supplies to power a £2k DAC that draws negligbile current, ....
I bet you've never heard the Naim DAC without and with PSU's
-
aleg